Author Topic: More dumb newbie questions  (Read 645 times)

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Offline azmark

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More dumb newbie questions
« on: April 05, 2007, 06:19:23 AM »
First, I want to thank you guys for being patient with me while I'm learning.

OK, here goes...

I'm stuck trying to decide between the .22 hornet and .223 handi rifles.  Part of the problem is the configuration of the gun itself.  The Hornet comes with sights, so I wouldn't have to buy a scope yet.  Budget-conscious, you know :-[  Can the .223 even be fitted with sights without a trip to the gunsmith?  Besides the cost of the scope, I have very little experience using one and it seems difficult to find my target.  My neighbor lets me use his scoped .22 and I feel like a blind man trying to even locate anything through a scope.  Is that normal?

Does anyone out there use open sights on a regular basis?  What are realistic distance limits with iron sights, other than what my middle-aged eyes allow me to see?
Mark Dickinson
USAF, Retired

Offline McLernon

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2007, 06:40:17 AM »
For your first Handi you will be better served with 223 with a scope sight. There are many choices for a good scope that will work just fine. Some 22 scopes are very poor quality and that may explain your experience with scopes. With open sights ranges are limited by your eyesight alright but one really has to define what it is you're are wanting to shoot.

A 223 with a decent scope will take small game to 200+ yards off a good rest.

A little more info will bring lots more advice.

Mc

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2007, 06:41:44 AM »
Most likely you scope experience has been with a high power scope or one with a small field of view(FOV), lower power scope and or variable set on the lower power offer very fast target acquisition, even tactical teams use low power scopes and close combat requires quick target acquisition. The higher the power, the smaller the field of view. Up close and personal, a shooter wants to use a lower power setting for quick target acquisition, when the target is farther out, a higher power setting is beneficial.

So your optical needs will be determined by what you'll be shooting and the range you anticipate. For the Hornet with it's practical range limit of 150-200yds, a 3-9x or 4-12x should be fine, for the 223 with it's range limit extending well beyond the Hornet, a 4-12x to 6-24x might be in order, again depending on what ranges you anticipate you'll shoot at. For target work the higher power options are the best choice, but for field work, the variable comes in handy as it can be set to the lower power for close anticipated shots, and if a long shot presents itself, you can always crank the power up.

As far as sight options, H&R will put sights on any accessory barrel for about $50 if it isn't offered that way. The Superlight Hornet, 223 and 243 accessory barrels are all offered with iron sights standard, although the complete rifles have youth stocks.

Tim

http://hr1871.com/Support/accessoryProgram.aspx
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Offline azmark

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2007, 07:28:36 AM »
I read somewhere, maybe on this site, that the .223 handis are more accurate from the factory than the .22 Hornets.  Is that true?
Mark Dickinson
USAF, Retired

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2007, 07:55:02 AM »
I have both, they're both very accurate with their best load. The hornet shoots real good using Lil'gun and the 35gr Vmax in most guns, some like the 40gr Vmax too, mine didn't.

Tim
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline Mac11700

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2007, 08:45:25 AM »
The 223 24" bull barrel seems to be the most accurate from what a-lot of folks here say about them...Most shoot the Winchester White box ammo exceedingly well...and is a  very consistent performer...Since you are just starting out..and most likely not reloading yet..would be my suggestion..Good optics will make it much easier to shoot..and even though your on a budget...are a worth while investment...This is a GBO sponsor...and will help you pick the right scope for you and your budget...http://www.theopticzone.com/
Good Luck

Mac
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Offline drdoct

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2007, 01:52:45 PM »
I had never been able to use other people's scopes before also.  I think the eye relief was off for me.  I got a 3X9 Bushnell for the 22-250 and for the 3 shots I took I could see quite well.  Before it's been like I was trying to look through a drinking straw.  Dicks has a good combo right now with .223 with a 6X24X40 scope.  The scope is cheap but I looked through it and I've seen much worse.  Especially for the price.  I haven't priced hornet ammo but .223 seems to be the cheapest around if your concerned with price of shooting.(sorry edited to include the diameter of scope)

Offline handirifle

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2007, 03:05:37 PM »
A 6X is OK, but not my preference.  Like was mentioned, I prefer a variable on varmint rifles.  Sometime I hunt in close quarters and set the power to 3 and for longer shots anticipated, and for range work it goes to 9 or 10.

If a lot of your hunting is 50yds and under, I'll go against the stream here and suggest the hornet and open sights, BUT the ammo is more so it may even out in the long run.
God, Family, and guns, in that order!

Offline burntmuch

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2007, 03:45:46 PM »
Go with the 223. as far as scopes , a 4 power will get you to 80yds or so. & they wont break the bank. It all depends on what & where youre shooting.
                                 Jay
I dont care what gun Im using as long as Im hunting

Offline FLNT4EVR

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2007, 02:11:21 AM »
Definitely go with the .223.Then check out the Barska scopes for sale thru the Sportsman's guide, or Cheaper than Dirt.Some of us here have them and I can say that the one I have on my 223 performs quite well .I've been using it for 2 yrs now and have had no problems.The Sportsman's Guide sells the varmint scope with the rings sunshade and scope covers included for around 50 bucks.
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Offline PartsMan

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2007, 04:54:23 AM »
Don't be afraid of a scope.
It will have to be set for YOU.
None of my friends or family can shoot my rifles because of eye relief and focus.
I have a big head and bad eyes.
Also some 22 scopes have very little field of view.
They are better for targets than hunting.

Offline Roudy

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Re: More dumb newbie questions
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2007, 06:22:02 AM »
22 Hornet or .223....hmmm, tough choice?  I've shot and reloaded for both calibers and both can be extremely accurate.  I had the 22 Hornet first and stupidly tried to get velocities up to the .223 level.  Never did any harm to my rifle or myself, but the 22 Hornet does a good job at its own velocities.  Ultimately I bought a .223 bolt action and for small to medium sized varmints and game it works very well.

With that experience behind me and assuming I couldn't have both at this time I would pick the .223.  The .223 will do whatever the Hornet will do and then some.  There are some people who say that the Hornet makes less noise, but a bang and a BANG are really not much different out in the woods.  I think the .223 is easier to reload for if you ever get into reloading, the Hornet can be a little ticklish because of the small case size.  Factory ammunition, as someone has mentioned, is also less expensive and more available for the .223. 

As far as a scope is concerned I think you will find quickly that either caliber will shot more accurately than you can aim with open sights.  Since neither caliber has much recoil a good quality medium priced scope should work well.  Probably a 3X-9X variable power would be a good starting point.

After you get the .223 you can start planning how to get the Hornet barrel from H&R for $100+ including shipping and fitting.  Not a bad deal!

Roudy