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Author Topic: Which one is better out to 300 yrds?  (Read 1542 times)

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Offline handgunhuntr

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« on: July 22, 2003, 02:32:58 AM »
OK folks,
Heres a question Im sure will start a good debate.  For deer, predator, and antelope hunting, would you choose the 15" 243 win Encore or 14" 7-30 Waters in Contender and why?  Shots would be out to around 300 yrds.
Thanks for your time
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Offline Sixgun

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2003, 03:34:56 AM »
First off, in my oponion, the 243 is marginal for deer at 300 yards with a long barreled rifle, let alone a short barreled pistol.  To get the speed you need a light bullet and to kill a deer you need the weight which slows everything down a whole bunch.  The BC on a 243 bullet isn't high enough to sustain volicity and energy to consider it a consistant killer of deer at 300 yards.  Yes I know lots of people attempt it and some even get good kills on deer, but most people who attempt long shots with a 243 end up wounding an animal which may or may not be recovered.  For antalope you may want to make the same consideration, although they seem to be easier to kill than deer.  For Varmints the 243 would be a good choice.  You can shoot a 55 gr bullet from a 243 at a very high volicity and the explosive 55 gr varmint bullets really do a job on Mr. Coyote.

I don't know enough about the 7X30 to make a good comment.  It does shoot a heavier bullet which is better for deer and antalope but I haven't used it enough to make a good suggestion.  

I hunt with pistols but if I know I am going to be taking shots much byond 75 yards, I take a rifle.
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Offline Graycg

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2003, 04:04:22 AM »
Gotta tell you, if those are your only choices...hmm.  243 offers great trajectory and on the short end for energy at 300 from a short barrel.  7x30 is a great round, but not the best of trajectory or energy for 300 yards, I think both will get the job done IF you are a very good shot, use proper bullets for the task, can judge distance very well, but if you have other choices....  I would strongly recommend 7mm-08 or 260 Remington if you want to play at 300 yards.  I used to shoot lots of sillywets and if you want to put something down for good at long range and for a pistol, heck even most rifle shooters, 300 yards is a long shot- you used a 7mm-08 or 6.5-08(260 Rem).

regards,
 Graycg
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Offline Dalton

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Neither.
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2003, 05:03:23 AM »
I like both of those rounds, but not for deer at 300yds.  Could you add the 7mm-08 to your list of possibilities?
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Offline handgunhuntr

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2003, 05:36:22 AM »
OK,
Lets try this.  We will add to the list the 7mm-08 AND 308 Win 15".  Now lets drop the distance to 200 yards.  Would you still consider the 7mm-08 over the other choices?
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Offline Questor

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2003, 05:37:31 AM »
The trajectory at 300 yards for the 7-30 is going to require a lot of practice to master.  The 243 will require a lot of practice too.  I think the right answer for these two options is to limit your shots to 200 yards, then you'll be fine.
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Offline jhalcott

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2003, 07:24:27 AM »
I HAVE shot deer with a 14" 6.5jdj at 200+ yds.I have also used the 7br in a 15" xp100. BUT, big but there ,I shot these guns every week at silly wets and ground hogs. I would not attempt this today for lack of practice.
   Shooting animals is NOT a game to me. I have found many animals that were shot and ran off.Some of those "hunters" never even looked for them. Many city people are moving into rural areas and when they see a poor deer fall in their drive way due to a gut shot , they get alarmed and want laws passed to stop this . I am not saying don't handgun hunt ,I AM saying get practice first.
  I injured my ankle a few years ago and have trouble walking out to make sure that I did hit the ground hog. I can not explain to some that this is the way I was brought up.respecting life and property is deep rooted.
  As a side note ,I have used most of the rounds you mention for ground hogs at much farther than 200 yards.!!       jh
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Offline Dalton

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Now your talking.
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2003, 12:07:06 PM »
Quote from: handgunhuntr
OK,
Lets try this.  We will add to the list the 7mm-08 AND 308 Win 15".  Now lets drop the distance to 200 yards.  Would you still consider the 7mm-08 over the other choices?


Of the calibers you have listed I think that the 7mm-08 and 308 are the only safe choices for 300yds.  If you move the distance into 200yds. then you can put the 7-30Waters back on the table.  

I would rule out the .243.  It is a great varmint round, but I still prefer bullets in excess of 100grs. for whitetails.

At 200yds. this then comes down to which do you prefer.  Contender or Encore?  If you like the Contender I would stick to the 7-30Waters, if the Encore is your preference I would select the 7mm-08.

Better yet get one of each. :grin:
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Offline Robert

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Depends on how you feel I guess, for instance...
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2003, 07:07:09 PM »
I took my first Elk at 400+ with an old 30-06 and an antique 2x scope.  It was a stupid shot, but I got lucky.....lucky it was a P-17....since then...I have passed on 300 yd shots on Elk with a 300 Ultra-Mag...just not sure of the shot, and figured it would wait for another day.  I am most likely going to use my 7-30 carbine for deer, but I doubt if I would try over 200 yds.  I have no doubt about accuracy at 300 on targets, but targets do not run off, and a lot can happen in the time it takes to travel 300 yds, might take a long time to even find where the deer was when you made the shot...and that is usually where you need to start to follow blood.  I would probably be more confident in the shot in the morning rather than late evening.  Tracking with a flashlight really sucks.
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Offline PJ

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2003, 12:55:05 AM »
I vote for the 7mm-08 or .308 just don't like to limit my shots to only 100 yards.Heck go all out like me and get a 16.5" 300 Win Mag pistol and shoot 300 yards with ease. :)
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Offline handgunhuntr

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2003, 03:48:32 AM »
PJ,
I believe that your suggestion would definately make it a single shot since I dont believe I could possibly pull the trigger twice in the same day.  Seriously, I honestly have no intention of shooting at an animal at three hundred yards.  My main interest was at 200 yrds, what would be effective, the reason I said 300 was to get an idea of drop from the calibers, and that was definately answered for me.  Where I hunt at, there is only one location across a corn field that would be anywhere near 200 yrds.  Most other shots would be 125 or less.
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Offline flatlander

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2003, 06:42:24 AM »
With the scenario that you just listed, I would personally take the 7x30, but only with spire point bullets. Flat nose bullets just won't stretch out to 200 yards very well. I haven't shot the 7-08 to compare recoil, but I don't feel comfortable shooting a pistol at deer beyond the range that my 7x30 will be effective anyway, so I'll stay with my contender.
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Offline Big Gun

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2003, 07:26:44 AM »
PJ, I liked the photo you had a while back of the 300 win mag with the laminated grips - but, at least to me, this looks even better.  This is exactly how I plan to set the 375 H&H from Reeder Custom up - only difference will be a stainless barrel and muzzle brake.  What scope is that? I plan to use a TC 2-7 lighted.

As for the original question of this post I would probably use the 243 - I have taken several large corn fed white tail deer with my Ruger M77 at ranges between 200 and 300 yds and always got a clean kill.  I have yet to use my 7-30 waters Contender carbine barrel - fairly recent purchase.
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Offline grizz

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2003, 01:59:10 PM »
handgunhuntr,

 My choice would be the 7mm08... Here is some data to help ya out...

 Just to keep it the same between all calibers I will limit the bullet to 100gr Barnes X bullet with a BC of .406...

 For the 243 I dont know what the Velocity would be in a 15" bbl but in a 24" bbl  with 47gr of H1000 Velocity is 3000fps which @ 300yds would give ya 20" of drop with 1209ft.lbs of energy.. I would be guessing here but in a 15" tube lets say the Veloctiy is 2400fps that would give ya 32" of drop and 735ft.lbs of energy left @ 300yds....


 7-30 Waters with a 14" tube with 36gr of AA2015 Velocity is 2700fps which would give ya 25" of drop with 957ft.lbs of energy left @ 300yds

 
 7mm08 with a 15" tube with 45gr of H4895 Velocity is 2940fps which would give ya 12" of drop with 1156ft.lbs of energy left @ 300yds...

If you would like data ran for a different bullet I would be glad to do so...

hope that helps....

grizz
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Offline longwinters

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2003, 04:00:33 PM »
Killing distance for the 7-30 is considered 225 yds for deer size game.  It is a relatively slow caliber for predators etc...  The 243 is faster but I would not go over 200 yds (at the velocity you will get).  My choice would also be for the 7M-08.  The recoil would be up quite a bit more than the other two, but recoil is a forgone conclusion when shooting big game calibers out of a pistol.  Best senario . . . buy a 223 for predators and 7-30 for deer out to 200 yds. :D
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Offline kciH

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2003, 09:49:29 AM »
7/08 has what it takes at 200, or 300, yards.  I'd take it over the .308 because it would be more pleasant to shoot.  If you wanted to expand your horizons to big game at less than 200yds, I'd go with the .308.
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Offline Blackhawk44

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2003, 07:02:16 AM »
Fascinates me when we talk of cartridges that we normally would only trust on game shots out to about 200-250 yards in a full rifle (including 7-08, 308) then chamber them in a short barrel and think we can add another 100 yards range even without the steadying effect of a buttstock.   How many of your friends consistantly shoot deer at 300 yards with medium rifles?  If all their game was at that range, you would hear talk of 25-06s and zapper magnums.  All of us need to be more concious of the image we project.  Handguns for medium and large game are for when we want to add more zest to our sport.  Put more hunt into hunting and not thinking of making it a stunt.  Our game and our sport deserve better.
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Offline KYODE

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Which one is better out to 300 yrds?
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2003, 09:20:08 AM »
i killed a little ol deer last year with my 15" 7-08. 250yards!
no stunt whatsoever, just deer hunting. most shots don't come that far out. BUT, if they do, WE owe it to the sport to be prepared. practice makes perfect, and makes those short shots easier.
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