Uberti rolling block carbine

[navygunner]

Uberti has brought out the remington rolling block in 45/70 anybody owned or fired one yet?
NG

[bcp]

At 4.5 pounds, I don't want to.

http://www.uberti.com/firearms/1871_rolling_block_hunter_carbine.php


Bruce

[Nobade]

Egads, that looks like their little #4 action! I wonder if they took that action and scaled it up, or are just putting way too big barrels on the one they already have? I don't know what they are thinking, this year they make that rifle and also are chambering the 1873 lever gun in 44 mag. A very poor idea.

[navygunner]

Bruce,
    I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed that light weight. Would have to kick like a Missouri jackass.

NG

[Lurker]

That might be a nice carbine in .30-30 or .38-55. In .45-70, that thing would kill on both ends...!

Bill

[kevinsmith5]

30-30 sounds nice. 45-70 sounds like you better not shoot anything past collarbutton size.  And light loads even in them.....

[Airsporter]

Looks like the old 'baby rolling block' that was sold in .357 mag. by . . . Navy Arms maybe?

[kevinsmith5]

The 30-30 WOULD interest me, except my $240 H&R 30-30 is near perfect for what I use it for and I sure ain't gonna swap it out for an $800 one just to get a brass trigger guard....

[R.W.Dale]

The 30-30 WOULD interest me, except my $240 H&R 30-30 is near perfect for what I use it for and I sure ain't gonna swap it out for an $800 one just to get a brass trigger guard....

Having owned both In my opinion the additional $500 is money well spent. Not only is my current .357 uberti rolling block far more accurate than any of the half dozen handi's I've owned it's also about half the weight and thickness. Plus there's just a certain magic to the rolling block action vs those clumsy break action shotguns come rifle's

That might be a nice carbine in .30-30 or .38-55. In .45-70, that thing would kill on both ends...!

Bill

let me tell ya even in 357 mine will put a purple spot on your shoulder when shooting full power loads when wearing a t shirt

[gcrank1]

In spite of their ad copy, isnt it really more a repro of the No.2 action?
Even so, 38-55 would be none too pleasant, except in downloads. .32-40 (and 30-30) would be OK, but pistol calibers, as the original No.2 used, would be ideal. The factory knew what it was doing back then.

[kevinsmith5]

My hand loads from my 30-30 handi cloverleaf at 100.  Can't say as I'd want better accuracy enough to pay $500 more. The worst I've got out of a handi ever is a tiny bit over an inch at 75 with my 44 mag.  NOt usre about your experiences krochus, But since I handload for everything I shoot I ussually spend a lot of time on loads and developing just the right bullet/powder combo. 

[R.W.Dale]

My hand loads from my 30-30 handi cloverleaf at 100.

another one of those benchrest grade handi's that everyone always seems to own on the interweb but you never see on the range

so let me see if I have this straight

you have a handi rifle that prints 100yd 5 shot groups no larger than .308"!!! Remind me again why I invested over 1K in a custom barreled bench, varmint gun when you can surpass it's level of accuracy with a 30-30 handirifle? You should enter in some matches! I'm sure those guys would be astounded to have their rifles with over $1000 in just the bbl get outshot with a stock $200 break action single shot.

But since I handload for everything I shoot I ussually spend a lot of time on loads and developing just the right bullet/powder combo. 

As do I, and I assure you no amount of load development is going to turn a handi rifle into a 1/3rd MOA piece

[gcrank1]

Three leaf clover, all shots cutting each other? It has been known to happen. Maybe not everyday, on demand, but luck does beat skill (and expensive equipment) now and then. I too have a 'wallet group' that I wish I could duplicate as required, but to know I did it once, or occassionally, and ran with the big dogs does me good.
Its a tough game and most of us need all the encouragement we can get!

[necchi]

you have a handi rifle that prints 100yd 5 shot groups no larger than .308"!!! Remind me again why I invested over 1K in a custom barreled bench, varmint gun when you can surpass it's level of accuracy with a 30-30 handirifle?

A 1K gun doesn't make a shooter shoot better,,clovers at 100, with conditions right? Fairly easy my friend. If your not doing that with your gun on a fairly regular basis there are issues with the gun or the load or something. And no I'm not near to ya to show ya. But the Handi is capable at 100 and a fair shooter out to 200, it's beyond that the BR guns start to take over on paper and the Handi starts to show it's self as a hunter and not a target rifle.

[Canuck Bob]

I just came from the gun shop and handled the little 22 Hornet Uberti rolling block.  Surely it is not the same action.  The gun was almost dainty, very nice but small and very light.  The butt is a metal clad crescent and very narrow.  Mind you if one shot lots of cast handloads at pistol velocity and left the hunting rounds for the fall it would carry just like a little Stevens Favorite.  In the Hornet it is delightful, perfect for my daughters.  Do you think thier mom will buy that one?

[jlwilliams]

  I love rolling blocks.  Gotta go find someplace that has one of these new ones I can handle.

[R.W.Dale]

with conditions right? Fairly easy my friend. If your not doing that with your gun on a fairly regular basis there are issues with the gun or the load or something.

Do you guys realize just how bombastic your claims are???  If your handi rifle doesn't shoot 3rd MOA most of the time there's something wrong??/ Gimme a break guys. If you're gonna make claims at least make them slightly realistic. Please can we have ONE THREAD about non handi single shot where you guys from a forum closer to the top don't try to hijack by claiming to have the most accurate rifles on the planet

But the Handi is capable at 100 and a fair shooter out to 200,

and that's fine if by fair shooter you mean 1 to 2.5MOA, but when folks start making sub half MOA accuracy claims "all day long" from hunting weight firearms....well it's just not very believable and for good reason. I've ranted about this before, typically what happens is someone lucks into a sub 1/2" one hole group, if you shoot enough it'll eventually happen. Then from that point on the rifle in question is a half MOA gun even if every group fired since is over 3"

I just came from the gun shop and handled the little 22 Hornet Uberti rolling block.  Surely it is not the same action.

If the 4.5LB weight claim is correct it's almost half to be, but like you I just cannot envision it.

[gcrank1]

So, can anyone who knows rollers really tell me, is this model in question a 'repro' of the No.4 or the No.2 Remington?

[jlwilliams]

  Without having handled the new one, no I can't.  But, if you have handled it then this  http://www.rollingblockparts.com/  link may give you the little details that will help you identify it.

  I can't help but wonder if the 4 1/2 lb weight claim is accurate or a typo.  If it's right, then it's a shoulder wrecker in the big bores.  In 22 Hornet it would be a neat little walking varminter, 30-30 it would be nice to hunt with for the one or two (max) shots you really need for a hunt, but not much fun for target plinking. 45-70 at 4 1/2 lbs, I'll pass, thank you.  7 lbs is about as light as I'd like to go in 45-70.

  I have to agree with Krochus.  While I think the Handi is among the best values in current made sporting arms, the claims made by some stretch credulity and give oportunity for this little eye roll guy  to make his apearance.

[gcrank1]

Visually it looks like the Rem. No.2, with the distinctive 'swept back' rear part of the action. The No.2 was a bit bigger than the No.4 boys rifle and commonly chambered in the pistol cartridges, but I dont believe I ever heard of one in 38-55, much less 45-70.
Regardless, this Uberti version is still a small, light rifle. Having handled a 'Baby Sharps' in 38-55, which is a bit bigger and heavier, I can tell you that I wouldnt want to shoot even factory 38-55 in either.
What are they thinkin'? Even that 45-70 revolver weighs more.
BTW, I predict this will not last, get your collector piece now.

[coyotejoe]

Many years ago I had one of the little Uberti's in .22 Hornet. It grouped poorly and cases separated after one or two shots with mild loads due to excessive headspace. I got it rechambered to .218 Bee just to correct the headspace and it became a tack driver. It weighed 5 1/2 pounds complete with a 3-9X32 scope and was really sweet to carry hunting marmots above timberline, wish I'd kept it.
 As to handi's, I've tried 8 or 10 and have given up on them. None shot better than 3 moa, some not even that well. I tried many, many load combos, tried the "accuracy tips" from the forum and just never was satisfied. My good shootin' buddy has also tried several handi's with similar poor results. I've just totally given up on them and will waste no more time and money trying to make a silk purse of a sow's ear.
  One thing I've noticed in those "bragin' groups" from the handi crowd is that they shoot only three shots. To me three shots isn't a group, it's just three shots. It requires at least a five shot group to have any statistical probability of representing the accuracy potential and really at least several five shot groups.

[gcrank1]

The older I get the less weight I want to lug around on a walk-about. I have also noticed that sight for sight or scope to scope, I shoot about the same sized groups with everything. Not to say I dont have a 'wallet' or 'braggin' group or two, and Ive shot enough matches to win or place to know what to expect. If I get poor grouping out of some 'test piece' that is frustrating me I will take one of my proven rifles with similar sighting equipment and more often than not show that is the size groups Im good for that session.
The appeal of this Uberti rifle is, IMHO, to the traditionalist, someone who doesnt want to carry the full sized piece and plinking fun. I would think they would sell quite a few in the new 327, 357Mg or even Max, 44Mg and 45Colt (even if it is only good for 3moa or so).

[red headed stranger]

I just got back from shooting my new Uberti Baby Rolling Block rifle chambered in .22 Hornet here in central Kansas. I special ordered one from Taylor's and waited approx. 60 days...you pay half up front and the balance upon shipment to your FFL ($677 total). At age 59 1/2 I wanted a rifle that had historical significance,was well made (even if it's made in Italy), was reasonably accurate with open and eventually tang sights (a scope is out of the question) as well as fairly cheap to shoot . The Uberti Roller has met my criteria. With the 26" octagonal barrel, the case hardened action, brass trigger guard and butt plate along with some beautiful wood, it is a unique, modern firearm...I realllly like this rifle. Shooting the .22 Hornet and using Lil Gun and small pistol primers minimizes brass stress, but it's still smart to have a case extractor handy. Shooting from sticks at 125 Yards, 1/2 gal. water jugs, 5" bullseyes or life size paper coyote targets is just good fun out in the pasture. Personally, I wouldn't be afraid to shoot the Uberti carbine in .30.30, but I would handload it down a bit...an octagon barrel though would make it even better. For serious hunting I use my Ruger #1 in .243 ,T/C G2 in the Hornet and Model 72 "Crackshot" in .22 rimfire , however, the downsized Uberti buffalo gun is a real beauty.

[kevinsmith5]

Okay krochus, drop by Flatwoods Outfitters in Hubert NC sometimecand we'll shoot. Course you bring s thousand dollar custom gun in and expect to get stared at....and not with envy. And who said my 30-30 was stock? I've floated the barrel, weighted the stock, reworked the wood metal fit, and smoothed the hinge with 600 grit sand paper. Sorry to tell ya Mr. 1K gun, but I've humilated a few high dollar guns in my time. Come be next....

[Brithunter]

Hmmmm well I have never handled a Handi and doubt I ever will they don't appeal one bit. The 30-30 cartridge however I am familar with and it's more accurate in a good barrel than most would believe. Mine does especially well with the 130 Grn Hornady Spire Points and not it does not have a tubular magazine but a staggered Mauser type box magazine. Now I am not a bench rest shooter and have never claimed to be but this rifle and load combination will put three shots touching or almost touching. Yes I shoot three shots as it's a hunting rifle pure and simple and the time I need more than three shots I cannot foresee  .

I was testing some Factory ammunition (Winchester 150 grn HP) through some time back and it also would on occasion put three of these almost touching at 100 yards. I think the varience was partly me and partly the White Box factory ammo.

Now I would love a good bench rest shooter to give this rifle a try so we could see what it's really capable of. I don't know who made the barrel as although it's a bespoke made rifle (made to order and no not by me) I picked it up used at a gunshow.

As for Handi rifles I have also seen some unbelievable claims made for them and even read through posts of the Handi Forums a few times and I noticed more owners have trouble getting them to group than those owners who are happy with them. Now with the amount of these handis made and sold and even allowing for those who no longer shoot them having lost all faith in them which there seem to be a fair few. There will be some that with careful tweeking and fettling will be capable of shooting accurately. However from what I have read the majority of them are average or mediocre in accuray. Now kevinsmith5 it seems has an accurate one but by his own admission he has had to do quite a bit of work on it to get it too shoot well. The end result is that he has a cheap gun that shoots well and that makes him happy
. Others like myself do like the cheap and from the photos I have seen of them quite shoddy looking guns. I also don't like the Contender for similar reasons, however those Uberti's I have seen are far better made and finished and yes if I was after something like that I would certainly go for an Uberti over any Handi or Contender.

I will throw another spanner in the works and say that I prefer the Baikal MH18 to any Handi and yes I do happen to have a MH18 even though it's in .222 rem. (The Baikal MH18 is the same as the Remington Spartan I believe) and apart from lightening the trigger pull slightly and re-shaping the wood to a more pleasing shape to me that is, it's standard and it shoots to MOA or under. There must be some of the MH18's that will easily outshoot mine and I'll also say that I don't really get the bench rest idea. It has always seemed to me that if you really want to test a barreled action for pure accuracy why not mount it coastal artillery wise on a conrete stanchion? I also have a buddy in Missouri who spends god only how much on his bench rest and Hi-Power rifles which he enjoys to who am I to say it's wrong? 

[gcrank1]

I expect you have poked the beehive BH, Watch out for incoming!
This will undoubtedly go on ad naseum and bear little fruit. I remember the O'Conner/Keith arguments and we, as shooters, are a highly subjective and opinionated lot.
I appreciate a finely made gun, and also a 'bird rifle' (cheap, cheap) that is a wolf in sheepscape. The prior comment regarding 3 shot groups being meaningless brings to mind that a hostile dropped by one shot, one kill would disagree (if able).

[Brithunter]

I expect you have poked the beehive BH, Watch out for incoming!
This will undoubtedly go on ad naseum and bear little fruit. I remember the O'Conner/Keith arguments and we, as shooters, are a highly subjective and opinionated lot.
I appreciate a finely made gun, and also a 'bird rifle' (cheap, cheap) that is a wolf in sheepscape. The prior comment regarding 3 shot groups being meaningless brings to mind that a hostile dropped by one shot, one kill would disagree (if able).

gcrank1,

       It's not the first time and probably won't be the last that I have stirred up the nest  . MY point being that if you sample enough barrels even from a cheap make the at least some of them, by the simple law of averages, that produce superb accuracy or precision I suppose we should say  by the same law of averages a maker known for making good barrels and guns will also get the odd lemon although decent insepection procedures should weed out the lemons.

    Now a lot on these foums will now that I gather bolt actions, those made by either BSA or Parker-Hale for preference but I do have a few by other makers and I also have a few single shots. The Baikal mentioned and a couple of Martinis then there is a BSA model 2A .22L/R Bolt Action from just after WW1 and a 72/73 vintage Sportco 44 target rifle. Now in a diagreement on another forum about the pictanny rail on a stalking rifle a "self proclaimed" gunsmith said a three shot group only tests the shooter an five shot group tests the rifle  I pointed out that normally it was a ten shot group used in testing except by the English who for some reason used to use a 7 shot group. Of course that was the ballistic folks and military but they both used more than five.

I am currently testing the grouping ability of a 6mm remington chambered rifle and it has shot some fair groups and some only reasonable groups. none have been outstanding or even what I would expect from a heavy barreled varmint rifle. so I am testing over an extended period and using one "Master" target which I place under a fresh target each time I test it so I have a record target of that five shot group and a record of all the five shots groups. In time I will be able to tell if the groups are random or there is a serious underlaying problem with the rifle.

For me a rifle is not onyl a tool but it's alos an art form. the stock flows into themetalwork and the rifle fits and is comfortable. When i raise it to my shoulder the sights align with my eye. I do not have to go hunting for the reticle or foresight it's there right where I am looking. These poorly stocked cheapies cannot do this so I have no use for them. As I am poor I have to save for those I buy and of course the prices here in the UK are higher than your used to in the US.

[gcrank1]

I know it would be a pleasure to hoist a pint with you after a day of trials at the range.

[coyotejoe]

Right on Brit, there is nothing like the joy of handling a fine firearm, even though it may not "do" anything a cheaper gun can't do just as well. And there surely is a place for a "beater truck gun" just as there is a place for a beater truck.
 As to the three shot group, I hear people justifying it with "I'll never fire more than three shots when hunting".  Well that is a truism which has nothing at all to do with shooting groups on paper. It's like saying "a pint is a pound, therefore a squirrel is a rabbit". One part has nothing to do with the other. I don't expect to fire more than one shot at any one animal but a one shot group wouldn't tell me much about the accuracy of my rifle and ammo and a three shot group doesn't tell a whole lot more. Gun writers love three shot groups because thee shots will always average out smaller than five shots. The fewer shots fired the greater the factor of random chance. The more shots fired the greater the probability of getting an accurate representation of what the gun and load can really be depended upon to do. Three shot groups are for people who like to kid themselves about the accuracy of their rifles.
 For those who like three shot groups I suggest you try this. Fire your three shots and mark the holes. Now fire another three on the same paper with the same hold. Mark those holes and fire another three. Measure your three groups and average them and then compare that to the final measurement of all nine. That nine shot group represents what your gun and load will actually do and I'd bet it is more than twice as large as the average of the three shot groups.
  Once you know you have a good load then three shot is plenty to verify that your rifle and scope are still zeroed, but it is no basis for comparing two different loads, the factor of random chance is just too large.

[coyotejoe]

The prior comment regarding 3 shot groups being meaningless brings to mind that a hostile dropped by one shot, one kill would disagree (if able).

Don't you think it likely that the fellow who fired that one shot first fired many, many shots on paper?