Author Topic: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim  (Read 1272 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline okie john

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 70
Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« on: March 20, 2007, 02:14:32 PM »
Thanks for hosting this forum.

I hunt small blacktails in thick brush. Ranges run 30-90 yards, and revolvers are required. I used a 44 Magnum last year. This year I’m thinking of buying a S&W Mountain Gun in 45 ACP because I have a ton of 45 ACP brass for my 1911. I'd use AR brass for hunting loads so they didn't get into my auto by mistake.

What do you see as the top end in the 45 Auto Rim fired from this gun? Which of your bullets do you recommend for it? What load would you use? Do I need a roll crimp?

Thanks again,


Okie John

Offline Veral

  • GBO Sponsor
  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1675
    • Lead Bullet Technology
Re: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2007, 07:22:23 PM »
I'd try a WFN in 250 grain, powered by accurate #9 till it snaps good and sharp.  With the rimmed brass, or moon clips either, to establish headspace, a crimp can and should be used.  I would set the crimp far back as possible, and use only one grease groove which would be part of the check shank, to optimze powder space.  1200 fps+ will be easy, and kill very quick.

All this to get maximum powder room.  The bullet will be seated far out into the throats, which means sizing for a slip fit with easy chambering, is mandatory.
Veral Smith

Offline okie john

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 70
Re: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2007, 05:38:49 AM »
Thanks.

I'll let you know how it works out.


Okie John

Offline okie john

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 70
Re: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2007, 06:52:43 PM »
I shot some 250 WFN's in my 1911 today. 5.9 grains of 231 averaged 941 fps, with an extreme spread of 37 fps for five shots. I've read your book and I know lead runs faster than jacketed at the same pressures, but 250 at 941 seems mighty fast out of a 1911. Am I missing something? Also, should I run heavier springs? I have stock springs in it now.

This bullet is amazingly accurate, by the way.

thanks,


Okie John

Offline Veral

  • GBO Sponsor
  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1675
    • Lead Bullet Technology
Re: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2007, 09:42:40 AM »
No your aren't missing something. 
You are beginning to get your arms around some solid facts, except that pressures are lower and velocities higher with lead than with jacketed.  Normally, LBT bullets will not seat as deeply in the case as jacketed of the same weight, when set up to function smoothly in an auto, however the WFN may go in a bit deeper, which will raise pressure and velocity compared to the same lead bullet seated to the exact same depth as an equal weight Jacketed, seating depth being referred to in this instance being the depth of the bottom of the bullet.
  My statements above are dependant on using LBT bullet lubricant only.  The ACP works at low pressure making it quite forgiving as to lubrication quality.  Many lubes are of such poor quality, (provide poor lubrication) that pressures will be as high or higher than jacketed with some loads, with velocities ranging from about the same to slightly faste than jacketed.  But ALWAYS, at ACP pressures, using LBT bullet lubricants, lead velocity will be higher/velocity higher than with jacketed, and, if the powder charge is increased slightly so that pressure matches the safe pressure with jacketed, velocities will be MUCH higher.  I've chronographed up to 150 fps higher with plain base bullet.  Same applies to magnum revolver and high pressure handgun loads, but optimum velocity minimum pressure will be obtained with gas checks when pressures exceed perhaps 35,000 psi.
  If you see no evidence of battering of brass or hard slamming of the slide against it's stop, the spring you are using should be fine.  Chamber pressure X dwell time at pressure, or pressure curve, are the factors which drive the slide backwards, not necessarily recoil as calculated by bullet mass and velocity.  In other words, if pressures are lower than with jacketed, slide action will be lower, even though bullet speed is higher.
Veral Smith

Offline Lloyd Smale

  • Moderators
  • Trade Count: (32)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18269
Re: Deer and the 45 Auto Rim
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2007, 11:21:09 PM »
look at this recent tests and you will see that the old auto rim isnt the underpowered round that it has a reputation for being. With a good bullet out of a proper alloy it will do alot of killing!
Linebaugh Seminar Penetration Test Eustace Texas April 27,28,&29 2007

 

Inches  Caliber                        Bullet                                       Velocity F.P.S.

 

Exit  470 Nitro Express     500gr  Trophy Bonded            Solid    2042  Rifle   74”+ 

Exit  458 Lott                    500gr  Barnes                          Solid     2250  Rifle   69”+   

Exit  375 H&H                  300gr  Barnes                          Solid     2550  Rifle   69”+   

56”   50 Alaskan                460gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   2031  Rifle   

55”   44 Mag                      300gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   1964  Rifle           

54”   454 Casull                 316gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   1600  Pistol             

53”   45-70 Government    400gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   2088  Pistol

51”   500 Linebaugh Max  465gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   1326  Pistol  exit side

49”   500 Linebaugh          430gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   1270  Pistol

49”   500 Linebaugh          468gr  Montana Bullet Works LFN     1303  Pistol

48”   500 Linebaugh Max  465gr  Belt Mountain              Punch   1326  Pistol

44”   500 Linebaugh          500gr  Grizzly                         LFN      1100  Pistol

44”   500 Linebaugh Max  525gr  Cast Performance        WFN     1237  Pistol

42”   45 Colt                       335gr  Cast ?                             ?          1270  Pistol

40”   500 Linebaugh           414gr  Montana Bullet Works LFN     1085  Pistol

39”   475 Linebaugh           420gr  Montana Bullet Works LFN       948  Pistol

39”   45 Colt                       300gr  Cast ?                             ?          1286  Pistol

36”   45 Colt                       335gr  Cast ?                          LWFN   1045  Pistol

32”   50 Alaskan                 525gr  Cast Performance         WFN    2019  Rifle   deformed

29”   414 Super Mag          255gr   LBT                              LFN    1439   Pistol

28”   44 Mag                      310gr   Garret Defender              HH    1083   Pistol

27”   45 Auto Rim              260gr   BRP                              Keith    916    Pistol

24”   500 Linebaugh           400gr   Buffalo Bore                 JHP    1417   Pistol

24”   475 Linebaugh           420gr   Montana Bullet Works WFN    892   Pistol

24”   45 Auto Rim              250gr    (cowboy load)              RNFP   870   Pistol

23”   470 Nitro Express      500gr    Woodleigh                    JSP     2264  Rifle

14”   375 H&H                   260gr    Nosler Accubond          JPP     2781  Rifle

13”   44 Mag                       250gr   Winchester Black Tallon JHP  1194  Pistol

13”   445 Super Mag           270gr   Speer Gold Dot               JSP   1343  Pistol

12”   445 Super Mag           300gr   Hornady XTP                 JHP   1376  Pistol

10”   45 Colt                        200gr   Speer (ashtray)               JHP   1142  Pistol

 5”    22 Long Rifle               39gr   Remington Golde “Paco” FP     965  Pistol
blue lives matter