Author Topic: What ever happened to External Frame Packs?? (Read 5625 times)

Frog123 · « **on:** December 18, 2002, 04:14:58 PM »

My Doc's been riding me pretty hard lately about loosing weight. I was debating joining the gym when he talked me out of it saying I probably wouldn't go because I wouldn't enjoy it, instead I should use God's gym. I live about 10 mins from a state park with several miles of trails and an overnight shelter. I've got my trusty external REI pack. I stopped by one of those super duper outdoor mogul stores to pick up a few backpacking items and while browsing noticed that there was almost no external frame packs. The sales guys spoke as if all my stuff was essentially obsolete and that I should "upgrade" if I was gonna be serious about backpacking. I bought a few things, a fuel bottle, some freeze dried meals, an extra water bottle and a book on backpacking basics. Over all I wasn't too excited with my shopping experience. It's been a while since I've had a pack on my shoulders but this is something I'd like to get back into without being made feel like my gear "isn't good enough" to get started with. :evil:

Frog

Daveinthebush · « **Reply #1 on:** December 18, 2002, 04:42:55 PM »

I would love to see someone throw a moose hind quarter into an internal framed pack!

The Cabela's Alaskan Outfitter or Guide model packs are popular up here. The extra shelf on the bottom allows heavier loads to be packed with or without the pack mounted. Without the pack you can haul chainsaws and keep your arm free incase of a fall. I have a rifle hanger bracket on the top of my frame for the rifle sling and a velcro tie at the bottom to secure my rifle. Mine is a Eureka frame that I modified to simulate the cabela's.

I also have a piece of foam pipe insulation notched and duct taped to the top of the frame as a soft rifle rest. Remove the pack, set it in front of yourself and you have a fairly steady rest.

Try short walks at first with about 20 lbs of weights in the pack. Add a little every few weeks until you get into shape.When you get up to 150 lbs give me a call and we'll go moose hunting. :grin:

Lead pot · « **Reply #2 on:** December 19, 2002, 11:49:32 AM »

HI.Dave.I just had to get a new frame pack for my last Elk hunt last year.The old Kelthy gave out.The fram tubes were just to small for heavy loadsso I got one of Cabelas Alaskan Outfitter packs,it has the room to put just about anything you think you can carry.
It was pretty pricy but when it came and looked at it it's worth it.The fram is solid,and all of the pouches on it it is verry handy.On the Elk hunt I took the pack off the frame to carry drinking water from the lake to camp,camp was about 1/2 mile so I took the six gallon can put it on first than tied on a five gallon to it and took off,HA.that lasted for agout 300 yds.climbing over the dead fall and being up at 10,500 feet the knees were like rubber bands.So I dont think I could handle your 150 lbs anymore,there was a time I could.
When I go on my walks I use a day fanny pack.That is big enough were I can put 3 mre meals in and little Dragon fly pack stove and feul,and a coupple pair of socks and a place to tie a jungle hammock and a small tarp and the .44 on the belt so I dont have all the weight hanging on my waist.That will last me for a week or more.Lp.

Quote

Dont go were the path leads,go were there is no path and leave a trail

Daveinthebush · « **Reply #3 on:** December 19, 2002, 12:51:58 PM »

Leadpot! I was kidding about the 150 pounds. My back doctor has limited me to 25lbs. Please don't tell him what I really do. Fortunately he is a hunter and understands some of the time. Wasn't happy when I started shooting my 80 lb. Person with two fingers, blew out two tendons in the wrist and ended up haveing to go to a release. My stupidity!!!!

Yea the Cabela's is a good pack. My moose hunting partner has one and I will too one of these days.

Litefoot · « **Reply #4 on:** April 25, 2003, 04:20:03 PM »

This is a good question. I'm probably the exception to this group as I like to hunt, backpack AND do some mountaineering. For the latter pursuit, An internal hugging your back is essential as an external can act like a sail. But for just about everything else, an external is more supportive and comfortable. Internals have kind of a cool factor for the young folks, AND the manufacturers feel like they can charge more for them.

ButlerFord45 · « **Reply #5 on:** April 27, 2003, 08:45:13 AM »

Just curious, is there something out there that is a vast improvement over plain ol' military issue? I always hated those things, they always meant more work :oops: , but I could never see much that could be improved on them, except the shelf could have folded up instead of being detachable, I've lost more than one. Two sizes of packs for the same frame, and I found them to be pretty darned serviceable. Plenty of pockets and lashing points. Just wondering.

Lead pot · « **Reply #6 on:** April 28, 2003, 05:07:15 PM »

Man this computer is slow tonight I had one cup of coffee and a glass of ice with something in it before this page came up.

Butler I use a Alaskan pack with a folding shelf,and a lot of tie downs and a good pack that stays dry.It is a lot better than the GI pack they issued me.It rides good and it is adjustable with a good wast band a mule would even like. Lp.

TopGun · « **Reply #7 on:** July 12, 2003, 03:34:07 PM »

I quartered and back-packed my Elk on a Bull-Pacs frame---12 miles to my truck. :grin: It's a long way! Does that qualify me to hunt moose with you? :-D Afterall, I am almost 50 yrs young.

I found it easier not to bone all the meat. The stability the leg bones provide on the pack keeps the meat from shifting. Meat that shifts even a little can destroy a man's shoulder or hip! I've never done 150, but my pack/hinds weighed an honest 135! I only go 180. :eek: I know from meeting some guys who try to back-pack, they think their packs weighs a lot more than it really does. :shock: Most men can't carry 1/2 their own body weight very far. :eek: It takes a lot of training to do that, and I have the utmost respect for any one who is a true back-pack hunter!

Rusty · « **Reply #8 on:** July 16, 2003, 01:19:16 PM »

Every time I strap mine on, I remember that there are pack horses, and wish I had one.

targshooter · « **Reply #9 on:** July 20, 2003, 05:38:51 AM »

Frog123,
I purchased a Kelty 50th Anniversary (frame) pack 4 months ago. I use 80 lbs of rock salt (2 forty lb bags) in my exercise regimen. The Kelty has held together well and is comfortable as an 85 lb rig can be. The 80 lbs was destroying my frameless pack last February after 2+ years of 73-80 lb hauling. The manufacturer repaired it for free and it is now relegated to my backwoods treks where the load is usually only about 50-60lbs with firearm included.

Losthwy · « **Reply #10 on:** August 08, 2003, 02:45:09 PM »

I have to agree externals will handle heavy loads better than internals. But there is one exception. A company call Kifaru makes a top line internal pack that is not a your everyday backpack. Kifaru makes packs and accessories design for the hunter (and some for the military). Without question the best pack out there for hunting use.
www.kifaru.net/HUNTHOME.HTM

jradloff · « **Reply #11 on:** September 05, 2003, 08:27:07 AM »

I have found that externals are a problem at airports and don't pack well. I have had frames bent and busted from the baggage handlers. I went with an internal on my last trek to Peru and it held up well through the airports and baggage handlers. Anytime you get over 50 lbs. in the pack it seems to magnifiy with every 100 yrds especilly up hill.

alpini · « **Reply #12 on:** September 06, 2003, 04:02:32 AM »

I haven't used mine in a long time. I can see where there might be airport problems though. I've heard good about the Dana's and a few others. I tend to over look mine whenever I get to thinking about backpacking somewhere.
I don't think I'll be using my externals for anything but loaners and freighters. I do have a child-size one for kids that gets used some.

Desertrat · « **Reply #13 on:** November 26, 2003, 03:54:20 PM »

Yes....Kelty still makes external frame packs...and some of the highest quality around. I lived down the street from Dick Kelty when I was a kid in Glendale, Calif.

http://www.kelty.com/Kelty/index.cfm?fuseaction=Packs.Home

Robert · « **Reply #14 on:** November 26, 2003, 04:24:56 PM »

for just kicking around...those little day packs are sweet. I prefer them to a suitcase any day of the week. Plus..they dont put holes in the ceiling upolstery of your car.

bayloralum1996 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 01, 2004, 05:52:59 PM »

losthwy,.....
since you live in golden, where kifaru is made, you wouldn't be biased would you?

Dusty Miller · « **Reply #16 on:** June 06, 2004, 09:47:11 PM »

I've still got my old Alpinlight out in the garage that I used to take to the high Sierra SO MANY years ago!! It was strong as could be and I wore it for far too many hours per day with too much weight (and my knees tell me about it every once in awhile!). Ah, fond memories.

Eddie in Delta · « **Reply #17 on:** April 07, 2005, 06:39:08 PM »

I realize that this long after the thread ended, but I would like to say I LIKE internal frame packs. I find that I pack my gear better, distribute weight more evenly, and get a better fit from an internal. In my experience, the internals make me have better posture while hiking than externals do.

They do have some drawbacks as mentioned before, but I like internals better overall.

Then again, I am a member of the "younger generation." I'll probably complain when the trend switches back to externals in the future.

Eddie

willysjeep134 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 11, 2005, 07:46:38 PM »

I think that camping equipment is sort of converging in design between brands due to technology, to some extent. I have an old Kelty aluminum external frame with a Boyscout catalog camper packbag. I tore up two hip belts before I figured out how to properly mount them. (This is when I was like 11) I hiked many miles with it. To be honest, with my normal load it is perfectly fine for me. With a good proper hip belt it can be far more comfortable than the old military packs with simple belts and sparse padding. More modern military ALICE packs are pretty good, but a bit short for real freight packing in my opinion. Good thing I don't have to use one.

Of course, I am also not afraid of packing a distance with a canvas softsided rucksack as well. I tailor my loads to my pack and the conditions, and just live with having to shift the weight around to get comfortable.

Nobody seems to be offering external frames because they aren't cool any more. Simple as that. If camping equipment hinged on sheer practicality there wouldn't be so much junk in sporting goods stores. Some people prefer more modern designs, but that doesn't mean the old designs are useless. If you really wanted an external frame pack, Campmor has a free catalog with gajillions of packs and bags in it. If anybody had an external frame pack they would, I think.

Yukon Gold · « **Reply #19 on:** April 12, 2005, 04:06:19 AM »

External framed packs were, and still is the best for very heavy loads. You can still buy them for expedition type outings - and the good ones are very pricey. One bad aspect for them is the relatively high center of gravity, and difficulty in navigating when walking on very difficult terrain.

Internal framed packs are better for moderate loads (which fits the bill for 99% of us) - as long as you are not trying to carry something big or bulky (like an animal). Their flex and fit makes for a more comfortable load.

If I was planning to carry out an animal - go with the external frames, for camping/hiking - internal.

BeanMan · « **Reply #20 on:** November 25, 2005, 02:53:46 PM »

best of both worlds:

I have a cabelas freighter for packing out elk, mattra fact I used it last week.

When backpacking I use a internal frame. I have yet to see external with as good a harness system as a quality internal (mines a Lowe).

When I Backpack into my archery camp I carry the external freighter frame on the outside of my internal, upside down with the the hip belt fastened around the top of the internal.

BeanMan

hellbilly075 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 30, 2006, 01:34:29 AM »

I have an Aether360 internal farme that I wouldnt trade for any other pack out there. The hip belt and sternum strap carries weight nicely. I am trying to go lighter say around 50 lbs for a four day. I was just wondering if any of you ultra lighters out there happened to notice that unlike everything else the more you pay for ultralight gear the less you get, namely my 300$ 2 1/2 lb 0 degree bag and 25$ Snow Peak cup.
I was on a with my wife one day on one of her thrift store trips (yawn) and happened upon a Kelty external frame for 5$ (wow wee!) and bought it. I dont know what model it is but looks well put together. I havent used it yet though. What is really cool though is that you can take the pack off and use it as a packframe, something you cant do with an internal frame pack. -Hellbilly :twisted:

Coppertop · « **Reply #22 on:** September 15, 2006, 09:22:43 AM »

Bull packs in Idaho makes a good pack frame that is external and well built.

Lead pot · « **Reply #23 on:** January 11, 2007, 04:12:07 PM »

Well since my last post in April 03 I came to mind that a change was needed

I spent all summer up in Alaska again looking for that yellow iron I came to the conclusion at age 67 I was getting a little soft so I retired that frame pack and got a new frame pack called a Polaris 500

man what I have missed all of these years.
But I'm not throwing away the old pack I might want to hunt in the wilderness again and might have to park the Polaris at the gate to pack in were the big Elk roam.

Kurt

Thebear_78 · « **Reply #24 on:** January 11, 2007, 10:38:30 PM »

This is how I try to stay in shape for thos pack hunts. Believe it or not 36lbs of kid, another 10lbs or bundling to keep him warm and two gallon jugs of water actually turns out to be a pretty heavy load. If you think having some weight shift around in your pack sucks, try constantly shifting and occasionally grabbing a nearby branch, kid got quite a kick out of that one. I don't tend to shoot much game with a jabbering 3yr old on my back but it gets me out of the house and he seems to enjoy it.

Lead pot · « **Reply #25 on:** January 12, 2007, 08:55:42 AM »

My hat's off to you for doing that, even at his age he will some day say to you do you, remember when you carried me in a pack when we went hunting.
My Son did that about 30 years later.
Just remember next time give him a hat his ears are getting red

Kurt

burntmuch · « **Reply #26 on:** January 12, 2007, 10:06:57 AM »

Something i do is use a frame. but i mount a smaller internal frame pack 3500cu & a smaller fanny pack to it. so when i get all my gear to spike camp i can use one of the smaller packs for day hunts. the weight doesnt shift around either. Yeah an elk quarter is kinda heavy for an internal frame pack. Seeya

SharonAnne · « **Reply #27 on:** April 28, 2008, 06:25:28 PM »

i hunted with a Jansport D2 pack for 20 yrs. i lost when i was way late on my storage unit rent and all my gear was sold. I have purchased 3 D2s on Ebay so I won't ever be without one again

alsatian · « **Reply #28 on:** August 19, 2008, 11:06:09 AM »

Frog: I just completed a 35 mile backpacking trip in the Weminuche Wilderness area of SW Colorado, altitude 8.000' to 12,850', using such an "obsolete" external frame pack. It worked pretty good for me. No drawbacks that I was aware of. Additionally, my son used a new Gregory "Whitney" internal frame pack. I had to lash the rolled up ThermARest pads on the top of my pack because there was nothing on the Whitney to attach to!!!

I will say that there is a possible draw back to using very old equipment, however. Everything gets old and degrades. While I had no problem, I did wonder if the nylon packbag of my external frame pack -- more than 25 years old -- might have weakened over time and might just rip into shreds under heavy loads. It didn't happen, but at some point age just is going to catch up with any piece of equipment.

Dand · « **Reply #29 on:** November 01, 2008, 10:29:27 PM »

I have used a Camp Trails Wolf Pack since I bought it in 1975 or 76 - can't remember when. It has taken a lot of abuse and held up well. I have packed a number of caribou in it over the years and worry if I ever have to replace it.

Kelty still makes external frames but I like my camp trails as the upper bars are configured to give your head some room.

Barney's Sport Chalet in Anchorage Alaska still has a Moose Pack and Frame made last time I visited the store. They are a bit pricey but look solid. Their website is pretty limited right now but here's a link for contact info.
http://www.barneyssports.com/

The times I wish I knew more about internals is when I'm packing camp gear in thick alders - the frame pack is nasty for getting tangled. I think a good internal would slip thru the brush easier but not with a moose or caribou quarter aboard.