Advice: .45 Colt rifle load suggestion (hunting)

[B. Miville]

Hey folks,

Hoping you can help me with some suggestions.  First the skinny:

Shooting a Winchester 94AE in .45 colt.  Bbl length: 20 inches.  Current load: Sierra 300 grain, Winchester case, Winchester Pistol Primer, 20gr Winchester 296.

I picked up the Winchester to make for a dandy little brush gun that I could shlep around all day instead of my heavier scoped guns.  Problem is the gun is (depending on the perspective you use) too light for the heavy laod I am using, or the load is too heavy for the gun I am using.  This sucker KICKS with the full length barrel and the magnum powder.  Truth be told, I really don't need quite that much power for a short range gun anyways since average shooting distances I run across are basically always under 30-50 yards.  I want to stick with the 300 grain Sierras because I like them and I come from the "Heavy bullet" crowd.  All I want to do is tame down the speed a bit.  The 20 grain load I use right now is already only 1 grain above the suggested START load in my Sierra manual, and I know that with 296 you are not supposed to reduce loads too much (though I am pretty sure that is meant to apply to revolvers and not rifles.)  Plus when doing testing the 19 grain load was not much lighter kicking (the max load of 21.5 grains, IIRC, was purely unbearable when shooting off the bench in a t-shirt and that plastic buttpad that comes on it.)  I do have some Winchester 231 on hand, but feel it is too fast a powder and not optimum for the long barrel (as well I doubt it is best PERIOD for this type of application.)  So I guess I am looking for powder suggestions somwhere in the middle, but closer to the 296 side of "middle" than the 231 side.  Basically I want to get the bullet 'thumpin' down the barrel, not whomping. 

Brian

[Lone Star]

Several comments.  First, the 300 Sierra is the hardest .45 caliber bullet available.  It will not expand reliably in the .454 Casull, and it behaves as a solid out of any .45LC.  If you want an expanding bullet, go with the Speer 300 FP.  It does not over-expand at all and is the bullet i use in my M94 Trapper when I want a heavy bullet.

As for a powder, try AA-7.  It ignites easily compared to W296/H110 (both the same powder) and AA-7 gives good velocities with mid-range loads.  It does not need to be loaded near max to work like W296/H110 do.  I prefer BlueDot in my .45LCs but there is limited published data available - and I won't post non-pressure-tested data on this site.  AA-7 is close to BlueDot in speed and performance anyway.


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[B. Miville]

Hey Lone Star,

Thanks for the tip on the Speer 300 grainer.  I'll give em a look-see.

And thanks also for the powder suggestion.  I need to head out for powder anyways, and I am pretty sure the local gun shop carries Accurate Arms powders!

Guess I should also dust off the old chronograph too........ 

Brian

[stimpylu32]

Brian

You may also want to look at Unique and 2400 as powders to use , they will drop your speed to the 600 - 700 fps range , very mild loads for a rifle .

stimpy

[dpe.ahoy]

I have a Trapper Win. 94 and put a Decelerator pad on it.  That moved my nose back enough my thumb doesn't hit it.  Much easier to see if your eyes aren't waterin'!  That took the sting out of the recoil as well.  Mine was a pre-fit, but not perfect fit.  With a 300 g bullet coming out at 1400fps or more, Newton's Third Law of Motion will be in effect.  Right now I run 315g Keith SWC's on a full charge of LilGun in the Trapper and in a Rossi 454 with excellent results.  DP.

[Savage]

A little recoil is the price you pay for the light easy carrying carbine pushing the heavy bullet even at the low 1400fps velocites. If it really bothers you, you might try a somewhat lighter bullet. The 255gr LSWC hard cast is a good one.
Savage

[okie john]

10 grains of Unique under a 255-grain bullet will give you close to 1,000 fps in a Ruger Blackhawk, and quite a bit more in a long gun. That's where I'd go. You don't need a 300-grain slug to kill a deer when a 255 will shoot through one end to end.


Okie John

[B. Miville]

I had origionally chosen the 300 grain Sierra because a friend occasionally lets me hunt his balckbear bait site, and figured it might make a pretty good close range gun from the stand in addition to the Whitetail duties I have been using it for.  But I suppose the 12 ga SLug gun or .30-06 would fit the bill better in that instance.  I will consider the 255 grain bullets.  My only question about faster powders like Unique (and one origional load I had tried 231 with) is while they are great for short to long pistol barrels, are they optimum for the longer 20" barrel?  I vaugely remember an article in a gun rag about longer barrels and faster powders.  Something about faster powders stop their effective burn before the slug has exited the barrel and thus the projectile actually slows in the barrel a bit diminishing its optimum velocity.  Overall my goal would be to get the 300 grainer going in the 1000-1200 fps range, or with a 255 I think 1300 range would be good.  One shot in the field while hunting is really not the issue, it is the 20+ round range sessions that really beat me up.

Brian

[PaulS]

Barrel length has nothing to do with which powders work in the cartridge. It has only to do with the weght and construction of the bullet and the amount of space for powder with the bullet seated. Slower powders require more room because you need more powder. You don't see people loading 231 in a 30-30 pistol or 748 in a 45 Colt for just that reason.

[warrior1]

 i've got to agree they do let you know you have squeezed the trigger,but the trapper is a joy to carry. 

[Lone Star]

I put a Pachmayr slip-on pad on my M94 Trapper in .45LC - that lengthened the pull for a better stock fit (I used a RamLine stock in wet Southcentral Alaska) and it also reduced the sting upon trigger squeeze.  A much better setup IMO.


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[B. Miville]

Barrel length has nothing to do with which powders work in the cartridge. It has only to do with the weght and construction of the bullet and the amount of space for powder with the bullet seated. Slower powders require more room because you need more powder. You don't see people loading 231 in a 30-30 pistol or 748 in a 45 Colt for just that reason.

Thanks for the clarification!

Brian

[B. Miville]

I was at the local gun shop today picking up powder for a new rifle load I am working on, and on a whim decided to grab some Sierra 240gr JHC.  I used a free recoil calculator to see what a hot rod 240 gr load with 296 would be and it looks like it will cut a bit of the sting, yet still produce enough punch for the ranges I need it for, and all in an expanding bullet.

Now that our club is going to finally get their new entrance I will be dragging out the old Chrony and do some work.

Brian