Author Topic: Recoil question (Read 1404 times)

jpuke · « **on:** April 05, 2003, 10:43:53 AM »

This question is for you guys who shoot 45-70's - I don't have one but I'm going to get on in the future and I'd like to know - Is the recoil worse for the faster 300 gr loads (1800 fps) or for a slower 405 gr (1300 fps)? When I get one I'd like to shoot 400 - 450 gr cast bullets. Is it any worse than a 12 ga. with full power hunting loads? I'm know it depends on the weight of the gun, I'd just like to get a general idea.

Flint · « **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2003, 11:14:24 AM »

The recoil is harder with the heavier bullets, the 500 grainer being more like a .58 Minnie ball or a 12 gage slug. The 400 grainers are tolerable, and seem to be more appropriate for the rifling twist than the 300 gr weights. The recoil from a Marlin lever gun is harder than the Winchester, which is a heavier rifle, the Marlin would benefit from an octagonal barrel to add weight. The single shot rifles (Hi-wall, Sharps,Rollingblock, etc) are usually fitted with fairly heavy barrels and are not bad recoil-wise, with the exception of the Trapdoor Springfield, which Carbine with a full load is brutal. The Military loaded the Carbine cartridges lighter than the Rifle.

If you get a lever rifle, and use heavy bullets, you need to get bullets with the crimping groove far enough forward to keep the overall length such that the lifter can carry the round up from the magazine. Many 400 gr bullets have a crimp groove further back and the round is too long for the lever action.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2003, 12:18:58 PM »

405s at 1300 are not any worse then a 12 guage When you get up over 1500 theyll start to get your attention though. at 1800 they kick

BoatVet · « **Reply #3 on:** April 05, 2003, 12:33:52 PM »

I am just getting into lever action rifles myself because many people down here in southeast alaska seem to perfer the shorty lever actions to shotguns as a pack rifle. I never shot one until a few weeks ago. the guy shooting at the range next to me had a brand new marlin 1895GS with the ported barrel. He was nice enough to let me try it out and after I loaded up four of those 405grainers, I was ready to take a beating. After I shot the first round I was very suprised to find that the recoil was near nothing. Loud yes, but I believe the porting helps alot. The recoil on my .257 roberts is harder and it was nothing like my Win.1300 with slugs. I was upset to find out later that marlin no longer ports the guide gun because of customer complaints of muzzle blast, loudness or what not. I have not shot the unported guide gun but suspect felt recoil will be quite a bit more.

tominboise · « **Reply #4 on:** April 05, 2003, 05:22:06 PM »

Lloyd is correct - when the 405's get to 1600-1800 fps, they boot you. If you aren't used to recoil, even the light loads will bite, due to the stock design of most leveractions. If you shoot a 12 ga much, you'll be able to shoot the 45-70, just not 100 rounds at a time.

Tom

jpuke · « **Reply #5 on:** April 06, 2003, 05:10:46 AM »

Thanks for the info guys. My main reason for the question is because I have a Rem Model 7 (61/2lbs) in 308 and I've been shooting full power 200 gr loads and I don't enjoy it. The sharp, quick rap that my shoulder gets isn't all that pleasant - although it doesn't bother me too much when I'm not shooting from a bench. I'm really interested in a 45-70 but I don't want to get one if I'm too recoil sensitive to enjoy it. I do shoot a bunch of 12 ga. and that never hurts a bit - maybe I can put up with a 45-70, I'm looking at the Marlin 1895 Cowboy with the octagon barrel and the 1895 with the 22" barrel and pistol grip.

vetteman · « **Reply #6 on:** April 10, 2003, 10:00:59 AM »

jpuke, I recently purchased an 1895 Cowboy and I like it a lot. I have shot several factory loads out of it and I found that the 300 gr Remington's kicked harder than the 405 gr Remington's. I tried both off of the bags and standing. Same result. I am not fond of recoil so I am real keen to it. I was pondering the same thing before I got mine. There are several recoil calculators at various places on the web so you can compare by changing the data-once you get a basline. I load my own so I can produce whatever recoil I want. Give it some thought.

jpuke · « **Reply #7 on:** April 11, 2003, 03:36:06 AM »

Thanks vetteman. Where do you find these recoil calculators?

Ka6otm · « **Reply #8 on:** April 11, 2003, 04:38:01 AM »

jpuke,

Here's one that's kind of nice...
http://www.realguns.com/calc/recoil

Ka6otm

vetteman · « **Reply #9 on:** April 11, 2003, 05:54:14 AM »

jpuke, You may also want to check out Beartooth. There is a lot of neat stuff in there to read anyway. They have a recoil calculator and a lot of other things in the Ballistician's Corner.

vetteman · « **Reply #10 on:** April 11, 2003, 06:04:12 AM »

Sorry folks. I forgot to paste.http://www.beartoothbullets.com/rescources/index.htm
That didn't work right either. How do you guys get it to post the site so that we can click on it and it takes us there? That's what I was trying to do. Educate me, please. I'm no computer guru. I bet you knew that though.

Quiet Burp · « **Reply #11 on:** April 19, 2003, 09:53:53 PM »

I'm with Tominboise on this one. Stock design is critical. If you're worried, try that iron before you buy it. Unless you enjoy pain, stay well away from anything with a curved butplate Two rifles can recoil at the same energy, but that's not to say they will feel the same. If it feels a bit unballanced, you can expect a nasty wack rather than a push.

Ka6otm · « **Reply #12 on:** April 20, 2003, 04:44:13 AM »

vetteman,

You almost had it with your last post. The only thing that was wrong was that the URL didn't have a space between it and the period before it. So, try it with a space next time and you'll get this...

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/rescources/index.htm

Ka6otm

savageT · « **Reply #13 on:** April 20, 2003, 05:37:23 AM »

Quote from: vetteman

Sorry folks. I forgot to paste.http://www.beartoothbullets.com/rescources/index.htm
That didn't work right either. How do you guys get it to post the site so that we can click on it and it takes us there? That's what I was trying to do. Educate me, please. I'm no computer guru. I bet you knew that though.

vetteman,
I think the best way is to "Copy and Paste" the address by pressing and holding the left mouse button, dragging the curser over the address to highlight it, and release the button.
Then go to your message you want to post, Click the Right Button (to bring up a menu), go down to "Paste" and click the Left Button. That way there aren't any mistakes. Try it, with a little practice you can save a whole lot of retyping!

Jim

Ka6otm · « **Reply #14 on:** April 20, 2003, 10:55:52 AM »

savageT,

Your answer wasn't totally right either.

You need to add after:
"I think the best way is to "Copy and Paste" the address by pressing and holding the left mouse button, dragging the curser over the address to highlight it, and release the button."

This:
Then, either you right click the mouse and select "copy" or do a CTRL+C
in order to put it in memory. If you don't put it in memory using one of these methods, it won't work at at all. then proceed to:

"Then go to your message you want to post, Click the Right Button (to bring up a menu), go down to "Paste" and click the Left Button. That way there aren't any mistakes. Try it, with a little practice you can save a whole lot of retyping! "

You can also do a CTRL+V (paste) here...whatever you prefer.

At any rate, I think he had the cut and paste down pat (or he's a very accurate typist) as the URL was perfect. It's just that you need a space between your last characters typed and the "http:....." otherwise, the URL is seen as text and not as a URL.

Hope this clarifies things a bit..
Ka6otm

Zachary · « **Reply #15 on:** April 23, 2003, 05:09:36 AM »

To me, the kick was harder with the heavier, although slower, bullets.

Zachary