Author Topic: A Bullet Diameter Problem?  (Read 899 times)

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Offline IOWA DON

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A Bullet Diameter Problem?
« on: August 16, 2007, 10:45:50 AM »
I have an early "new" Marlin Model 1895 made before they started using micro-groove rifling. I bought it new and added a peep sight. My usual load for it was the 400 gr Speer flatnose with 53 grains of IMR3031 for a velocity of 1,800 fps. I would usually get 2 to 2-1/2 inch groups at 100 yards. I kicks a lot and I never shot it much so decided to start casting lead bullets and use it for a fun/target practice gun with much lighter loads. I bought a SAECO lubricator resizer with a 0.459 die thinking that the bore diameter is probably .458. I bought a Lyman flat nose 400 grain mold and have access to a lot of  lead used to frame stained glass windows. I don't know the alloy but the stuff has a BNH hardness of 12 per my LBT hardness tester. I tried 5744, 2400, IMR3031 and IMR4895 and only IMR4895 showed any potential for accuracy. However, most groups with it put the bullets into two distinct groups. I finally measured the bullets. They weigh 427 grains and their diameter is 0.457 before sizing, so sizing was not accomplishing anything except lubrication. I am thinking the maybe some bullets are obturating and some are not. Maybe the ones that obturate land in one group and the others land in the other group. The two groups are each small but shift position in respect to each other depending on whether the load is 33, 36, or 39 grains of powder. With 42 grains of IMR4895 it shoots one large group like with the other three powders. Anyway, after reading your book I think I need a bullet which is cast to about 0.460 with the alloy I am using, then my 0.459 sizer would take it to 0.001 over bore diameter and OK accuracy would be possible. What is your opinion?

Offline Veral

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Re: A Bullet Diameter Problem?
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2007, 07:29:50 PM »
  Do you feel like a dog chasing his own tail?  That's where you are if the bullet isn't fat enough to prevent tipping on takeoff, and that holds true for any firearm.  If good groups aren't consistent, there is a misfit in the bullet, or a poor bullet design, or something wrong with the bullet.....  That row of dots means period!  If the bullet design is strong, the mold well made so bullets are balanced, and diameter suited to the gun,  almost any ol type of powder and charge volume will produce excellent groups if the load isn't so hot it strips the rifling.

    For the 45 70 and similar rifles with very short throats, or space between cartridge neck and rifling origin,(which includes most lever guns)  it is very  important to have the bullet large enough to swell the cartridge neck to a close fit to the chamber.  In most cases, forget groove diameter, which will be way smaller.  If I have a throat slug I customize the bullet with a groove diameter forward drive band, which eliminates any deformation on entering the rifling, and keeps the bullet nose dead center.  The rest of the bullet will come down to size rather quickly when the hammer falls.

  Don't fret too much about details on bullet fitting if you order a mold from me, and send a throat slug etc as I request and prefer.  With these things in hand I will make a bullet that will make you real happy.

   I can take almost any rifle, revolver or single shot handgun, and make it print one inch groups at 100 yards with the first mold I cut, and not be too selective about the load if a rifle., (not auto pistol)  The key factors are lap the bore if necessary, change a few dimensions if requuired , then fit the bullet.  Everything else falls into place by itself.  If you read this forum and understand all I write, or my book and other literature, you can do the same. (With a bullet I make, or perhaps a mold from another competent mold maker.)

Veral Smith

Offline IOWA DON

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Re: A Bullet Diameter Problem?
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2007, 11:00:12 AM »
Thanks. I will read up on making the throat slug and get it to you.