Author Topic: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?  (Read 1486 times)

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Offline RickC.

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.30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« on: January 11, 2007, 06:59:14 AM »
This is probably a tired old subject here, but I can't search...

 Besides the .30-30 AI and .30-40 Krag, what other cartridges have worked with the NEF, being converted from .30-30 Win?

 Thanks,

  Rick
"You cain't teach what you don't know anymore than you can come back from where you ain't been"- John Osteen

Offline Mac11700

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2007, 07:06:20 AM »


Quote
This is probably a tired old subject here, but I can't search...

Sure you can search...all 267 pages.....just 1 page at a time... ;) :D

Mac
You can cry me a river... but...build me a bridge and then get over it...

Offline RickC.

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2007, 07:09:38 AM »


Quote
This is probably a tired old subject here, but I can't search...

Sure you can search...all 267 pages.....just 1 page at a time... ;) :D

Mac

 Hey, I've been doing that!  Keep getting sidetracked reading .45-70 loads, lusting after laminated stocks, wondering if I should sell my Leupold and get Bushnells, and all the other things that happen to you when you get sucked into this forum!


             
                                             Rick
"You cain't teach what you don't know anymore than you can come back from where you ain't been"- John Osteen

Offline MSP Ret

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2007, 07:14:57 AM »
Aaaah, the agony and the ecstasy of it all....<><.... ;D
"Giving up your gun to someone else on demand is called surrender. It means that you have given up your ability to protect yourself to a power that is greater than you." - David Yeagley

Offline Mac11700

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2007, 07:20:02 AM »


Quote
wondering if I should sell my Leupold and get Bushnells,


Ha Ha...You funny guy :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Mac
You can cry me a river... but...build me a bridge and then get over it...

Offline RickC.

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2007, 08:26:18 AM »


Quote
wondering if I should sell my Leupold and get Bushnells,


Ha Ha...You funny guy :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Mac

 Heh heh heh....
"You cain't teach what you don't know anymore than you can come back from where you ain't been"- John Osteen

Offline carbineman

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2007, 11:11:14 AM »
DW, Tell me about the 307 Winchester. I was under the impression that the 307 was shorter than the 30-30 chamber. Do you use a different brass to form for these loadings than the Winchester 307 brass. Just Wondering?

Offline stimpylu32

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2007, 11:50:12 AM »
Here is some info on the 307 Win. from ammo guide


S.A.E. (in.)
 Metric (mm.)
 
  SPECIFICATIONS
 
Bullet Diameter:
 .309 in.
 
Max Overall Length:
 2.560 in.
 
Rifling Twist:
 
 
Rifling Lands:
 
 
Case Capacity (est):
 55 gr. water
 
Primer Size:
 .210
 
 
 
NOMINAL PERFORMANCE
 
Bullet Weight:
 180 gr.
 
Muzzle Velocity:
 2510 f.p.s.
 
Muzzle Energy:
 2519 ft-lbs.
 
 
 
 
 
"Easy Link" to this cartridge (copy and paste into emails, forums, etc.):
.307 Winchester - http://ammoguide.com/?catid=93
 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The .307 Winchester was developed in conjunction with the .356 Winchester, to provide cartridges suitable for the Model 94 XTR Angle-Eject Carbine. Both cartridges and carbine appeared in 1983.

The Model 94 XTR offered several significant improvements over the standard Model 94, which by then had been in production for 89 years. First, the new model could withstand much higher pressures, permitting more powerful ammunition such as the .307. Secondly, the angle-eject feature meant that spent cases were ejected to the side of the action, rather than staight-up, permitting easier scope-mounting.

Except for the rimmed configuration, the .307 case is externally virtually identical in dimension with the .308 Winchester (7.62mm NATO). As a result, the .307 almost duplicates the ballistics of the military round. The .307 produces slightly less power than the .308, however, as the bullets must be seated slightly deeper in the case to remain compatible with the overall Model 94 action length. This means there is slightly less case volume available for optimal powder capacity. The .307 also suffers from the flat-nose bullet required in tubular-magazine-equipped rifles, yielding more drop and less range than the .308 with conventional pointed bullets.

Externally, the cartridges are so similar, that it is possible to chamber the older rimless .308 ammunition in a .307 carbine, but FIRING SUCH A MISMATCH SHOULD NEVER BE ATTEMPTED, as serious injury or worse could result.

The .307 Winchester can propel a 180 grain bullet at 2510 fps with 2519 ft-lbs of muzzle energy.
 
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:D If i can,t stop it with 6 it can,t be stopped

Offline carbineman

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2007, 12:41:08 PM »
I probably should restate my question. Being that the 30-30 case is longer than the 307 Winchester case how can you rechamber the 30-30 to use the shorter 307 Winchester brass? Or do you just use a different brass and make it to fit the longer 30-30 chamber?

Or is the 307 made from a 308 barrel with just adding the 30-30 ejector/extractor and then adding the recessed radius to accomodate the rim on the 307 brass?

Offline carbineman

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2007, 11:59:51 AM »
Stimpylu, Thanks for the info on the 307. I am familiar with it, just not the rechambering of the 30-30 to 307

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2007, 12:04:57 PM »
Looks like it would work fine to me! That little bit of extra neck length shouldn't make any difference, room for case growth!! ;D

Tim


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Offline carbineman

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2007, 12:10:56 PM »
Quickdtoo, So what you are saying that even if the chamber is a bit longer in the 30-30, one could just for the most part rechamber with a 307 or 308 reamer per say and you could be good to go with using 307 brass?

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2007, 12:49:12 PM »
As long as the .307 chamber cleans up the 30-30 chamber to the neck/shoulder juncture, it shouldn't be a problem, the .018" extra length in the neck shouldn't be a problem. Max case length for the .30-30 is 2.039", 2.015" for the .307, neck diameter for the .307 is larger at .344" compared to .330" for the .30-30, so there would be a slight step at the end of the neck unless the smith just cleaned it all out to the end of the existing chamber, depending on what it actually measured since chambers aren't all exact to specs.

Tim
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline 10ga.

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2007, 01:33:03 PM »
Quote
The .307 produces slightly less power than the .308, however, as the bullets must be seated slightly deeper in the case to remain compatible with the overall Model 94 action length. This means there is slightly less case volume available for optimal powder capacity. The .307 also suffers from the flat-nose bullet required in tubular-magazine-equipped rifles, yielding more drop and less range than the .308 with conventional pointed bullets.

Would it be safe to assume that this cartridge could equal .308 ballistics in a single shot rifle since O.A.L. can be changed and flat nose bullets aren't an issue with a single shot ?
Paul Corbett
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2007, 02:45:37 PM »
Looking at 307 ballistics, I'd say that 308 ballistics in a stronger action would be very possible using spitzer bullets, the .307 case has slightly more volume due to the .200" longer shoulder spec! One member here, our dear departed friend deadeye47, had his .308 Survivor rechambered to .307 Winchester.

Tim

Hmmm, the spec I was looking at is in the Hornady 6th, shows the 308 at 1.360" and the .307 at 1.560", but the drawing shows them the same! I think the Hornady book is wrong, Nosler shows the 308 as 1.560" also.



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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2007, 02:52:35 PM »
Deadeye47's 307 , bottom rifle with muzzle brake.

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Offline RickC.

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2007, 03:04:13 PM »
As interesting an idea as the .307 is, I can't see doing that in a Handi, not when .308 barrels can be had much easier and there's no trouble finding brass.
"You cain't teach what you don't know anymore than you can come back from where you ain't been"- John Osteen

Offline Mac11700

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Re: .30-30 Win Rechamberings- Possibilities?
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2007, 03:18:31 PM »


The 307 brass is available from several on-line distributors...so finding brass isn't as much of a problem as I once thought...

The 307 brass won't equal 308 brass with the minute outside dimensional differences...It's the internal case volume that is much different...and what Winchester had to do when it made the Big Bore lever guns...from Chuck Hawks pages...http://www.chuckhawks.com/307win.htm
Quote
The .307 Winchester is based on a rimmed version of the .308 Winchester case. Internally, the .307 has thicker case walls than the .308. It is a fine cartridge and brings .300 Savage performance to rifles with a tubular magazine like the Winchester 94 and Marlin 336.

 SAMMI pressure for the individual rounds....307 Win = 52,000 cup .308 Winchester=62,000 PSI...http://www.frfrogspad.com/miscellk.htm#pressure
So I think you'll find pressures peaking out much sooner than say with Lapua 308 brass.... ;)

Me personally... think it's a good round for the Handi...

Mac
   

   
   



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