Shockwave disappointed/answer

[Cuts Crooked]

As I mentioned in another thread this is my first year using Shockwaves. The accuracy is great but I didn't know how it would perform on deer insofar as terminal affects. Others seem very pleased with them so I wasn't concerned.

However.......yesterday one of my hunting buddies dropped a big doe using a 250 gr Shockwave in his Knight, pushed by 90 grains of 3F. Long tracking job, fortunately in snow! Poste mortum revealed: A quartering towards shot striking over the right shoulder, nicked a big artery over the heart, we found a piece of the yellow polymer in the meat just at the entry point, slug passed through body cavity and was found under the hide on the left rear ham.....unexpanded!!!!!! The "petals" were folded INWARD around most of the circumfrence of the nose and one quarter of them was barely deformed at all. Essentially, the slug traveresed the length of the does body with absolutely no expansion! Had it notcipped the artery that doe would probably not been recovered

Oh yeah... the shot was at about 50 yards, and temps were in the low teens.

This has me concerned. I'm shooting the same bullet over 120 grains of 2F and getting good accuracy, but I would hope for better terminal ballistics than that!

[builder459]

Thier are a lot of reviews on the internet where other people have the same problem.i shoot the barnes TEZ bullets and have read the same thing about them,usually at shorter ranges.i am going to buy some SSB buffalo bullets and see how they shoot in my triumph. they come in 285.325& 375 gr.pure lead is the ticket at all yardages and angles.i would be sick if i was to loose a deer over a bullet not expanding.

[simonkenton]

Are y'all shooting the bonded shockwave?
With the regular shockwave I would be surprised that you are having this problem.

I shoot the Savage, I am cranking out 2,300 fps with that bullet. Us Savage guys have the opposite problem, too much expansion with the  250 Shockwave/SST.

One fix would be to try the Hornady 250 XTP, with that hollow point you are going to get expansion.

[Buckskins & Black Powder]

switch bullets to a barnes or a thor conical. These copper bullets open up beautifully.

[pozoutdoors]

It has to be a fluke. That is the only bullet I use here in Iowa!! It performs perfectly!!! I had the same shot and I put another in the deer I shot too. But if I gave her time she wouldn't have gone far!!! These bullets do some damage!!!! The .50 and an sst in my go-to gun for hunting here in Iowa!!! That is what I rely on for most of my deer hunting because it is reliable and works way beyond shotgun range!!!!!!!

[Busta]

Im with Pozoutdoors, fluke, or his charge drew some moisture and was the bullet wasn't moving very fast.

How long was his rifle loaded?

Was it taken in and out of the cold?

Did he have the muzzle covered?

My bet is the powder was compromised. I second that if using 90 gr of Black, the XTP would be a better choice at the lower velocity.

Unless your charge has been compromised, I wouldn't worry a bit about it with a 120 gr charge.

I have shot the 200, 250, and 300 Shockwave/SST's, never had a deer go over 60 yards, and some went straight down.

[youthpastorjon]

I am not a big fan of shockwaves.  In fact, I have about 12 of them I am considering putting on the pay it forward post.  For one, those sabots seem impossible to load.  I want a quick second shot if need be.  Maybe it is just me but I can't stand using that much force for a second shot.  Sure, you should not need a second shot but I always do a just-in-case reload.

[Cuts Crooked]

These are not the bonded shockwaves we are using. HIs gun was loaded that morning and had not brought in out of the cold. He was using the same brand of powder I use (Schutzen), and I was close enough to him at the shot that I would have noticed a "squib" shot from damp powder by the sound of the shot. He states that the shot "felt right", in that he felt really good about his shot placement and he noted nothing unusual about the recoil at the moment.

I donno...maybe a fluke, but it has wrecked my confidence in this bullet. My gun is presently zeroed with this one so I'll continue using it for the rest of the season. But when season is over I'm going to rezero with XTPs and stay with them!

[Redhawk1]

I have kill a bunch of deer with the T/C shockwave, and the bonded shockwave. Very good performance on all the bullets.

[DennyRoark]

Cuts...last year I shot a 250gr SW into a 5G bucket of mason sand at 100 yds with 80gr of Pyro RS (that was the most accurate load I could get with my Omega X-7), as I was concerned about expansion with that low of a charge.  Bullet expanded exactly like the few I have removed from deer.  They don't expand as much as I'd like, but all have been the same pretty much and deadly on deer.  Anything over 80gr seems to shoot thru at 100 yards or more.  I also shot some Parker Jacketed Hydra-cons at the same load and they expanded about twice as big.  Both the Omega and my Disc XT love the Hydra-Con bullets.  Used the H-C to hunt with this year with 110gr of Pyro and, wow, knocked one down at 50, got up and ran about 20 yds and done(front to back pass thru).  The other at 165 ran about 25.  Both pass thru's.  I also have recovered a couple of 240gr XTP's, and if I didn't know which was which(XTP/SW), you almost couldn't tell them apart.  To those who have doubts about SW's I highly recommend trying the Parker Jacketed Hydra-Con.  I'm sold.....

Also, Mr. Parker is very easy to deal with and totally honest.  I had a problem with my order and he personally called me and made it right.

[hunt-m-up]

I've only killed a couple with the Shockwave 300grn over 100 grns of T7, but they dropped inside of 20 yards. I do like the Barnes bullets and they make big holes, but they load hard so I went to the EZ glide Shockwaves and like them.
If you're happy with the XTP's there's no reason to mess with a successful load if you have concerns about the Shockwaves. Funny how we like to mess with success sometimes, I'm way guilty of that.

[alsaqr]

I've killed about 15 deer and over 40 hogs using the 250 grain SST bullet.  Most of those kills were bang flops and no animal was lost after being hit.  At least ten of those hogs went over 250 pounds.  

This bullet fell out of a 120 pound sow that I shot at a laser transit measured 192 yards.  The powder charge was 90 grains of JSG.  The bullet broke two ribs going in and shredded theheart, diaphragm and  lungs.   It expanded perfectly.  The bullet now weighs 167 grains.  I doubt that bullet was traveling much over 1,000 fps when it hit that sow.  

The boar in the picture was killed on 13 December, 09.  He was hit at a distance of just over 120 yards using the 250 grain SST.  My Encore was loaded with 110 grains of 3F Goex Pinnacle.  The hog was hit low behind the shoulder.  He took off, ran about 75 yards and fell over dead. 

IME:  Put the 250 grain SST/Shockwave bullet where it supposed to and it will do its job.  It works for me and I will not change.  

[DennyRoark]

here are some of my shockwaves.  L to R:  250gr/80gr SW 100yd sandtrap; 250gr/90gr SW from deer qtring away at 25 yds, went thru like a pinball, recovered from base of skull (DRT); 250gr/90gr at 75 yds qtring away under hide at opposite shoulder;  180gr XTP .45 sabot/90gr at 75 yds qtring away under hide at opposite shoulder; and bottom the 250gr Hydra-Con/80gr from the 100 yd sand trap.   Really, none of these bullets were moving that fast.  At least 7 more complete pass thru's.  My wife shot one at 150 yds last year with a 250 SW/80gr that broke the front leg bone and got both lungs and pass thru.  That one went 200+ yds.  I doubt that bullet opened up either.

[Cuts Crooked]

I think I have found the reason the Shockwave failed to expand in my hunting buddies deer.

When we unloaded our guns after this mornings hunt I picked up the bullet pushed out of his bore, along with mine. I immediately noticed a deep ring around the expansion grooves, just below the polymer tip on the bullet from his gun. This was not present on the bullet pushed out of my bore. I then looked at his ramrod and placed the bullet in the jag to compare the ring....perfect match. His rod tip has a cone for loading spire points, but it is too small and sets against the SW just below the polymer but still above the bottom of the expansion grooves. When seated with any force this is crushing a small ring around the groove area. This very well could be what stopped the bullet from expanding when it hit the deer earlier this week. On the recovered bullet the nose is crushed inward to about the point where the ring is located on the unfired bullet.

My ramrod tip has a more open cone in the jag and doesn't leave this ring impressed in the gilding metal! 

[Semisane]

Thanks for that follow-up Cuts Crooked.  I think you may have solved the mystery.  It would seem like a crimp at the tip would have to effect expansion.

[mirage1988]

Thanks too from me, bullet performance on game is such an imperfect science with every shot being a bit different that all results both positive and negative are appreciated when choosing a bullet.

[DennyRoark]

It seems to me the sand trap bullets expand more and more predicably, but was suprised at the results with the lower charge!  I've got a cheap-shot the went thru a deer front to back at 15 yds (70gr Pyro RS) that hardly opened up.  I'll stick to softer lead and jacketed bullets for hunting!

[AndyHass]

That is a very interesting finding, I wonder how many bad experiences this may explain?  I've always used a spin jag (mostly 200SWs) and had nothing but excellent luck at impact velocities from 2000 fps to under 1000 fps.

[rhood34]

Never had any problems with shockwaves. My guess is fluke.