Neck shots with a 357 and JHPs

[300grJHP]

I'd like to use my 357 for deer this year.  I've read that it's marginal for chest shots.  How would it be if I took center-mass neck shots using 125 gr JHP gold dots, at about 1600fps, out to 50 yds.?  I'd think it would pretty much drop any deer in his tracks, and then once down, I could always put a heavy cast in him for good measure.  Does anyone have experience using light-weight, high velocity JHPs for neck shots on deer?

thanks

[Skeeterbaymac]

Just my 2 cents but......  I wouldn't do it.  I don't know how big your deer are and that would make a difference.  Ours are big enough that if I chose to use a 357 mag I would use 160-180 grain bullets.  Although I have never used the 125 grain bullet for deer.  I think the bullet may not stay together or penetrate deep enough for any shot on a deer.  If it were me I would go with a heavier bullet. Keep my distance under 50 yards and try for a broad side shot.  I like the 357 mag. It's a great round but I find it lacks for big game.  I have shot both deer and black bear with one before and I wont do it again.  I find the 41 mag and bigger are better for hunting big game YMMV.

[TCPETE]

I would go with the heavy bullets and shoot behind the shoulder. I think you will be surprised how effective it will be.

[Mikey]

(1): Forget the hollow-points and just go with the cast.  (2):  Forget neck shots or head shots - give yourself the biggest target possible.  (3):  The only thing marginal about the 357 and cast bullets is the shooter.  Mikey.

[Graybeard]

Jerry Lester is our resident expert on the use of .357 on deer. He's taken a bunch with it and says the Remington 158 JSP is the way to go. I've never used the .357 on deer as I have far more appropriate rounds to use so just haven't used it to see how it might work.

I am NOT a fan of neck shots tho regardless of the gun used. Unless you absolutely know their anatomy to know where the spine is at any given point you wish to place the bullet there is not little immediately lethal in there. Sure IF you know where to place the bullet and do it correctly it's instant lights out. Do you REALLY know? Hint it's really not center of mass.

Neck shots can and do work well for those who know the proper bullet placement. They work very poorly for those who don't.

[Glanceblamm]

I don't even own a .357 but have taken plenty of deer.
I would say +4 on those last four posts.

[buck460XVR]

I have taken 4 deer with a .357. All were shot in the boiler room. All went less that 40 yards. All shots were under 35 yards.

[hoggunner]

If you are going to limit your shots to 50 yrds then why use a lighter bullet. the advantage to lighter, faster is flatter thats why we go light and fast. at 50 yrds use the heavest bullet and go for the boiler room (the biggest target). you won't notice the drop of the heaver bullet at 50 yrds, not much anywho.
thats my 2 cents and I am sticking to it.
Hoggunner.

[Ahab]

I've taken my share of Whitetail with the .357 using 180gr bullits.

[Redhawk1]

Jerry Lester is our resident expert on the use of .357 on deer. He's taken a bunch with it and says the Remington 158 JSP is the way to go. I've never used the .357 on deer as I have far more appropriate rounds to use so just haven't used it to see how it might work.

I am NOT a fan of neck shots tho regardless of the gun used. Unless you absolutely know their anatomy to know where the spine is at any given point you wish to place the bullet there is not little immediately lethal in there. Sure IF you know where to place the bullet and do it correctly it's instant lights out. Do you REALLY know? Hint it's really not center of mass.

Neck shots can and do work well for those who know the proper bullet placement. They work very poorly for those who don't.

Thanks Graybeard, I don't like hearing of people wanting to take neck shots. I agree 100%

[rickt300]

I don't hesitate to take neck shots with a very accurate rifle as I know where to hit em but with a 357 All others touting the heavier bullets and chest hits have my vote.

[Sverre A.]

I have shot some african animals with 6"/158 gr. XTP - and can`t say anything else that the bullet performed very well.

Now I want to try my 4" - and Cast Performance 200 gr.

Somebody who have shot some deers with 158 XTP`s and CP`s 200 gr. - so they can give me a "go - or not a go" with CP instead of XTP?

[COR]

Sverre--You answered your own question.  If you killed African animals with the 158XTP why would you change a thing, how tough do you think whitetails are?  I like the XTP of any .4 caliber for deer but it sounds like the .357 works for you.

To the original poster...shot placement, shot placement, shot placement and don't run your gun with 2 different loads, that's senseless, KISS principle applies here.  That 125gr will kill a whitetail, but maybe not the ideal bullet...maybe try those heavier XTP's and see. As far as neck shots go, I shoot for the boiler maker, neck shots are iffy and the guys who like them don't tell you what happens with a clean thru and thru with a cast bullet when it isn't snowing.

[Sverre A.]

Yes - I`m satisfied with the XTP in the 357.
I`m also satisfied with XTP in 44 Mag and 454 - but I`m more satisfied with hard cast - because of the better penetration.

Maybe I would be more happy with 200 gr. HC in 357 too 

[Davemuzz]

The "probability" of NOT hitting the spine or brain on a head\neck shot, and thus not inflicting a mortal wound, is much greater than the probability of HITTING a vital organ in the chest and inflicting a mortal wound.

You have a lot more vital organs to "hit" in the chest cavity.....a larger target area to "wander off of dead center" than you do the head\neck target area.

I saw a fellow take a 30 or 40 yard head shot at a doe last year. She was in brush. The bullet either hit some brush and deflected some, or he was just a bad shot. Either way that deer died.....somewhere.....some day. He never recovered it.

We can pile on more stories.....but the statements in my first two paragraphs are indisputable. And, of course I would agree with all of the above posters. I throw in my 2 cents as it was a damn shame to watch that doe run. Knowing it was going to expire and knowing it wasn't going to be recovered. All for a foolish head shot.

Dave

[Badnews Bob]

I don't like lite bullets in my .357, They shhot well and print nice groups BUT they just don't hit as hard as the heaveir 180s. They are not marginal on chest shots, cast bullets have cleared both sides every time I've ever shot one. Most taking out some ribs on the way.

I have also shot deer with a .44 SRH, It work very well also, the only real diffrence I saw was a bigger hole by the .44.

[.357 shooter]

No on neck shots period, to risky and too small a target. Forget the hollow points. Get yourself some good soft points. 158 grains are fine and place it in the boiler room just behind the shoulder = Dead deer.

[Davemuzz]

I haven't looked at the downrange energy levels for the 357 magnum because I don't use that caliber to hunt deer with. But just a SWAG on my part.....I wouldn't go beyond 50 yards with that caliber. I think that's the advantage with the calibers that begin with a "4". You have more short range, and long range energy in the bullet your shooting. But again, I'm not looking at any 357 energy data.....I'm just plain guessin.

Dave

[petemi]

I guess if a deer were standing directly under my tree stand, I'd try a head/neck shot, only because he was too close to get a heart/double lunger.  I agree with all the above.  Shoot close, shoot big, fast, bullets.  Put them in the heart and lungs and then pick up your deer.

We seem to have a preoccupation with trying to kill deer with the smallest bullet.  Guys!!! think about it!  Turn it around and kill deer with the largest bullet and work down from there.  You don't want to use a 125 gr. SJHP in a .357 for deer.   

Here we go!!!!!  STOP!!!  I know how many deer have been killed with itty bitty loads.  My granddad killed probably a hundred deer with a .22 years ago when there were no regulations.  Virtually any bullet will kill a deer.  What we're talking about is a clean kill at reasonable range.  Go for the heavy bullet, and hit "center of the mass"..heart, lungs.

If you were going to put him out with a heavy cast bullet, why wouldn,t you just shoot him with it to begin with, and save your pop gun load to put behind his ear if needed.  Most likely not.

[Davemuzz]

I guess if a deer were standing directly under my tree stand, I'd try a head/neck shot, only because he was too close to get a heart/double lunger. 

Well, here is where I would respectfully disagree with you. Actually, if you can take the head shot, then why not just take the "tween the shoulders shot". Yeah, you will take out a few chops here, but you will either hit the spine and drop 'em like a rock or miss left or right....and either way the miss will hit at worse a lung and at best a lung and the heart. Any way you look at it a "miss" between the shoulders will down it. A "miss" at the neck has a higher percentage of a deer receiving a fatal wound, but not dying for a week or more.

MHO

Dave

[crossfire]

"We seem to have a preoccupation with trying to kill deer with the smallest bullet.  Guys!!! think about it!  Turn it around and kill deer with the largest bullet and work down from there.  You don't want to use a 125 gr. SJHP in a .357 for deer." (quote petemi)

With all due respect, I submit that the opposite is true with handguns. Everyone is all hot for the biggest, baddest, fastest .40 to .50 caliber and claims the lowly .357 is no longer enough; never mind that history proves otherwise. I've used both the 125gr and 158gr Remington SJHP in an 8" Dan Wesson M15-2 and both work fine as long as you aren't relying on wimpy factory loads meant for 3" barrel CCW revolvers. The trick with the .357 is the same as with any handgun; range and shot placement. Don't fault the caliber for the shortcomings of the shooter. I would never recommend neck shots under any circumstance.
300grJHP, you should be able to get far better than 1600 fps with a 125gr bullet, depending on the handgun you are using. Loads are out there to drive a 158gr bullet almost that fast. See www.handloads.com