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Author Topic: .223 vs. 5.56mm  (Read 1179 times)

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Offline djw

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.223 vs. 5.56mm
« on: March 06, 2007, 05:51:48 AM »
Hey all,

Didn't know where else to put this question, so here goes.

In another thread here, somebody said they'd pick a .223 for a bug-out gun, because "in a pinch" they could use 5.56.

I thought they were interchangeable, but this makes it sound as if that is not optimal.  I'm especially curious because I've got both types of ammo on the shelf.

What are the differences?

Thanks.

Don
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2007, 06:02:29 AM »
If you google 5.56 NATO .223 Remington, you'll get a bunch of info, here's one...

http://www.thegunzone.com/556v223.html

.223 Handis/Ultras come with a warning notice NOT to shoot .5.56 ammo in it. Right click it and save it, then open it, easy to read then.


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Offline djw

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2007, 06:21:24 AM »
Quick,
Thanks for the response.  Important info.  Now I just need to check if my mini-14 indicates .223 or 5.56. Hopefully the latter.
As I understand it, the cases are the same, so if I were to reload to the .223 spec, it would be fine to shoot in either "chambering".
Don
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Offline skifastchad

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2007, 06:25:27 AM »
The article above says a 5.56 nato will stick in a civilian .223 chamber?  I thought 5.56 brass had a .251" neck diameter while 223rem had a .253" neck.  I was under the assumption that the nato was sized slightly smaller to ease loading in dirty rifles.

They are also saying that our beloved Winchester White Box is really lake city 5.56 ammo?   Ill have to get out the micrometer and check some different factory loads for neck diameter.
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Offline stimpylu32

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2007, 06:56:57 AM »
There are a few diffrences to the 5.56 Vs 223 , the 5.56 has a slightly longer neck than the 223 and they also op. at diffrent pressures .

Here is a thread about this very thing from the reloading forum that may help .

http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/smf/index.php/topic,112959.0.html

stimpy
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2007, 06:59:17 AM »
Quote from: skifastchad on March 06, 2007, 06:25:27 AM
rifles.

They are also saying that our beloved Winchester White Box is really lake city 5.56 ammo?   

That's just for the 55gr FMJ, the 45gr JHP that is the gold standard for .223 Handis, is headstamped Win .223 Rem.

Tim
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Offline OR-E-Gun Bill

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2007, 09:13:13 AM »
Quote from: djw on March 06, 2007, 06:21:24 AM
Quick,
Thanks for the response.  Important info.  Now I just need to check if my mini-14 indicates .223 or 5.56. Hopefully the latter.
As I understand it, the cases are the same, so if I were to reload to the .223 spec, it would be fine to shoot in either "chambering".
Don

From my Ruger Mini-14 Manual:
"Mini-14 Rifles are chambered for the .223 Remington (5.56mm military) cartridge and are designed to use either standardized U. S. Military, or factory loaded sporting .223 (5.56mm) cartridges manufactured in accordance with U. S. industry practice."


Bill 
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Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2007, 03:19:41 PM »
I would think that would be a good thing for you. ;D
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Offline mt3030

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2007, 06:21:08 PM »
The NATO profile(long)/pressure combined with the SAMMI leade(short) is the problem. Have a 'Smith run a Wylde reamer in there and have the best of everything.
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Offline mt3030

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2007, 09:40:08 PM »
Quote from: stimpylu32 on March 06, 2007, 06:56:57 AM
....the 5.56 has a slightly longer neck than the 223....
Same case exterior dimensions, including neck (That's why we reload them both with the same dies). Same max case lenght, same trim-to length. It's the Leade.
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Offline MZ5

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2007, 04:21:11 PM »
Quote
Same case exterior dimensions, including neck...

Really?  While I absolutely agree that it's the leade and pressure differences that cause the issues, it is interesting to me that the case dimensions would be the same since the chamber dimensions are not (quite).  NATO chamber reamers average slightly different base diameter and base-to-shoulder lengths than .223 Remington reamers.  See the chamber reamer measurements at www.ar15barrels.com/data/223-556.pdf
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Offline mt3030

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2007, 06:55:36 PM »
Quote from: MZ5 on March 07, 2007, 04:21:11 PM
....average slightly different base diameter and base-to-shoulder lengths than .223 Remington reamers...
Minor differences which are always present between various reamer manufacturers. As for the answer to the question that started this thread: Its the Leade and pressure.
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Offline stimpylu32

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2007, 08:07:59 AM »
mt3030

You are right i ment to say leade not neck , oops brain fart , i have shot some 5.56 in my 223 handi , they will shoot but do not do what i wanted them to do as far as groups go , kinda hit and miss so to speak .

stimpy
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Offline greyling

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Re: .223 vs. 5.56mm
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2007, 07:18:05 AM »
I shot a bunch of 5.56 through mine because hey, it was free. worked fine, but the brass is thicker, or something because when I reloaded them I full legnth sized them and tried to put in 26.5 grn of varget and it wouldn't fit. so I went to 26 and they work fine. I get about 3050-3100 fps. as a side note, my buddy's bushmaster ar-15 is really hard on the brass.
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