Author Topic: Black Powder in a Pardner (Read 2791 times)

Swampman · « **on:** January 25, 2009, 01:29:06 PM »

These guys show you how to shoot loose components in your Pardner.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QAx6ERkW0A&feature=channel

brennemanj83 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 25, 2009, 01:59:33 PM »

very interesting.thanks for the link.

Spanky · « **Reply #2 on:** January 25, 2009, 02:52:20 PM »

Thanks Swampman.

Spanky

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #3 on:** January 26, 2009, 06:43:42 AM »

I watched it but don't get the point of it I guess. Why not just take the empty hull and handload it the same way then you could load up a few extra and not have to carry all the componets with you

Kurt

Swampman · « **Reply #4 on:** January 26, 2009, 07:45:47 AM »

This is a last ditch SHTF technique. I think it's brilliant myself.

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #5 on:** January 26, 2009, 11:26:43 AM »

I still think it would be easier if ya just stuffed it all in the hull then put it in the gun rather than dumping it down the bbl.But then if you was down to your last hull in the world and it was split you would have no other choice. ;)Kurt

MSP Ret · « **Reply #6 on:** January 26, 2009, 02:49:58 PM »

I enjoyed his other youtube video of the .410 with 5" cut off the barrel to eliminate the choke and get down to where the barrel was.450 +/- and he and his son shot .45 LC's out of it as well as a .40 cal lead ball loaded into a .410 shotgun hull. He also mentioned shooting .44 Mags from the same gun as well as factory .410's and reloaded .410 shells. He did show loading .410's in the field in already fired hulls. Very handy if it ever gets to that....<><....

P.S. it is a youtube video by him titled .410/.45 conversion.....very interesting...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upF0a8qLdII&feature=channel

brennemanj83 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 07, 2009, 08:29:08 AM »

Well I tried the black powder in my 12ga that has a 19'' barrel with no choke.I done it the way he showed in the video with 100grs of Pyrodex and and the same volume of #6 lead shot.Had very mild recoil and actually patterned better that way than it does shooting Federal High Brass #6 game loads.Now if only I can figure out away to mak breach plug and turn it in to a true muzzle loading shotgun.

Swampman · « **Reply #8 on:** February 07, 2009, 09:42:43 AM »

That's what I'd like to do.

Markus · « **Reply #9 on:** February 09, 2009, 07:39:41 AM »

Just keep your eyes out for an old 12ga huntsman.

kycrawler · « **Reply #10 on:** February 11, 2009, 01:07:09 PM »

i made a few press fit stainless inserts to use in a 12 gauge nef single shot basically it is a press in breech plug that is threaded for a nipple they fill the whole chamber and bump it up to bore dia to make cleaning easier they can be knocked out from the muzzle end with a brass rod if they ever need to be removed , i suppose you could make them slip fit and install with an epoxy

never did come up with a good way to carry a ram rod to hunt with one though

shootercochran · « **Reply #11 on:** February 12, 2009, 07:53:31 AM »

Will it work with low brass bases? I was wondering why he didn't use a regular plastic wad and a styrofoam over shot wad. You can make your own. It wouldn't work with a full choke but a modified would work fine. You could get pretty good paterns too.

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #12 on:** March 22, 2009, 06:00:16 PM »

Here it is Aaron. Kurt

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #13 on:** March 22, 2009, 06:40:03 PM »

Just be careful when you start doing this as he was using 100gr black powder. You will want to use substitutes that are equivelant and that is not 100gr. Take your time working up good loads. Kurt

fistmil · « **Reply #14 on:** March 28, 2009, 02:25:54 PM »

I have been reloading my H&R 410 with 40gr 2f black powder and 40gr #5 shot for years. I have also reloaded 40gr black powder and a patched .380 round ball. The ball is patched to make it fit tight in the hull. I don't crimp the shell closed when shooting the round ball.
The .380 ball fits through the full choke fine. The gun is an older topper model. It had a semi-pistol grip stock that was chipped so I cut it to a straight stock. I also added iron sights and a barrel band w/swivel. I looks more like a cavalry carbine than a shotgun.

Markus · « **Reply #15 on:** March 28, 2009, 02:55:31 PM »

Fistmil post of pic of that gun if you get a chance.

fistmil · « **Reply #16 on:** March 28, 2009, 04:22:00 PM »

Markus, I'll post pictures as soon as I get my camera back . I forgot it at work.

Rustyinfla · « **Reply #17 on:** March 28, 2009, 06:04:46 PM »

It shows you what can be done doesn't it?

Cookiemann · « **Reply #18 on:** March 29, 2009, 03:31:14 AM »

Someone out there with the right tools needs to test this theory of the 410 and post the results here.
WITH A DISCLAIMER

How big is the chamber on a standard Pardner 410?

How big is the bore of a standard Pardner 410?
Is the barrel tapered on the inside, down to the choke?
Is the choked muzzle 410 or smaller?

These are all questions, IMHO, that need to be answered before you would even attempt to fire a 45lc out of a Pardner 410.

Just my 2cents

cookiemann

MSP Ret · « **Reply #19 on:** March 29, 2009, 05:45:18 AM »

In his post about a .45 out of a .410 barrel it was mentioned he cut the barrel back far enough (until) it mic'ed/measured large enough (at least .450) to safely shoot .45's out of it. He does not advocate shooting .45's out of a standard .410 shotgun barrel. Cutting the barrel back until you got a proper dimension was an important, but perhaps too lightly stressed part of the video....<><....

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #20 on:** March 29, 2009, 09:34:51 AM »

I did a very unscientific just want to see... I dropped a .429 bullet down the chamber of 2 of my 410's one a tamer 20" and the other an old topper the bullet would not go past the forcing cone in either I did not force it. I sure would of thought a 44 bullet would of worked I got a box of 41mag ammo but don't want to wreck a round to try any body got a 41 mag bullet to try? Kurt

brennemanj83 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 29, 2009, 09:57:38 AM »

Here is some info I found on choke diameters awhile back.A full choke 410 measures around .395'' and I have a round ball mold here that drops a .390 round ball which most likelywould do well in a 410.

http://www.colonialarms.com/pdf-files/page7.pdf

fistmil · « **Reply #22 on:** March 30, 2009, 04:01:50 PM »

Markus, here is a photo of my 410/carbine.

Rustyinfla · « **Reply #23 on:** March 30, 2009, 06:07:50 PM »

IIRC can't .444 Marlin brass be used in a .410 shotgun? I think it just ends up being a little shorter.

I have some brass Magtech shells for my 12 ga. I just have never gotten around to loading them yet. I found them on a close out sale so I thought I'd get them. I was surprised when I got them home to find out that they use a regular large pistol primer instead of a 209 primer.

brennemanj83 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 30, 2009, 06:20:30 PM »

Quote from: Rustyinfla on March 30, 2009, 06:07:50 PM

IIRC can't .444 Marlin brass be used in a .410 shotgun? I think it just ends up being a little shorter.

I have some brass Magtech shells for my 12 ga. I just have never gotten around to loading them yet. I found them on a close out sale so I thought I'd get them. I was surprised when I got them home to find out that they use a regular large pistol primer instead of a 209 primer.

Rusty....Yes you can use 444 Marlin brass for 410's.If you want full 3'' you can use 9.3x74 Rimmed brass....if you can find it.

Jack Ryan · « **Reply #25 on:** June 20, 2009, 10:28:53 PM »

Dont forget black powder charges are in volume, NOT WEIGHT.

Swampman · « **Reply #26 on:** November 24, 2011, 03:21:51 AM »

Here's a new video with Dave Canterbury.

[embed=425,349]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ES59LtA7XE8[/embed]

tacklebury · « **Reply #27 on:** November 24, 2011, 03:49:09 AM »

.45LC's were used for many years back in my grand dad's day and my dad's even. As long as you use soft lead it will exit the bore without issue in their findings. I have the old narrow frame .410 my dad and grand dad shot them with and there's no issues in the barrel. It's a circa 1926 firearm that was the first one my Grandpa bought himself. It will cause issues with jacketed bullets though, so don't do it.

You can fireform .444 Marlin brass w/ cream of wheat loads to create heavy duty .410 hulls and these can easily push a decent lead out. With a full choke you want the slug to swage slightly through the bore or you don't get much accuracy. Much like Remington Sluggers do. Just make sure your slugs are pure or very soft lead formulations. Several I've talked to used up to .41 caliber pistol bullets also.

Steel shot cups can be used to hold smaller diameter also and keep them centered in the bore.