Author Topic: starter loads 475  (Read 701 times)

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Offline kennisondan

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starter loads 475
« on: August 01, 2007, 05:27:11 PM »
hi : about to get my first 475L FA; I wanted to start with handloads that would recoil less than full house loads --especially for starting off- the BTB 420 gr. cast I ordered will not be here for a month, probably.. would you suggest that I order up some factory Jacketed flat points at around 400 grains ? I can probably get them here quick if I order on line and put a rush on it. I would like to keep the cast below 1300 fps or wherever the recoil goes from okay to oh no level.  I would also like to see the ballistics/trajectory be close to each other as well. that way I can start with what is available then switch to what I wanted to use (cast ).
I have some factory 480 and 475L that are Hornady factory loads but do nto want to get too sensitized to recoil in order to shoot the gun soon. (the gun has an extra 480 cylinder ).
so do you think I can approximate a light recoiling 420 gr cast load with a similarly weighted jacketed bullet ? and would you make a reccomendation on the jacketed ....
I want to order something pretty quick as the gun will ship tomorrow..
thanks in advance.. I am excited to get started.
dk

Offline paul105

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2007, 06:16:44 PM »

KD,

Some lite Titegroup loads with Horn 325 and 400gr XTPs

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

Paul

Offline Ken ONeill

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2007, 01:14:20 AM »
The 400 XTP or Speer should shoot about an inch lower at 25 yds. than it does with a cast 420, given the same loads. They do with my grip, eyes, and guns. MIGHT have less than an inch windage difference.
I don't remember the barrel length you ordered, but a 420 @ 1300 is not a light load.

Offline paul105

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2007, 02:37:39 AM »
KD,

Here are a couple of sources of info -- take note of Speer's caution not to use max data developed in trimmed 45-70 cases (John Taffin's Data).

http://www.speer-bullets.com/pdf/ReloadingSupplementalDATA/475lineb.pdf

John Taffin's Data

http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt475.htm

Paul

Offline kennisondan

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2007, 03:23:59 AM »
the FA  Is the one Marsh sold on the classifieds;
With  more thought on the subject, I should not have used 1300 fps as a definite upper limit of recoil due to the speed of the projectile.. I was wanting to learn which bullet would open up at the lowest velocity/recoil  - otherwise as soon not worry about any expansion( which is also not a big problem to me, as I do beleive penetration and placement are the keys, but would like to see performance - Just cause).
Most likely, I will load it down to 1000 or 1100. ( more like a 1000) .. I want a really tolerable / recoil light load - and do not want it MUCH below a thousand feet per second. I would like to shoot the same load for hunting whitetails as for practicing, as long as it is tolerable enough to get in a lot of practice. I want to know where the bullet will be at all practical yardages and be confident with it.
  It looks like either one can be shot that slowly.. do you know whether one or the other would have a thinner jacket ? I am guessing that at a 1000 even if the 400Gr. open up it will push on through with devastating results and full penetration.Just do not want to order a couple hundred gold dot and find out there is a great reason to have ordered the Hornady xtp's.. :-\

Offline kennisondan

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2007, 03:10:23 PM »
Well so far I nave not determined that one is that much different than the other and actually decided to go with some fast to get here cast since that is where I will end up.. I do like the way that hollow points look, but that is not the issue..it is great that you guys with so much experience take the time for folks like me to speed up the learning curve at the cost of your time... I would hope that I can do the right thing and pass it on... I do doubt that I will be of much use to you folks but .. the shooting fraternity is the greatest in the world that I know of.. your time is not wasted.. maybe you will want or need something one of us learners permit shooters know sonething about... 
maybe not.. but it is probably enough to know that I for one will never deny my time to another ... I will follow your lead.
I have noticed that you guys give to folks like me.. that is important..
I and others appreciate it and it makes a difference in more ways than is readly apparent..
dan kennison

Offline MarkH

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2007, 03:50:31 AM »
My advice would be to start with a lighter bullet and a fast powder and stay around 1000 fps - Titegroup or Unique, whichever you can find reliable data for in combination with your bullet.  Shoot it a thousand rounds, starting at close range, focusing on trigger control, your sights, and not flinching.  The FA is an incredibly accurate firearm, but if you jump into heavy loads too quickly you will never know it.  You may run into barrel leading issues with velocities that low - or not - depending on the bullet.  Increasing your powder charge a bit, or switching bullets, may solve it.

When you've done that, switch to a "moderate" powder like 2400 or IMR4227 with the same bullet; start at the lower end of the published data and shoot that for a good while, in the same manner - focusing on trigger control and avoiding flinching.  You have to grip these guns consistently to shoot them well.  A loose grip with a big bore will not shoot anywhere close to where it will with a firm grip.  These loads ought to be in the 1100-1200 fps category and will start to get your attention (they will also work fine on deer).

Work your way up the reloading data very slowly (as in, take several months to do it) up the data and when you come to a level that you are not shooting well, stop and back down to the level that you were shooting well ... and keep shooting it.  And don't lie to yourself.  Plinking is fun but shoot on paper every once in a while to see if you really ARE shooting the gun well.

When you're confident and competent with the higher-end velocities with 2400, or 4227 - depending on the bullet chosen and the velocity you are seeking, you might want to try a powder like H110.  You cannot load to the "moderate" end with H110 in the same manner that you can with 2400 and 4227.  I'm not positive how much you can with 2400 ... I have used 4227 for such purposes almost exclusively.  I use H110 for my high performance loads and start loading and shooting it a couple months before hunting season.

I think of it as a "recoil ladder" that you have to climb.  There is only one proper way to get to the top of a ladder.

I started shooting a 454 Casull long before I was ready to do so - and jumped right into the heavy loads.  Dumb mistake.  It took me years to correct the mistakes, habits, and perceptions formed.  This time around, I did the above ... 10,000 rounds last year ... and I cannot tell you how much difference it has made.

I am working my way back up the recoil ladder with a 500 Wyoming Express right now.  A different world than the 454 Casull ... because of the bullet weight.

Offline kennisondan

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Re: starter loads 475
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2007, 09:01:50 AM »
Thanks markH : that is a wonderfully complete and easy to follow thread response...full of great advice that makes a lot of sense and is specific enough to follow to the letter ... once you add the personal experience factor it is a quite complete, informative, persuasive post... there are many who will need to see and learn from it besides my self... I have exactly those powders now and will adhere to that advice.. the coolest thing is that where the start is - is sufficient to hunt with right off the bat...that is reassuring and encouraging.

now all I gotta do is get the gun picked up monday and get down to a little business... dk