Author Topic: 7600 Carbine (Read 5698 times)

lester · « **on:** January 16, 2007, 03:05:09 PM »

Need some help.....

I've been looking for an M7600 in a .308 carbine, 18.5 inch barrel. They seem to be VERY far and few between, apparently Remington has done only limited runs of these rifles. Because of this I'm considering an M7600P with the 16 inch barrel. The vast majority of my hunting is in New England with shots at deer at 150 yards or less.

I have two questions. One, how much velocity will I lose with the shorter barrel, and will it really make a difference at 150 yards and less? Two, does anyone know if there's restrictions on rifle barrel lengths when transporting rifles into Canada? I live about 70 miles south of the border and my in-laws have a place north of Montreal that I'd like to hunt someday.

Thanks,

Lester

R.W.Dale · « **Reply #1 on:** January 16, 2007, 03:58:41 PM »

You probably won't even lose 50 FPS between a 18" and a 16" barrel no critter on the planet will notice the diffrence.

OLDHandgunner · « **Reply #2 on:** January 16, 2007, 04:14:41 PM »

I have two Rem. 7600 Carbines one in 7mm/08 & the other in 35 Rem. both 18 1/2" Two of my sons own the 7600 Police in 16 1/2". They love them & they shoot great. I heard that it is not legal to take these into Canada, because of the short barrel.

CaptOnion · « **Reply #3 on:** January 17, 2007, 01:38:18 AM »

They are totally legal in Canada.
As for a carbine 7600 in .308 they dont exist.Never made in the 7600 but they did make them in a 760 though hard to come by.

lester · « **Reply #4 on:** January 17, 2007, 01:32:38 PM »

Thanks for the replies guys. Can't wait to get one now!

Lester

LEO · « **Reply #5 on:** January 17, 2007, 04:29:30 PM »

I have had one of the 7600Ps since they first came out and have used it a lot, if you scroll down a couple or three pages there is a topic on the 7600P where I posted my impressions. I think you will be well satisfied with the rifle. To answer the velocity question I get about 2600 FPS with a 150 grain bullet. I don't know about the laws in Canada. Good hunting

strut64 · « **Reply #6 on:** January 18, 2007, 01:13:16 PM »

I own a 7600 Carbine in 30-06 and it will slightly out perform a 308 on paper. But!!! in reality there is probably not $0.03 worth of difference between a 308 and 30-06 in this rifle. As far as I know the only Carbine in the catalog is a 30-06 but Grice's gun shop in Clearfield, PA often gets special runs in like 25-06, 7 08, 35 Rem, (both regular and carbine) 35 Whalen and the like. Look them up in the yellow pages and give them a ring. They also wholesale so your local gun shop can deal with them if your not close. I highly recommend a 30-06 Carbine and find they are normally as or more accurate than a long barreled gun. Around here in PA a used one will sell for about $350 or so.

sparkysteve · « **Reply #7 on:** January 19, 2007, 02:47:01 PM »

I have a 760 Carbine in 30-06. They no longer make a 7600 Carbine in 308. Unless you find one used. I love mine. Shoots like a dream.

DLuke · « **Reply #8 on:** January 19, 2007, 03:08:15 PM »

You can have the barrel cut, recrowned, and the front sight put back on for very short money. The barrel length, as you know, is the only difference between the rifle and a carbine.

DeerMeadowFarm · « **Reply #9 on:** January 22, 2007, 09:20:08 AM »

Quote from: DLuke on January 19, 2007, 03:08:15 PM

You can have the barrel cut, recrowned, and the front sight put back on for very short money. The barrel length, as you know, is the only difference between the rifle and a carbine.

That's what I did with my .280... but DLuke already knows that; right Dan?

lester · « **Reply #10 on:** January 26, 2007, 02:50:34 PM »

After handling a 7600P yesterday, along with a couple of 7600's, I've decided to get the 22" 7600 in .308 and cut the barrel back to 18.5". One other question about this rifle....anyone ever seen a scout rifle/long eye relief forward mounted scope set up on one?? Seems to me that in close quarters with a moving target, this combo would be the cats ass. Is it doable?? Thanks,

Lester

358Win · « **Reply #11 on:** January 26, 2007, 07:26:35 PM »

Hi Lester:

I for one am very fond of short barreled rifles. The velocity loss in short barrels is very dependent on expansion ratio. This is the volume of the case divided by the volume of the bore. Thus velocity loss in cutting the barrel of say a 300 Weatherby would be much higher than with a 308 Win. With a small case such as the 308 velocity loss isn't really a big issue unless you are cutting to an illegal length such as 10 or 12 inches. This comparison can be seen in reloading data for the TC Contender or Encore with the pistol configuration. The main draw back as I see it with the 16 or 18.5 lengths is muzzle blast and noise increases. For a 16 inch barrel I would prefer a 338 Federal or a 358 Winchester. In the 18.5 inch barrel the 308 should work out just fine. I once had a 270 Winchester with a 21 inch barrel, and every time I went out to the range people would come over and want to know what kind of a cannon I was shooting. It was REAL loud and shot flame that was amazing. So in a 270 I'd recommend at least a 23 inch barrel and 24 to 26 would be preferred.

As for scout scopes they are wonderful for short to medium range shooting of non-dangerous game. For truly dangerous animals, Grizzly, Lion, etc. I'd stick with express sights or a large ghost ring set up.

targshooter · « **Reply #12 on:** January 27, 2007, 11:35:15 AM »

Lester,
Two cents on the scout style of scope mounting on a pump. I know one individual who tried the forward mounted scope on the 7600. The weight of the scope so far forward enhanced the wobble that the pump style rifle has. I handled it and did not like it. More importantly, after trying this style of mount on his 7600 for a while, my buddy went back to the traditional mount.
I am curious, isn't the carbine version offered in the .30-06? I have such in the 7400. Seems that you could substitute the 06 for the .308 and come out on top. The barrel cutting and recrowning has to be done properly or your rifle will lose some of its accuracy potential. If you have a gunsmith you know you can trust, no problem, but otherwise this can ruin a rifle barrel in numerous ways.

R.W.Dale · « **Reply #13 on:** January 27, 2007, 11:40:36 AM »

Quote

Lester,
Two cents on the scout style of scope mounting on a pump. I know one individual who tried the forward mounted scope on the 7600. The weight of the scope so far forward enhanced the wobble that the pump style rifle has. I handled it and did not like it. More importantly, after trying this style of mount on his 7600 for a while, my buddy went back to the traditional mount.

Where did your companion obtain such a mount?

targshooter · « **Reply #14 on:** January 27, 2007, 12:01:47 PM »

krochus,
He had a gunsmith make the mount. I cannot tell you exactly what the gunsmith did, but he used a Weaver type rail for ring attachment. I think the smith utilized the rear sight screw holes. Such a thing may be catalogued by an outfit like B Square or Choate these days.

DLuke · « **Reply #15 on:** January 27, 2007, 03:02:43 PM »

Before you have the barrel cut down, take the sights off the barrel and fill the holes with the filler screws from the receiver. It's a good look, and one I'm perfectly happy with...I hunt in Maine where the carbine length is historically preferred, but I've never been in a situation where the barrel length has mattered a bit, and I've stillhunted through plenty of black growth up there in the last 24 years. I've also cut a barrel down to carbine length...like DMF above, and liked that setup as well....

lester · « **Reply #16 on:** January 28, 2007, 01:36:43 PM »

Thanks for all the info guys. I've read some other reviews the last couple days about the scout set-up and think I'll stick with a traditional mount in a low power variable, probably a 2X7.
As far as going to a .30-06, no can do. I've deer hunted with a .308 for 30 years and don't want to change now. I know they're so close ballistically it's a wash, but just call me superstitious.....

Lester

DLuke · « **Reply #17 on:** January 28, 2007, 04:00:16 PM »

That's a VXIII 2.5-8x on that 7600 in the picture. It stays on 2.5 all the time, unless I'm standing on a power line or somesuch. It's a good cover-all scope... DL

DeerMeadowFarm · « **Reply #18 on:** January 29, 2007, 10:48:02 AM »

If Dluke posts a picture of his rifle it's pretty much mandatory that I post a picture of mine.

Here is my 7600 "Ol Deerslayer". It's a .280 cut down to 19 +/- inches. I removed the sights as Dluke mentioned and mounted a "custom" Leupold Vari-X III 1.5 to 5 x. I say "custom" because at the same time I bought this scope I also purchased a Leupold Vari-X II shotgun scope in 1 to 4x; it came with a "heavy duplex" reticle. I wrote to Leupold to see if they could swap out the standard reticle in my Vari-X III for the kind that was in my Vari-X II. Confused, a rep from the company called me to ask why I wanted that reticle. I explained that my hunting was in New England where shots were fairly close range and (with my hunting style) usually moving pretty quick; I needed cross hairs that I could pick up fast if I needed to. Satisfied with my answer, they made the change for me. A year or so afterward, they offered this scope with a heavy reticle and called it their "Dangerous Game Scope"... you'd think I would have gotten royalties or at least a hat or something...

I keep it on 1.5x all the time unless my situation has me looking over a clearcut or something...

Coalminer7 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 01, 2007, 04:19:02 PM »

I cut my 760 (1977 vintage) down to 17.5" for deer in Pa. Shoots great, knocks my whitetails silly.
Put see thru mounts on it only so I could put my hand under the scope and carry it. My buddy dropped his 06 last year and busted the scope off, gave him this to use all week, killed a doe with it and had to pry it off him to get it back. Had my daughters 7600 in .260 cut to 19" and cut the stock 1" down, put on a 1.75x5 Bushnell Trophy on it, pure poison for Pa. deer.

Have a good smith cut and recrown the barrel, you won't be sorry.

Also the short barrels in tree stands is a WORLD of difference.

jut my .02

Rick Teal · « **Reply #20 on:** March 05, 2007, 06:29:28 PM »

In Canada, we have two restrictions on barrel length. If the barrel length is altered, it can't be shortened to less than 18 1/2 inches. A barrel can be shorter than this if the rifle is of original manufacture, and meets a certain over-all firearm length. I'm not at home, so I can't check to see what that is right now (its probably in metric anyhow).

Like DLuke, I'm a still hunter at heart, and (of necessity) mount optics on my rifles. Since I don't like scopes, I use red dots, and am more than happy with them. Since these have infinite eye relief they can be mounted forward. I find the newer short/fat ones to be excellent for this. Contrary to things I've posted over the years, a few years ago I managed to shoot a standing deer at 213 yds with a 5 minute red dot, so even though they shine at short rangtes, they gan be used out there a little ways.

I used to hunt with a remington 742 with a 22 inch barrel, and would get about 2600 fps out of factory ammo advertised at 2700 (30-06/180's). I developed a handload for deer that i liked using ballistic tips that produced 2470 fps. When I bought my 760 carbine I graphed these same loads at 2471 fps. I've since developed a moose load for this gun that gives me 2636 fps that my brother-in-law has used to down two moose cleanly.

WD242 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 06, 2007, 02:10:25 PM »

Rick, Would you post the load for the Ballistic Tip. I had my 7600 (30-06) cut to 19 in, and now have a bad shoulder and looking for a load that will not beat me up. I hunt the Adirondacks and most of the shots are 100yds or less. Thanks.

Rick Teal · « **Reply #22 on:** March 08, 2007, 04:03:59 AM »

WD242:

My loads were with 180 grain ballistic tips and IMR 4320 powder. I used 47.2 grains to get 2470 fps and 48.5 grains to produce 2636 fps. And, BTW, ballistic tips do an excellent job on moose in spite of the "conventional wisdom" on this bullet. I've shot 3 with them and my brother-in-law has killed two, in all cases we got excellent performance.

fknipfer · « **Reply #23 on:** March 09, 2007, 05:34:01 AM »

Well I have done some calculations using Chuck Hawes loss per 1" of barrel. The 30-06 data is always calculated with a 24" barrel in the load books so the 18 1/2" barrel has about 110 fps loss from the longer barrel. My data one the 180gr load with a Nosler PT with 54gr of W760 is 2730fps with a 24" barrel. If you take the 2730fps and delete the 110fps for the shorter barrel you have about 2620fps. Guys guess what that does, it gives you a .308 velocity in a 7600 Carbine. Now if you go back to the longer barrel of course you go back to the 30-06 are.
Just buy you a 30-06 Carbine 18.5" barrel and you are getting .308 velocitys.

fknipfer

lester · « **Reply #24 on:** March 26, 2007, 02:20:36 PM »

Well, I thought long and hard about all the options and finally bought the .30-06 carbine. FWIW, here in VT the prices seemed to have climbed the last week or two. Ended up getting mine from a dealer who had one in stock for $549.

I have a 2X7 Nikon that's going on it, can't wait to get to the range to try it out.

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice.

Lester

T.R. · « **Reply #25 on:** April 22, 2007, 03:27:22 PM »

I recently had my 760 BDL in .308 re-barreled to 358. New barrel is 20 inches.

I getting a 1.5 inch group at 100 yards with Speer 225 grain pointed soft point.

760 barrel is fairly easy for a competent smith to change it quickly.

TR

lester · « **Reply #26 on:** April 23, 2007, 02:51:17 PM »

Well my new 7600 is almost ready to go. It's wearing a Nikon 2x7 Prostaff, mounted using Leupold rings and base. It's amazing what a good ring alignment kit and lapping job will do. First time I've ever used this method and when I bore sighted it tonight I only had a few clicks in either direction to get it centered. The trigger assy is out and packaged, ready to go to Barnes for some work. Once that's back it's off to the range to see how she shoots. Can' wait,

Lester