Author Topic: Setting up the "new" .38-55 (Read 1076 times)

Paul5388 · « **on:** February 19, 2007, 03:11:35 PM »

I got all of my reloading stuff in today, bullets and dies, to go with the .375 Win brass that came in the other day. I'm using the Oregon Trails Laser Cast .380" 240 gr bullet from Midway that actually checks very close to .380". That's about optimum size for my bore, which is .374" bore with .378" groove.

I loaded a test round at 2.43" OAL with 15.0 gr of 2400 that chambered without a problem. After bore sighting the TruGlo red dot I installed, I function fired that first round. I then loaded another round with just a partial sizing (call it a neck size, if it had a neck) and then I used the FCD to finish it off.

I knew the red dot was just a little low and at about 25 yards, it shot just a little low.

Recoil with the steel butt plate wasn't an issue, since the load is very mild.

I think I'm really going to like this setup and may put a holograph on it later for a little more compact package. It should do everything I was trying to do with a 250 gr bullet in my .357 Mag Handi, plus as much more as I can stand.

I may get time to shoot an actual target tomorrow, so I can get a better idea of what I'm working with and what needs to be done, if anything.

Paul5388 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:58:49 PM »

I forgot to include a picture. Here's the way it looks right now. I'm going to modify the Weaver 82 base to allow the red dot to move further back toward the breech. Later on, I may put a holograph site on it to reduce the bulk a little.

Jim Stacy · « **Reply #2 on:** February 19, 2007, 05:28:18 PM »

Paul please cease and desist posting picture of the 38/55 set up ! I had talked myself out of one and here you come with more addictive phrases and pictures. I am going to have to go to the gun closet and close the door and tell myself I don't need a 38/55 and rub on the Handi's I have already ! I have a friend in Wyoming that rechambered his 357 handi to a 35/30-30 and I don't need to do that either ! I need to come up with some loads that will make my 30/30 cast bullet gun shoot .5" then I'll look ata 38/55 . There I feel better because that damn thing will never shoot .5" with A CAST BULLET IN MY LIFE TIME SO .
Nice looking rig let me know how it shoots . Jim

Paul5388 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 19, 2007, 06:01:00 PM »

Jim,

If you'll remember, this project started as a ".357 Mag BC Carbine" that didn't work out as planned. The receiver and stocks came from Haywire Haywood and the barrel came from Shooter 72. I don't see a thing wrong with the 22" barrel other than it not having any provisions for a front sight. The red dot is just another way of skinning a cat.

The .375 Win brass is on clearance at Widener's for $14.50/50. I noticed on the few rounds I've fired that the case actually straightens out more than it is new. I guess fireform would apply to what they are doing. The bullets fit better after the case has been shot one time.

I got the Lee .38-55 dies, including factory crimp die, from Graf's for $33.93 including shipping and handling.

The Oregon Trails bullets came from Midway for $47/500 including shipping (there was $14 in shipping!).

When a box of 20 Winchester factory loads costs $35.49, I've paid for all the reloading dies and components I've purchased in the first 60 shots!

eskimo36 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2007, 02:25:14 AM »

Paul,
Do the Lee dies come with two expanders like the rcbs cowboy dies? I was just curious. A 38-55 in a Target Model is a great gun. I have even pondered cutting about 4" off of mine.

mt3030 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2007, 03:17:44 AM »

Quote from: Jim Stacy on February 19, 2007, 05:28:18 PM

....make my 30/30 cast bullet gun shoot .5" ....
....because that damn thing will never shoot .5" with A CAST BULLET IN MY LIFE TIME SO .

When using cast, I found a huge difference between the currently produced micro rifling and the previously used cut rifling. All of the H&R (pre-NEF) and the earlier SB-2s had cut rifling. Since we use lower pressures for cast loads anyway, the earlier barrels might work out better for you.

.5 MOA? My most accurate 30-30 cast shooter was a Remington 788, but I could not rely on a .5 MOA routinely.

Good luck.

Paul5388 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:10:02 AM »

The Lee .38-55 die set I got was the regular 3 die set. It has a separate expander/powder through die that gives sufficient expanding to keep from shaving lead on cast bullets. Since I have it set up in a Lee Classic Cast Iron Turret, I have the FCD in the last hole and everything appears to be working just fine. Since I am just partial sizing, I have a Universal Decapping die set up in a Rock Chucker, so I don't worry about the sizing die not doing the decapping by being set so shallow.

I don't know the age of this barrel, but it has pretty shallow rifling. When I shine a light in it, the chamber and rifling is very well polished. Certainly not a rough chambering job. I haven't measured the amount of difference between new brass and once fired, but it does "grow" in diameter after it has been fired. New brass slides into the sizing die without much effort, which is not the situation after it has been fired.

Paul5388 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 20, 2007, 02:18:38 PM »

Here's a target I shot real quick without using bags or anything. 25 yards with 14.7 gr Alliant 2400 and a 240 gr Oregon Trails RNFP and the red dot has only been bore sighted.

I now have 5 cases that have been fireformed, so I can do a little better work on actually developing a load and sighting in. I'll go ahead and fireform more cases to make the job a little easier.

Jim Stacy · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:53:03 PM »

Paul thanks for the info . Fun to follow a project even if it'd not yours !

MT30-30 My Handi is about 5 years old I'll have to check the rifling and see if it is micro groove. I have not had a place or a chance to shoot it enough to get good loads worked up for it . Too many projects need to work on one gun more and not 5-6 at one time.

mt3030 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2007, 08:02:34 PM »

Quote from: Jim Stacy on February 20, 2007, 05:53:03 PM

....Too many projects need to work on one gun more and not 5-6 at one time.

I find myself in that position constantly. Good luck.

Datil · « **Reply #10 on:** February 21, 2007, 02:10:25 AM »

Hello Paul, Thanks for the report, and web site to widener's,
Mt30-30 Widener's has rem 22 jet listed, might be place get it.
All you guys doing the all the projects, I am interest in and not
enough time to take of the ones already started. ha! Marv.

mt3030 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 21, 2007, 03:13:55 AM »

Quote from: Datil on February 21, 2007, 02:10:25 AM

....has rem 22 jet listed, ....

Thanks, Marv. Scope is mounted, dies, bullets and brass are on hand. My Jet project is just another of the "5 or 6" projects just waiting for spring and for the range to dry out.

Paul5388 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 21, 2007, 06:37:14 PM »

I went out shooting again today, but it wasn't a real happy experience. I set up a target at 50 yards and used my usual 1" black dot target. Even if I could have seen the black dot, the 5 MOA red dot would have covered it completely!

So, I got #1 grandson to put one of those 3" orange sticky targets on top of my regular target. It's pretty hard to distinguish between orange and red, so that still wasn't acceptable.

I ended up shooting at the 30# freon can that's at 100 yards. Two shots over it and one hit, by aiming low.

I believe it's going to have to have a scope, for me to do any sort of semi accurate shooting.

I was using 16.0 gr of 2400 today, which may be too much.

handirifle · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2007, 06:49:56 PM »

Paul,
for the time being, try using the red dot like open sights. Place the top of the red dot on the bottom of the center black bull. Assuming a 3-5" bull at 50yds you should be able to do this. It will give a fairly consistant aiming point.

handirifle · « **Reply #14 on:** February 21, 2007, 06:55:05 PM »

Also don't be afraid to try some smaller dia bullets. Your bore seems like a tight one compared to some. Most seem to be .376-.379, which is great for the .380 bullets you have. If yours is this tight, some 375 jacketed bullets might work pretty well also.

They are a little hard to crimp in place with 38-55 brass. i use this setup in my Win 375 Big Bore.

Am very curious as to how your 38-55 ends up, since I'm building one now.

Did you cut your Target Model barrel short, or was this a re-barrel/chamber job?

Paul5388 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 21, 2007, 07:17:22 PM »

I got the barrel at 22" from Shooter 72. He said a gunsmith did the work, but I don't have any details on what all was done.

I guess I might see about milling another groove in the Weaver 82 tomorrow, so I can put a scope on it. That'll help determine the accuracy potential a little better than what I have mounted now.

Paul5388 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 24, 2007, 03:41:19 PM »

I have been continuing to shoot the .38-55 just as it is for the past couple of days. It is either beginning to grow on me or I'm starting to get a little more used to the red dot, but whatever, it's a lot of fun to shoot. It seems like it will hit anything I put the red dot on, at least out to 50 yards or so.

I dropped the load back down to 15.0 gr of 2400 with the Oregon Trails 240 gr and I think it likes it better there.

I don't think it is set up right for target shooting, but it's a real hoot for plinking!

Paul5388 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 25, 2007, 12:15:13 PM »

#1 grandson and I went out and shot the gongs today. One is a Briggs & Scrapiron flywheel set at 85 yards and the other is a Chevrolet flywheel set at 185 yards. The red dot made it pretty easy to hit the 85 yard gong, not missing a single time. Too easy to be a lot of fun.

The 185 yard gong is a challenge, especially with a load of 15.0 gr of 2400 and a 240 gr cast Oregon Trails bullet. It's getting out far enough to accentuate the error in the sight zero, after I finally figured out where it was hitting. I need to move the sight zero to the right and then the 12" or so hold over will put it right on target. I would guess the frame is 20 gauge metal or maybe thicker and the cast bullet would penetrate one side of the channel, but would just put a big dent in the far side metal.

It takes the bullet a while to travel that far. Almost like, "Did you see it hit?" THUNK!

If you like a little slower paced shooting experience, the .38-55 will fill the bill, without beating you to death in the process!

Jim Stacy · « **Reply #18 on:** February 25, 2007, 02:05:08 PM »

Paul you had mentioned your 357 project? Did that not work well for you ? I worked with my friend in SC to develop his 357 barrel load and cut 357 Max brass to 1.45 loaded a full charge of 296/180XTP/mag primer and it would shoot pretty good groups at 100. 3 deer so far have been treated with it and dropped lit a sack of sand when they were hit. Just asking. Glad to see you are having fun with your old pumpkin chunker. Jim

Paul5388 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 25, 2007, 02:44:51 PM »

Jim,

I'm sorta like a kid with a new toy, the .38-55 is taking most of my time right now.

That doesn't mean I have left my favorite, the .357, it's just on hold for a little bit.

I have some 125 gr Golden Sabers with 19.0 gr of 2400 loaded right now that I need to run through the chrony. The 125 gr will probably become my primary load, since I can do the heavier cast ullets with the .38-55. I need to resupply on the Golden Sabers, which I usually buy 500 at a time (I may buy 1000 next time). I need to get the cut down Max brass to produce over 2200 fps, because I can do that well with Mag brass. I may end up using SR 4756 to boost the velocity, which is what I use in Mag brass to get 2200 fps.

I also haven't shot the Hornet on its new home either, but I think it'll do about like always, even though it's on synthetic now. So many projects and so little time.