Author Topic: Caliber choices?? (Read 1453 times)

Honay · « **on:** September 20, 2004, 12:58:52 PM »

My girlfriend has showed interest in shooting last year, so we took her to the range. Her first ever 10 shot group at 50 yards was just over 1 inch. Not bad for never shooting before. Recently she has showed an interest in hunting so I decided that it would be best to get a rifle for her to use more often and was wondering about a caliber that wont kick too much and will put down game. I have thought about 243, 25-06, 30-30, 7mm-08. I don't know very much info about these calibers.

Fred M · « **Reply #1 on:** September 20, 2004, 01:26:00 PM »

Honay
By all means get her a 30-30. It will put deer down out to 150 yards no trouble that is about as far as a beginner should shoot game. But 50-100 yards is more desired. It has low recoil and is mostly very accurate. Fred M.

Natman · « **Reply #2 on:** September 20, 2004, 02:01:36 PM »

I would have to second that motion on the 30-30..I'm not knocking the .243 any because I used to hunt exclusively with it in a 100 grain choice..I'm suggesting the 30-30 for the simple fact that there can be a little room for error with it as compared to needing a very accurate shot with the .243..I did take a deer out to 300 yards with the .243 with one shot but it was dead on behind the shoulder..Never had one run more than 50 yards with it either...For all around versatility go with the .243 because you can go down as light as a 55 grain bullet for varmints or use the 100 or 105 grain for whitetail or similarly light skinned big game

MGMorden · « **Reply #3 on:** September 20, 2004, 03:13:52 PM »

.30-30 certainly wouldn't be a bad choice, but I'd personally go for the 7mm-08 (out of what you listed. It's not available in a Handi but 6.5x55SE is one sweet shooting round

). It'll still have all the knockdown power she needs at under 150 yards (and I wouldn't recommend that she shoot past that if she's a beginner), but the 7mm-08 will offer a little more room to grow. If she does end up taking a liking to it, then 7mm-08 will still be a viable choice for longer shots in the future. Recoil isn't bad from it either.

Don't get me wrong, most people I know around here started on a .30-30, and all get plenty of deer with it, but eventually most move on to something else (often times a .30-06, though I wouldn't recommend that to a female just starting out). Starting on the longe range catridge would keep you/her from buying another gun later. Then again, most people do keep that .30-30 around as a backup/loaner to friends, so there are benefits to having the multiple guns. Just my opinion.

gwhilikerz · « **Reply #4 on:** September 20, 2004, 04:03:16 PM »

I like the 243 and I don't think it gets nearly the respect it should from many hunters. When you put the bullet into the boiler room you get venison. It has always been a mystery to me why so many "expert" hunters say you have to have the latest super magnum to hunt deer. They won't go afield with anything less than 7mm mag. minimum. Then they turn right around and buy their kid or wife a 243 because they need light recoil. Well the 243 will get the job done!
I started my deer hunting career with a bolt action 30-30 and it was enough. I then went to a lever action 30-30 and it was enough. Then I moved on to "bigger is better" rifles. Now I have a 243 and, yes, even a 223 that I have taken several deer with. Tho lately I have been hunting with a 20 ga, those deer taken with the 243, 30-30, 223 are just as dead as the others. To me the 30-30 has a little more felt recoil than a 243 but this may just be my perception.
Buy the lady either a 243 or 30-30 and you won't go wrong. my 2 cents

Mac11700 · « **Reply #5 on:** September 20, 2004, 06:30:52 PM »

The 30-30,243,and the 7-08 are all good choices...but I'll say go for a 308 Ultra...it's a little heavy with a good scope and all...but with the right loads suitable for deer it will work just fine...and it doesn't recoil a whole lot either...and it's a whole lot of gun for the money...

Mac

Donaldo · « **Reply #6 on:** September 21, 2004, 09:15:51 AM »

For my money, the 243 can't be beat. For deer size game and down it is hands down the most versatile. I got my grandson a 243 Handi and he loves it. He only weighs about 105 lbs.

MSP Ret · « **Reply #7 on:** September 21, 2004, 09:21:37 AM »

OK, heres my vote,

7mm-08 if your a rifleman, 30-30 if your a traditionalist. Each would be a great choice for a deer gun for your girlfriend and stated purpose. By the way, what caliber gun did she shoot that first fine group with?....<><.... :grin:

gwhilikerz · « **Reply #8 on:** September 21, 2004, 09:35:11 AM »

Donaldo my grandson also has the 243 handi and he loves it. He even lets me shoot it once in a while :grin:

Honay · « **Reply #9 on:** September 21, 2004, 10:51:51 AM »

Quote from: MSP Ret

OK, heres my vote,

7mm-08 if your a rifleman, 30-30 if your a traditionalist. Each would be a great choice for a deer gun for your girlfriend and stated purpose. By the way, what caliber gun did she shoot that first fine group with?....<><.... :grin:

The rifle she first shot that group with was a 6.5x55 Swede, but its a friends rifle so it cannot be used all the time. She has also used a 30-06 but finds the recoil a little too much to start with.

handirifle · « **Reply #10 on:** September 21, 2004, 11:35:06 AM »

I say the 243 cause it's more versatile, but if it's only for deer ,then the 7-08 cause it allows heavier bullets for deer.

aulrich · « **Reply #11 on:** September 21, 2004, 12:31:31 PM »

I have to dido on 30-30 or 7-08 with the nudge to 30-30 because extraction is reported to be more reliable. And for new hunter ranges no real difference. But then again .. if i remember the nosler manual correctly the 243 win said something like this " Don't bet against the kid in deer camp who spent the summer shooting woodchucks with his 243" or something like that.

But really all of the above could be made to work what we are doing now is splitting hairs, which is what makes campfires and message boards fun.

tbmaker · « **Reply #12 on:** September 21, 2004, 06:06:49 PM »

How come no one speaks up for the 25-06?
I started the wife with a 243, then got a 7mm-08. The 7mm was border line tolerable in recoil so I got her the same rifle in 25-06. Much happier person.
Nothing wrong with the 30-30 but why handicap her on distance?
I've shot deer with all mentioned calibers and many more. I seem to try a new cartridge each year.
Stick with something modern shooting spitzer bullets.
I also second the 6.5x55, I plan on rebarreling her rifle for this if we ever hunt something bigger than deer or caribou.
Just my 2 cents.

handirifle · « **Reply #13 on:** September 21, 2004, 06:51:02 PM »

Quote

but why handicap her on distance

It's just that most new shooters (and a lot of old ones) cannot reliably hit game in field conditions at ranges longer than 150 or 200yds anyway, so it is not a limit.

What's the big deal about which one to start with anyway. This IS a Handi we are talking about. Get a good starter and move up as her skill does.

tbmaker · « **Reply #14 on:** September 22, 2004, 04:19:08 PM »

I hear'a handi. Then the 243 stands out as the better starter. Low recoil for a light rifle, great coyote getter, nice deer round with the right bullets and easy to get factory ammo. I've got nothing against the old 30-30, I carry my grandfathers 32 special from time to time.
I love the 25-06 but the 243 gets the nod for versitle starter.

Buffalogun · « **Reply #15 on:** September 28, 2004, 03:10:08 PM »

Honay

I have the 30-30, .243 and the 7-08. All three are in 20" barrels. Not knowing what cartridge your girlfriend has fired, I'd go with the .243.

The 150 yd. distance can be reached by all three. But, the 30-30 and 7-08 shoot bullets in the 140g-150g weights. With rifles that weigh about the same, I'm betting the 95g-100g bullets from the .243 will bother her less and she would enjoy shooting them more!

Buffalgun

handirifle · « **Reply #16 on:** September 29, 2004, 09:28:27 AM »

Keep in mind the NEF 243 barrel is a 1-10 twist and most cannot get acceptable accuracy from the 95 and up bullets. The 85gr seems to be the limit.

In addition, as far as bullet weight vs. recoil, the 30-30 is loaded to much lower pressures and thus will produce far less recoil than say a 308 with the same bullet.

Having owned a Savage 243 for many years, I'll tell you with the right bullet they are capable of much, but I do think the 30-30 Handi kicks less.

Plus for varmints, there are the 30-30 accelorators. just something to mull over. The limit of 85gr bullet, to me, is the largest handicap NEF places on the 243. I do not know WHY they don't use a 1-9 rate.

Buffalogun · « **Reply #17 on:** September 29, 2004, 02:14:15 PM »

Handirifle,

I had considered that the pressure limit for the 30-30 is only around 40,000 PSI. But, it seems that every rifle that I have fired in the 30-30 chambering has been short of barrel and has bucked like a bronco and has been quite loud. You know how noise turns off some potential shooters!

I figured the Handi in 30-30 would be about the same. In the Handi .243, the bullet to use might be the 85g Partition, if Nosler still makes it.

Just some thoughts,

Buffalogun

tbmaker · « **Reply #18 on:** September 30, 2004, 05:55:07 PM »

I didn't know the 243 handi had such a barrel twist, definetly handicaps the cartridge for versatility. Also loses a sale, I was interested in one for my boys to grow into but I really perfer 100 grainers for deer and such.

handirifle · « **Reply #19 on:** September 30, 2004, 06:03:01 PM »

I know even my Savage 243 like the 85gr Sierra better but it was still accurate with 100gr loads.

If I were to compare the 85gr Partition (or similar) to a 100gr core lokt, not sure you could tell the difference in the animal.

I will tell you the 85gr Sierra will kill a deer and with authority, IF hit in the heart/lung area from a broadside shot. I would not take a shoulder shot with that bullet. Now a partition might be another story.

The 30-30, in my opinion, kills in a different manner. It relies on good expansion of a soft bullet that is fairly heavy for caliber, as in the 170gr load. It penetrates well, usually with complete pass through on deer, and opens well. Since it is using mass to penetrate and expansion to kill, it does not NEED the high velocity to do its job. Hence less recoil.

Now when we try to load them like a 308 then the picture changes.

Mohawk · « **Reply #20 on:** September 30, 2004, 06:44:34 PM »

I used to shoot my deer when I was a kid with a .243. Good caliber. Never had a problem with through and through shoulder shots using standard 100gr. Winchester soft-points. Ran them through a Rem. 600 carbine. Never even recovered a bullet. They would stumble a few times and drop. Use the old Hill Country trick. If you can shoot a bullet through a Dallas phone book you can shoot through and through on a Texas Whitetail's shoulders, broadside. At least it has worked for me. Never used the 85gr weight. Never needed it.