300 whisper

[Ruskin]

I was talking to a friend about the Whisper.  I find there are more than just the 300 Whisper; however, I am more interested in the 300.  I read an article that says it is based on concept of shooting a heavy bullet at subsonic velocity.  The article indicated that at subsonice in the Whisper velocity loss at 200 meters was less than a rifle round based upon the percent of loss( is this for real?).

A friend tried to get a Whisper to shoot a group and finally gave up.  I have not really done much with mine.  Mentally, I have it categorized as a wimp trying to be a 30-30.  I would limit my range to 50-75 yards. 

Would one go subsonic with a heavy bullet?  How about a light bullet and stoked to push it faster?  I think subsonic it would be a lob rather than flat trajectory.  What are the lower and upper limits?

[sweetwyominghome]

For hunting deer-sized game, the preferred projectile is the 125 grain Ballistic Tip, which performs exceedingly well in this cartridge. The sub-sonic/heavy bullet loads must be used in a custom barrel with a 1:8 or quicker twist and, for the most part, have little practical hunting value. Factory TC barrels can't handle the 240 grainers preferred for the subsonic applications.

While I don't recommend its use, a number of hunters have used the heavy bullets at around 1040 fps MV for close range deer and hogs. The long bullets sometimes tumble in flesh and, when they do,  are approximately as effective as a .44 Magnum revolver. But if they don't tumble and pencil through, you could be in for a tedious tracking job. So it's best to stick with what works: the 125 grain Nosler.

[Grumulkin]

First of all, the reason for the Whispers is to have a powerful cartridge that can easily be suppressed (i.e., used with a silencer).  They're also capable of excellent accuracy.

As far as effectiveness goes, with energy being related to bullet weight and velocity, a heavy slow bullet can deliver just as much energy as a fast and light one.  Another factor is momentum and sectional density which are both related to penetration.  A slow heavy bullet will penetrate much better than a light fast one.

Then there is the "penciling through" theory.  You have to get to the vital parts of an animal in order to kill it.  A bullet that "pencils" through an animals heart or major blood vessel is going to kill it.  A bullet that comes apart in muscle and never penetrates to vital organs probably won't kill the animal fast.  Some may not be aware that arrows, spears, solid bullets, cast bullets, etc. have been penciling through for years and have been killing stuff.

[swampthing]

When a door flies open and 240g, .308"dia. projectiles, @1050fps are flying at a rate of 800 rounds per.min. there is going to be hell to pay. The 300whisper is intended to be used where 9mm H&K MP5SD's would be applicable. It, also, is very controllable when firing in full auto. Being accurate enough for 200m kills just in case, although it's trajectory will take some practice, makes it a nice option.
 Due to the heavy weight bullet with a high ballistic coefficient, and, low frontal pressure due to subsonic velocities, velocity drop at extended ranges is very low.
 

[sweetwyominghome]

Grumulkin wrote: "A bullet that "pencils" through an animals heart or major blood vessel is going to kill it."

No one will argue that point, but there's also no arguing that a tiny hole through the vitals probably won't kill as quickly as something that rips a much larger wound channel.

We owe it to the game we hunt to strive for the quickest, cleanest kill possible. When it comes to the Whisper and hunting deer, I'll take the 125 grain BT any time over a non-expanding 30. caliber projectile traveling at less than half the speed of the 125 grain loading. For me, it's a matter of ethics and common sense.

As to non-expanding projectiles and deer, anything with a wide, flat meplat and of at least .40 caliber does a superb job with modest velocity levels. I know. Ive done that many, many times with a 320 grain heat-treated solid from Cast Performance in my .44 Magnums. At 1300+ fps from a 7.5" barrel or nearly 1400 fps from the 9.5" version, that 320 grain bullet chops a nice 1.5" wound channel all the way through -- and anything hit with it quickly loses interest in worldly matters.

[no guns here]

My guess, not having a .300 Whisper is that there would be a mid-range there somewhere.  Lot's of 150 grain bullets out there that you could probably get into the 1600-1800 range.  I mean if it's either the 125 or the 240, can't you split the difference in weight and velocity?


ngh

[Ruskin]

I was talking to a gunsmith that converted a CZ to 300 whisper.  At 40 yards they could get a ragged hole; however, once out at 100 yards the bullet drop was terrific- would not reach the target.  I have some of the loads they were using.  The bullets were sierra, hornady and nosler.  They were in the range of 165 to 168 weight.

I was shooting 110 with H110 powder yesterday.  I was struggling with a leapers scope which I busted(second bad one from Leapers).  I never got off the 30 yard line.  I have not been able to get a leaper scope to work.  I e-mailed them today about the frustration with their scopes.  Stay posted.  I don't expect much other than an education of what not to buy.

Where can one find trajectory of the different 300 loads?  How high should 125 bullet be at approximately 35 yards to hit on at 100 yards?  What kind of drop should I expect?

[swampthing]

It depends on velocity. An example would be for a 130 Hornady spire point with a muzzle velocity of 2000fps...{typical short barrel H110 load velocity}   If you sighted .5" high at 50yds. you will be dead on @100yds.  A muzzle velocity of 1500fps with the same bullet sighted dead on @100yds will be about 1.5" high at 50yds. They were probably shooting the 165's subsonic. Check out sierra bullets web sight they have a comprehensive ballistics chart including the 240g .308" @subsonic velocities. It will take a little bit of searching but it is in there.

[Lone Star]

...I mean if it's either the 125 or the 240, can't you split the difference in weight and velocity?

It depends on what you want to do.  My .300 Whisper Contender shoots the 110V-Max and 125BTip bullets great and they both work well on varmints and deer (the 125 is a big game bullet anyway, so no surprise).   I have used a lot of 150BTips in a .300 SAVAGE Contender pistol and they give excellent performance out to 200 yards on deer when launched at 2400 fps.  Launched at lower .300 Whisper velocities they will be range-limited due to non-expansion.  I will not shoot game with a non-expaning .308" bullet, sorry.

The 110 and 125-grain bullets work best for heart/lung shots on smaller deer, and they can be launched fast enough for long range shooting.  I prefer the .30 Herrett for the 150s though, the extra velocity insures expansion past 100 yards.


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[sweetwyominghome]

Lone Star wrote: " I will not shoot game with a non-expanding .308" bullet, sorry."

I couldn't agree with you more...