Misfires in T/C Emcore

[Duckhunter39480]

I recently purchased a 358 Win. Encore barrel and I have experienced high percentage of misfires; upwards of 50%.  I am using handloads and I don't know where to go from here.  I used Federal 308 Win. brass for my first reloads and experienced a few misfires with these.  I then obtained some new 358 Winchester brass and the problem is worse with these than the reformed 308's.

There is a small (read shallow) dent in the primer on all cases.  I like the rifle/barrel combo; it is very accurate.  I just can't hunt with a gun that only fires 50% of the time. 

Any suggestions on where to look for the problem.

[ms]

I recently purchased a 358 Win. Encore barrel and I have experienced high percentage of misfires; upwards of 50%.  I am using handloads and I don't know where to go from here.  I used Federal 308 Win. brass for my first reloads and experienced a few misfires with these.  I then obtained some new 358 Winchester brass and the problem is worse with these than the reformed 308's.

There is a small (read shallow) dent in the primer on all cases.  I like the rifle/barrel combo; it is very accurate.  I just can't hunt with a gun that only fires 50% of the time. 

Any suggestions on where to look for the problem.

    Do you have a hammer extension on it ?

[Duckhunter39480]

Yes.  I also have a 260X444 barrel that I use with the same frame.  I have never had a problem with that barrel.  I can't see that as the cause but it may be.

[yooper77]

I am willing to bet if you remove the extension all your misfires will go away.

I have an older blue frame without the swing hammer and no extension.  I have never had any problems with any of my seven barrels.

I bought an extension, but will never use it because of the misfire problems I have heard about and T/C doesn't recommend them at all.

I have enough clearance to pull the hammer back, so I am satisfied with my setup.

Also, could be a headspace problem, since you are now dealing with a beltless cartridge but probably not.

yooper77

[Duckhunter39480]

It seems that this is a common problem with using hammer extensions.  I'll remove it and see if it corrects the problem. 

Thanks for the tip.  I'll let you guys know tomorrow evening.

[okieshooter]

I do not know as much as most on this site but I have heard about headspace problems switching between barrels. I have seen a kit of spacers to take care of these problems. If removing the extension does not help it may be something worth asking about as someone here can surely refer you to the steps to fix a headspace problem. Wish I knew more about these things.

[Selmer]

I would guess that's it's a headspace issue and you are setting your shoulder too far back.  This results in some of the energy that should be detonating the primer being wasted on driving the entire cartridge forward in the chamber until it stops.  The 260x444 won't have this problem because that case headspaces on the rim, which tends to be more effective with the break-action rifles.  There is a certain place on the internet where this is explained in great detail, but the mention of it "ist verboten!" by GB.
Selmer

[Duckhunter39480]

I've read the article about headspace and resizing to fit a chamber but the problem here is that the 358 Winchester brass and the 308 Winchester brass has a datum line (point on shoulder where headspace is determined) that is already set when I buy the brass.  I can't increase this length without some extraordinary steps to "fire form" a new shoulder on the cartridge.  In addition, I can't believe that this particular manufacturer cut the chamber too deep so as to create this problem.  I am going to assume (you know where this usually leads) that the chamber is correct.  I've already measured the barrel face to breach distance with my feeler gauge and it is in the .001 to .002 range.  I do not believe that this is the problem problem.  If I can get 6 rounds to fire with a misfire, I believe that the hammer extension is the problem.  I'll shoot without it, especially when I'm hunting.  I'll let you know tonight.

[Selmer]

Then in that case, you're probably right.  I have also installed the heavier hammer spring on my frame, I did it as soon as I bought it, along with stronger lug springs as well.  I didn't think they'd make much difference, but I bought a Coyote Guns .357 Max barrel and with heavier, not maximum loads, but heavier loads, the frame would spring open!  I had an extra lug spring in the toolbox, I installed it and it locks up tight as a drum now, no unexpected and disconcerting opening-on-firing!
Selmer

[Duckhunter39480]

I had visitors and it started rain as they were leaving so I couldn't go to the range this afternoon.  However, I did prime five cases and fired them off in the garage.  I removed the hammer extension as you guys recommended and all five of them fired without any misfires.  I believe you have solved my problem.

Now, Selmer mentioned some heavier hammer springs.  I have two questions, 1.) are they difficult to install and 2.) where do you get them?  I can live with the hammer without the extension but I like it and I have better control of the firearm with the hammer extension.

Thanks all for your help.  Now I can get back to working up a load for the 358 Winchester.  I'm learning to love the bigger bores, they are fun.

[JON8777]

I know I am going to get ALOT of flak for this but...

Send it back to TC, get the swing hammer installed for $70?? (if I remeber) and have them set it for 3.5#. Buddy had the same exact problem with his 25-06 and 308, got the frame back from TC, loaded the dimpled cases and they fired.

[Selmer]

They are very easy to install, instructions and pictures are on the forbidden site.  That is also where you obtain them.  I have NEVER had a misfire in 7 years of shooting my Encore, all fired with the heavier hammer spring.
Selmer

[Duckhunter39480]

Thanks for the info on the springs. 

[yooper77]

JON8777,

Do you know if T/C did anything to his frame other than change the hammer?

I have an older blue Encore frame that I bought new in 1997 and everything is factory.

I was thinking about the swing hammer conversion, but I don't want T/C to make the hammer heavier to pull back.

My hammer weight now is perfect and the trigger is crisp.

yooper77

[Duckhunter39480]

Another report on the misfire problem.  As indicated, I removed the hammer extension and tried it on five primed cases.  It worked flawlessly.  Today, I went to the range and fired off another 10 or 11 rounds.  Perfect!  No misfires; just the bang you expect every time the hammer falls. 

Thank you again for fixin' my Encore.  I just didn't want to send it off now with hunting season just around the corner.   

Now if I can get the 35/30-30 Improved brass fireformed with my new Contender barrel, everything will be right with the world.  You guys don't go anywhere, I may need your help again.