Author Topic: .44 mag question (Read 1779 times)

Badnews Bob · « **on:** October 09, 2008, 08:06:39 AM »

I am kinda new loading for .44s and I have a question about lite loads, can you load lite or say .44 special loads in magnum cases?

I do this alot in .357s but just not to sure how lite I can go with that big of a case without detonation problems.

Got any pet loads for just bustin cans and the like?

I am down in my back for awhile but I'd like to get some trigger time in with my .44 but don't wanna beat myself up to soon.

BTW I'll be useing a Ruger SRH and a NEF handie rifle. Thanks

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** October 09, 2008, 09:01:49 AM »

Well yes and NO!

What ya gotta understand is those reloading manuals put out those reciepes of theirs for a reason. That reason is YOUR SAFETY and when you just start to indiscriminately reducing powder charges assuming it's OK YOUR SAFETY is what's at stake.

Some powders do well with reduced loads even loads below what the books recommend and some DO NOT do well being reduced below that level. Do you know the difference in which do and which do not take to lower charges? If you do then chances are you'll be OK. If you don't chances are you will not be OK.

Unique and 2400 are a couple of powders that seem to take well to loading lighter than recommended in the .44 mag case without running pressures up. I think I recall (but don't bet the farm on it) that so did the 4227s.

H110/W296 and most if not all other ball powders DO NOT TAKE WELL TO LIGHT LOADING so don't do it with them.

Bottom line find a loading manual recommended light load and use it don't just strike out on your own assuming it's OK to put less powder in that the books say to.

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #2 on:** October 09, 2008, 09:38:03 AM »

I read the books first GB and I take your advice seriously, I also understand diffrent powders have totally diffrent characters, I am just feeling around for some personal experiances from the deep well we have here. If something dosen't sound right or goes against everything I've ever read, I won't try it.

Right now I can only stand to load ten or fifteen rounds at a time then I gotta rest so lurking around here and learning something is a big part of my day. BTW Thanks to you GB and your Wife and Matt for giving me someplace to go while I am laid up.

Graybeard · « **Reply #3 on:** October 09, 2008, 10:07:52 AM »

For a mild .44 magnum load I usually use 17.5 grains of 2400 but my old best friend (now deceased) used to load as light as 12.5 grains in .44 mag cases. I never ran his loads over a chrono but for sure that's down in .44 special territory. He shot a bunch of them and never blew up his guns so I suspect they were OK as 2400 is or seems to be a very versatile powder for loading light. Many here use Unique for the same purposes and it too works well. Loads for it are all over the place so since I don't recall I'll not try to list them.

Mike Britton · « **Reply #4 on:** October 09, 2008, 12:37:50 PM »

I shoot 15 gr. of 2400 under a 200 gr. cast Keith style SWC in my M29. It shoots OK. It's not as accurate in that barrel as full house, but I suspect it's just that barrel. Not as much recoil as full house, more than factory .44 SPL., but I think that the big guys are still loading .44 SPL WAAY down for all the old single actions.

Sir Charles deMoutonBlack · « **Reply #5 on:** October 09, 2008, 03:40:42 PM »

How low do you want to go? There are some modest loads, in the 850-1000 fps range with TITEGROUP or TRAIL BOSS.

The HODGDON's 2008 Annual Manual shows the following;

200 gr LRNFP cast Col 1.570" Bbl length 8.275" Win cases Remington 2 1/2 primer

TITEGROUP 5.0 gr 878fps 11,000CUP 6.6 gr. 1061 fps 17,300CUP

TRAIL BOSS 6.1 gr 890 fps 17,900 PSI 7.7 gr 988 fps 20,700PSI

UNIVERSAL, CLAYS, 231, & HP38 are also listed with modest pressures. Other bullets/weights are listed in the manual. These loads are similar to .44 Spl.

As Hodgdon also markets IMR powders, there are some listings for some IMR powders.

Pleas verify these, as I am only a "hunten-peck" typist.

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #6 on:** October 10, 2008, 03:14:13 AM »

Sir Charles That's what I am wanting, I must have over looked some of these when I was reading. Sad part is I think I'm gonna need some more bullets lightest I have are 240. I know I can use them but I really want some mouse fart loads because of where I'll be shooting them.

I believe that even light loads can improve your skills if you practice with the firearms you will be using.

Right now I can't make it to the range so the fifty or so paces I have in my yard is all I have, It has a good backstop and is plenty safe. But I don't want to alienate the neighbours, with booming magnums.

Ak.Hiker · « **Reply #7 on:** October 10, 2008, 04:56:36 AM »

Since you are laid up with time on your hands look up some of the published Skeeter Skelton loads. I think he had some good every day working loads that were middle of the road. I have been interested in heavy weight bullets at reduced velocities. I just tried out a mild load using the 300 grain Sierra JSP with 9.2 grains of AA#2. The interesting thing about this load is that it is much easier for me to control than the factory 240's but still hits hard. Several years ago I messed around with the Sierra 250 grain FPJ loaded down to about 900 or so. These were very mild and lots of fun to shoot. The Hodgon loading manuel has quite a few low pressure loads listed. Using a 240 grain LSWC cast bullet and a starting load of 6.5 grains of Universal looks mild. This one is listed at a velocity of 852 and 11,700 CUP. This is a starting load so I sure would not go lower. How about a 165 grain LRNFP Cast bullet with a starting load of 6.5 grains of Universal. This one is only running at a velocity of 918 and 7700 CUP. You should double check the Hodgen on line site to double check these loads to be safe. I got them out of the 2004 manual.

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2008, 10:38:13 AM »

I used to load E&E cast lead 180 grain flat points with unique for the wife to shoot in a 44.They performed great plenty accurate for casual plinking loads. If you want the recoil down concern yourself with the weight of projo not just the powder charge and the 44 mag can become a real mouse gun. The weight of my redhawk and the light load made it a pet I would trust in any hand that understood gun saftey. My loads would have most likely came from a lyman cast bullet reloading book. When it comes to lead and reduced loads there is no second place to a lyman book in my humble opinion. With time I could look up the load but it would be a day or two. Nearly all of my 44 mag and light loads have been done with unique. Why burn 17- 20 grains if 7-12 will do and produce accurate safe loads. One word of caution that should be mentioned, big cases and small charges leave lots of room for mistakes, ie double charges. I know some only load bulkier charges like 4227 for this reason. Double check each round with a pen light and before seating bullets to avoid this problem. Unique is dirty but the rounds per pound and versitility is tough to beat. Your results may vary. Good luck on healing up the back and getting plinking time. SN

45-70.gov · « **Reply #9 on:** October 22, 2008, 06:59:41 AM »

i use 2 to 3 grains of bulleye when fire lapping but don't depend on my memory

ask Veral i used what he recommend but that was long ago

they were fun and i recovered and recast most slugs ..made plywood bullet trap

280g wfn

why not use special load data and seat bullet deep so as to reduce case capacity

i deep seat reduced loads as a way to identify them any way

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #10 on:** October 23, 2008, 02:42:33 AM »

Deep seating sounds interesting, make it think its in special case more or less, I am gonning to try and pick up some lighter bullets also, right now the lightest I have are 240s.

docmagnum357 · « **Reply #11 on:** November 02, 2008, 02:10:26 PM »

I use 18.5 grains of 2400 under a Lee 240 grain swc. It is accurate as any load I have ever shot with my 44 magnums, but I hate gas checks and The metplat is a lot smaller than I would like to see. I am about to give up and use this bullet all the time, though, because it is so accurate at different velocities, with different powders. Good bullet, good powder charge.

jhalcott · « **Reply #12 on:** November 02, 2008, 04:05:57 PM »

bob, you can also use 120 grain roundballs seated over several different powders. loads as low as 2.9 grains of bullseye for 550+fps. 3.6 grains of unique gets about 566 fps. Greendot , and 231 are in this area too. You didn't (or I missed it) if you are using cast or jacketed. A mouse fart load with a jacketed bullet can be a problem. A bullet CAN be stopped in the bore and a jacketed on is VERY hard to push out.

Autorim · « **Reply #13 on:** November 03, 2008, 02:30:27 PM »

For the lightest loads, I would go for Trail Boss. It is very clean burning and consistent. Maybe not quite as accurate as heavier loads and 2400 or 4227, but plenty accurate for fun shooting. I use it in .38 spl,.44 mag, .45AR and .45LC with good results in all. It is designed for reduced loads and a double charge would be really easy to spot.

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #14 on:** November 04, 2008, 01:47:26 AM »

I do believe I have some balls around, using those would be like the gallery loads of old.

I also just picked up some Trail boss, I know the cas guys use it alot and thats along the lines of shooting I am doing right now.

jlchucker · « **Reply #15 on:** November 04, 2008, 02:31:51 AM »

what Greybeard said. You might try some of the lighter (published in loading manuals) loads that call for the Lyman 429215 gascheck bullet that weighs out at around 215 grains. I've had real good luck with this one in a Winchester trapper carbine, out to 100 yd. I don't hunt with this rifle or load, but if it was all I had I wouldn't feel undergunned at that distance, since you'd be getting something in the vicinity of slightly warm 44-40 ballistics--plenty for whitetails and such.

blhof · « **Reply #16 on:** November 04, 2008, 01:08:54 PM »

I 2nd the round balls and Bullseye or Unique. I've used both and it's an inexpensive and fun shooting session, like shooting noisy 22's. I cast my own ball ammo and the only cost is primers and powder, You also get many reloads with the brass, due to lower pressure.

rp85 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 04, 2008, 03:27:11 PM »

hello;

7.0 gr ww231/ 258 gr. cast bullet/ haus mold. very, very accurate. very mild load.

rp

rays89 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 16, 2008, 04:39:11 AM »

Instead of worrying about load work on the projectile. The lighter the bullet the less recoil. For example my pet load is a 180 grain bullet 29 grains of W296 The muzzle flash and blast is incredible. But it is very accurate and burns cooler than factory loads and it is manageable. From what I know W296 has one recomended load so you can't load light with this powder. But there are other powders to work with. On the other side of the spectrum I have made loads using 300 grain bullets loaded with IMR 4227. There is very little flash and report. But the recoil is rather heavy and they shoot low.
So the only advice I can give is use a light bullet and Use your reloading manual as a reference to the word. There you will find a manageable load

BBF · « **Reply #19 on:** November 16, 2008, 05:47:11 AM »

I am intrigued with using the ball. Do you stick some lube over the top similar as in cap and ball loads?

Sir Charles deMoutonBlack · « **Reply #20 on:** November 16, 2008, 02:19:58 PM »

BBF; I've done that for pistol loads. Seat the ball flush with the case mouth which leaves a bit of a groove around the edges. I just rubbed some lube, Bore Butter 'cause I had some, into the groove.

For SASS shooting there must be projectile visible in front of the case. My solution with blackpowder was to drop and compress a load with a wad cut from waxed milk carton, then a pea sized blob of SPG under the ball. You can size, in a regular lubrisizer, a ball to groove diameter. Frinstance, a .440, or even a .451, ball sized to .429 for a .44 case. Seat the sized ball 'til the bright band left by the sizer is pressed just inside the case. Smokeless doesn't support the ball from beneath like BP does, but a wrap of teflon plumbing tape will provide enough lube-action in a smokeless "fad powder" load.

For a better balance with the roundball in a pistol, try a .44 special or even a .44 Russian case. In a rifle, OAL and feeding problems will be a limiting factor.

For a .45 round, get a 155grain EPP-UGG, "Big-Lube tm" mold from Dick Dastardly or bullets from Springfield Slim. It is the same weight as a .45 roundball. They come as a 6 cavity LEE mould. (I wished they had one in .430, but no luck yet!)

http://www.biglube.com/

In a pistol lighter projectiles almost always strike lower than heavier ones.

In a rifle there will almost always be a very noticeable difference, but each design of rifle is a law to its self.

inluvwithsara · « **Reply #21 on:** November 16, 2008, 02:43:27 PM »

I load 300 grain Meister lead bullets with about 9 grains of Unique...nice and mellow