Well we went out to the lease last wednesday and I just got back. I saw many good bucks but am looking for a particular non typical giant. The rut is definitly not on yet. However the three of us were all instructed by our wives to take at least one doe apiece. Since we all left the lease today we took our does this morning. All weighed around 90 pounds, not big but some nice venison. The first was hit in the back of the head with 150 grain Ballistic Tip from a 308 by Kenny, the bullet came out the deers mouth. The second was shot by Tommy with a 270 I set up for him shooting 130 grain Nosler solid base bullets pushed a bit over 2800fps. He is not really very experienced. He shot his doe behind the shoulder but it was anglling sharply toward him facing his right. The solid base angled across the deer thru it's right lung, diaphram stomach contents and it went thru part of it's left hindquarter and ended up under the hide weighing 111 grains and well expanded. The energy it applied made the deer look swelled up in the midsection. This deer dropped with hardly a twitch. My doe was hit close behind the shoulder just under the shoulder blade. It came out after going thru the lungs and the meaty part of the offside shoulder between the shoulder blade and upper leg bone not hitting either. It made a 1 inch exit hole. My bullet was a 140 grain Nolser Partition loaded to 2800 fps from my 7x57. There was some spine damage and my deer also dropped, flipped her tail a couple times and was done. "Bang Flops" are not that hard to come by.