Author Topic: .500 s&w Questions (Read 1976 times)

elhoward622 · « **on:** December 18, 2010, 12:24:34 PM »

I want to add an "interesting" big bore, .444 or .500, barrel to my .35 Whelen handi rifle. I have been researching the internet and read every .500 post on this forum. The main concerns I always see are under-lug/metal deformation, a.k.a "shooting loose," poor accuracy and un-bearable recoil. I can find no definitive answers out there besides guys either absolutely love them or absolutely hate them. I see guys like Quick and CWlongshot both have good things to say about the .500. Cost isn't a factor, I just don't want to mess up my good shooting handi. I have shot 3" sabots and .300 winmags so I have seen some recoil and I will reload. I would appreciate any input from folks who have actually shot them.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #1 on:** December 18, 2010, 12:53:52 PM »

Good evening!!

I like mine! I just like having a different caliber not to mention my affinity to big bores.

I don't find recoil prohibitive, on the same token, I wouldn't pop tin cans as I do with a 22 RF or my Maxi with 38WC's! LOL

"Shooting loose" isn't something I'm concerned about. I have many handis and don't shoot the 500 that much. I think 99% of people owning one will never wear one out either.

Poor accuracy, well that's another story. I'll first mention that most people do not shoot a heavy recoiling caliber very well. That and it seems to be human nature to blame everything one something other than what the problem really is.

I do have a theory about the latch spring. I feel that its rebounding under recoil and in doing so it allows the latch to move. This is a known issue and has a negative effect on accuracy. Remember snapping the action closed firmly and the same every time? Its almost the same thing. the other thing is its not a 22PPC... Its not needed to shoot in one hole. It's a big heavy powerful caliber, close is good. Even my worst shooting loads with kill anything with a pie plate sized kill zone. Most loads where half that and my best loads under 2" at 100.

Of coarse any self respecting handi haulic MUST own a 45-70 or three.

Merry Christmas,
CW

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** December 18, 2010, 01:56:09 PM »

+1 on CW's reply, and I wouldn't worry about it shooting loose, if it does, H&R will replace the barrel just like they have on those in the past and that's not just on the 500S&W, there have been others too, one specifically was a 38-55 which shot loose after 3500 rounds or so IIRC!

Tim

Slufoot · « **Reply #3 on:** December 18, 2010, 03:12:39 PM »

+2 on CW's reply!
I've shot a couple hundred 385 grain Remington bullets through mine and I don't have a clue as to how many of my LEE 440 gr GC bullets that I cast from wheel weights I've shot through it. My best loads will keep'em about 2" and sometimes better @ 100 yards, plenty good enough for what this gun is made for.

GOOD SHOOTING!
Slufoot

PS, The buck in my avatar pic was taken a couple years ago with my 500.

Rustyinfla · « **Reply #4 on:** December 18, 2010, 03:31:20 PM »

I keep thinking over and over about the possibilities of getting different barrels from the barrel program and the more I think about it the less I like the idea. Before it was a good value, not so any more. IMHO you're just as well off to just buy another rifle.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 18, 2010, 04:07:58 PM »

Since you said you dont want to mess up a good shooting rifle, why use it as a platform for swap barrels when cost isnt an issue; just buy the other gun and be ready at the grab to go out and play with it.

nframe · « **Reply #6 on:** December 18, 2010, 04:30:07 PM »

Of all the the junk I have to take out to shoot, the 500 Handi usally goes if I have ammo loaded. I like 400 gr plain base cast at 1100-1200 for plinkers or close range deer hunting. I have the Lee 440 mold and shoot them for full thump loads. Buried a cow today and thought about doing some testing but was getting late for digging. It puts a grin on most folks faces when they shoot it. Got no regrets about draggin' it in. Rainier 335 plated and 231 ain't bad in mine.

elhoward622 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 18, 2010, 04:48:15 PM »

Ha,ha I meant cost of ammo lol. I really have wanted a .500 mag but there has been so much negative press and nay-sayers surrounding this chambering it has really made me reconsider. I am not really sure why so many people are so morally opposed to a .500 s&w in a handi. I have been torn between a 444, my dad reloads it, and a 500 barrel. Most folks recommend the traditional big bores, but the .500 just has this "cool factor" about it!

26-t · « **Reply #8 on:** December 18, 2010, 05:19:05 PM »

It will shoot a 1/2 inch hole at 100 yards all day long. One shot at a time. Reloading is a must. Have fun with it and it will have fun with you. 26-t

Spanky · « **Reply #9 on:** December 18, 2010, 05:25:50 PM »

Get a 45-70 instead.

Spanky

geezer56 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 19, 2010, 04:32:23 AM »

Get a reloading set up first. Then, any caliber you want is a set of dies and a handful of brass away. If you are so inclined, a full reloading set up from some of the mail order places can be had for under a hundred bucks. The cost of 500 or 45-70 ammo gets prohibitive if you do much shooting at all. Reloading won't save any money, cause you just shoot more. That's the point though. You can also tailor loads for the application. Full bore 500 loads aren't any fun to shoot, after the third one. A light load with Titegroup and a 300-400 gr cast bullet is another story altogether. They are a hoot watching those big old holes come into the paper, and much easier on the shoulder. I love my 500, but shooting factory loads only would take a lot of the fun out of it. I'm so far gone in the hobby, I even cast my own projectiles. Get the 500 and enjoy it. But there is a law, you HAVE to get a 45-70, and a 30-30 to go with it.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 19, 2010, 04:40:43 AM »

I think the 12ga, Foster type rifled slug loads in my 5.25# Topper recoil more than the 500S&W in a 7-8# HandiRifle; ie, calc. at 43 ft.lb. with a 1oz. slug/1600fps, with 1.25oz. it calcs at 52 ft.lb.; Lots of people shoot 12s, some with Magnums and some shoot 10ga. (ouch). So, if you can take those the 500 should be OK.
Compared to my 12 I think the 500 would feel good to me.......in a heavier rifle, but I would still download it.

srussell · « **Reply #12 on:** December 19, 2010, 05:06:10 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on December 18, 2010, 01:56:09 PM

+1 on CW's reply, and I wouldn't worry about it shooting loose, if it does, H&R will replace the barrel just like they have on those in the past and that's not just on the 500S&W, there have been others too, one specifically was a 38-55 which shot loose after 3500 rounds or so IIRC!

Tim

is that 38-55 with factory loads are hand loads. thats making it shoot loose

quickdtoo · « **Reply #13 on:** December 19, 2010, 05:12:53 AM »

That was with standard 38-55 handloads.

Tim

elhoward622 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 19, 2010, 05:32:20 AM »

I am just dipping my toes into the reloading pool. I bought a lee press kit, dies for my Whelen, IMR 3031 and two books. Let me ask you .500 gr. guys another question. Why use ultra heavy bullets like th 500 grainers and the 700 grainers? The 275 Barnes and the 300 Hornady seem like they would bee flat shooting deer killers. Don't the smaller bullets produce less recoil also? I am ignorant to shooting big bores so just curious.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #15 on:** December 19, 2010, 05:36:48 AM »

Quote from: elhoward622 on December 19, 2010, 05:32:20 AM

Why use ultra heavy bullets like th 500 grainers and the 700 grainers?

Umm.... bigger is better.....maybe??

Tim

elhoward622 · « **Reply #16 on:** December 19, 2010, 05:53:47 AM »

hahaha! I wont argue with that! I was more wondering if heavier bullets were giving better accuracy or something.

guns-o-fun · « **Reply #17 on:** December 19, 2010, 06:17:19 AM »

As implied above, it's a Howitzer, not a sniper rifle. Anyway, in its present configuration mine gives an inch or just above at 60 yards - have actually not had it out to the real range to see what the 100 yard groups are, but should be around 2. Unlike some here, I really like the Hornady flex tips out of mine - less recoil too. To me, it's another brush gun (like I really need another one

!). Lil Gun, Lil Gun, Lil Gun....!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #18 on:** December 19, 2010, 06:21:44 AM »

Best I could do was ~2" @ 100yds with any bullet I used, 350gr XTP, 385gr Rem, 440gr Cast Performance and the 700gr Ranger Rick, but the only powder I tried was Lil'gun or it could just be my rifle or even ME!!

But most of my shooting was done on a LeadSled, so I don't think recoil was a factor. Lots of members here get better accuracy than that tho.

Tim

elhoward622 · « **Reply #19 on:** December 19, 2010, 06:35:07 AM »

Guns-o-fun, that is kind of what I envision a .500 as. I like the idea of the 275-350's that break the 2K fps and 2K lb/ft barriers. I am not a real bench shooter at this point in my life so I don't expect sub m.o.a groups out of my gun or my trigger finger lol. I just like to hunt whitetails and maybe the odd pumpkin, watermelon, milkjug, or cinder block

!

John R. · « **Reply #20 on:** December 19, 2010, 06:43:19 AM »

I like my 500. It definitly won't win any benchrest competitions, but I can guarentee nothing I've shot has ever walked off from it.

elhoward622 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 19, 2010, 08:07:06 AM »

Now I am back to being excited about a .500 s&w. I am not sure why so many folks feel so strongly against this cartridge. Now to find a .500 smitty barrel. I have missed every single on that has come on here the last couple of months

jason045 · « **Reply #22 on:** December 19, 2010, 09:18:01 AM »

Only bullets I have tried are the 440gr cast performance and the 610gr ranger ricks. No jacketed bullets for my handi. The 440s i pushed in the 1900 fps range and best I got out of them was about 4 moa. On the other hand, the 610s at 1425 fps are tack drivers. I dont know if I got a great barrel, lucked up on the perfect load or what but this combo is pure magic. 1/2" groups are regular and its great fun ringing the 300 yard gong at the range. People are amazed at what the little beast will go. Seems like a 3-mississippi count from the shot to the clang though!

Flynmoose · « **Reply #23 on:** December 19, 2010, 10:27:40 AM »

Why all the press and fascination about the 500? I see it as having
the same draw a mountain has to an avid climber..because it's THERE
and I haven't had that thrill/experience yet! The 500 seems, to me,
akin to launching a small car at whatever target you choose! Like Tim
the tool man says...MORE POWER!!!
FM

26-t · « **Reply #24 on:** December 19, 2010, 12:51:33 PM »

Here is what mine will do at 50 yards. 26-t

petemi · « **Reply #25 on:** December 19, 2010, 04:30:22 PM »

I really want a .500. My question is, if this cartridge is made for a hand gun that you hold in the palms of two hands and shoot, what's all this about recoil out of a 6 to 8 pound rifle held against your shoulder?

A friend of mine owns a sporting goods store. 15 or 20 years ago, he had a matched pair of .45-70 revolvers in there. I couldn't imagine shooting one of those beasts.

Pete

guns-o-fun · « **Reply #26 on:** December 20, 2010, 09:28:56 AM »

Pete, There is a "qualitative" difference between the 500 recoil and the 45-70. I find the 45-70 more of a push. The 500 burns pistol powders, so the recoil is a bit more snappy. If you load up some heavier bullets with a relatively hot load, you will quickly see what I mean. I prefer the recoil on the big 45.

petemi · « **Reply #27 on:** December 20, 2010, 01:01:07 PM »

I understand that. I just don't understand how anyone can shoot .500s out of a handgun. My .45-70 was my first Handi, and she is my princess. It's almost as if I shoot, and she says "Hey dumbass, your aim was off and I fixed it."

I guess I'll try a .500, if I don't like it I can always find another fool who might.

Pete

quickdtoo · « **Reply #28 on:** December 20, 2010, 01:31:22 PM »

Hey Pete, if you think the 500S&W is a handful in a pistol, try a 600 Nitro Express Encore pistol!

Tim

http://www.break.com/usercontent/2007/2/7/600-nitro-express-pistol-221225

elhoward622 · « **Reply #29 on:** December 21, 2010, 03:07:12 AM »

Geez, thats like touching off a stick of dynamite in your hands!