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Offline mtbugle

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cool barrel system
« on: November 23, 2008, 06:13:37 PM »
Reading my new shooting times and the article Carbon's Next Step is about carbon fiber barrels that transfer heat about four times as fast as steel. First I thought great for my AR, but then got to thinking about even handi's in a hot dog town would benefit.  This seems to be done by Advanced barrrel systems and is spendy. Have any heard of this before? Does anyone have first hand experience with this?  Thanks Don.
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Offline trotterlg

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2008, 07:17:57 PM »
Some one would have to show me some real numbrs to prove that any carbon or plastic could transfer heat faster than steel does.  This sounds a lot like an article written the appease a major advertiser to me.  Gun magazines are the Whores of the shooting world, they will publish anything that will bring in a few bucks in advertising.  Kind of sad, but you cannot believe anything you read in them unless you have tried it your self.  Larry
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Offline LaOtto222

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2008, 12:19:14 AM »
I read the article. There have been carbon fiber barrels for 10/22's for some time. I am not sure how they perform. They do lighten a barrel considerably. While they do promise weight reduction, I am not so sure about the heat reduction and barrel straightness. If there are any stresses in the carbon fiber wrap at all, when it heats it will warp. I know they talk about the way the wrap it takes out any warp, but like was said I would have to see it my self or have several independent people say it works before I would spend that kind of money to get a barrel done. Time will be the judge. If they are still around in 5 years, they are probably going to make a go of it. 
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Offline Jimbo47

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2008, 12:24:00 AM »
Wouldn't make much sense for a Handi with $$$ involved, especially when they have a hard time getting barrels to fit consistently from one receiver to the other from the factory.

No hi-tech stuff please!

Baby steps would be nice though!
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Offline Busta

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2008, 05:47:18 AM »
Christensen Arms has been doing it for several years. White Rifles offerd the carbon fiber wrapped barrels over 10 years ago I believe. Ultimate Firearms is offering the carbon fiber wrapped barrel on one of their rifles, turned that boat anchor into a nice light rifle.

Quote
Turn down your barrel and install our patented Carbon Wrap $625

http://www.christensenarms.com/

http://www.christensenarms.com/services-2.html



BP Xpress

http://www.ultimatefirearms.com/


BP Xpress Carbon Stealth (real pricey)

http://www.ultimatefirearms.com/modelsprices.htm


Advanced Barrel Systems, Inc. (their website Copyright suggests that they have been aroun since 2004)

http://home.alltel.net/mdegerness/
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Offline Wakaba

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2008, 07:37:35 AM »
We do a ton of advanced ceramic coatings here at the shop.  One of those coatings is a thermal dispersant coating that increases the ability of bare metal to dissipate heat 15% faster than the same uncoated surface.  After coating the oilpan on my car, I only reach 124*F on my 12mi commute, where with the normal pan would see 210*F on the same drive and weather. 

I am wondering if this coating can be applied to the firearms world for an advantage over bare barrels.

Any thoughts?
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Offline trotterlg

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2008, 01:57:31 PM »
Well..........Paint some on a barrel and tell us.  Larry
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Offline billy_56081

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2008, 02:06:40 PM »
Quote from: Wakaba on November 24, 2008, 07:37:35 AM
We do a ton of advanced ceramic coatings here at the shop.  One of those coatings is a thermal dispersant coating that increases the ability of bare metal to dissipate heat 15% faster than the same uncoated surface.  After coating the oilpan on my car, I only reach 124*F on my 12mi commute, where with the normal pan would see 210*F on the same drive and weather. 

I am wondering if this coating can be applied to the firearms world for an advantage over bare barrels.

Any thoughts?



Why are you not giving a range report on this stuff? Do a test, put a thermometer on the barrel fire lets say 10 shots, one minute apart, check the time and temp. Then coat the barrel with this stuff and do the same test. Would be interesing.
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Offline Wakaba

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2008, 05:34:37 PM »
The problem with running a temp test is I will have to sacrifice one of my two barrels for the project.  I have a 22" .243 standard barrel, and a 24" .223 bull fluted for my Handi.  The process of coating will require the barrel be media blasted to remove all blue and get the barrel bare....and my wife would KILL ME!  Anyone in the Minneapolis area want to donate a barrel for the testing?

My next range day I will start with a 10 round shot sequence, with one round each minute on the minute, with the .243.  Maintaining a single point of aim, and temp readings after each shot using the same IR thermometer we use for testing in the shop.  With this I can see if there is a significant heat gains to require such a coating. 

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Offline torpedoman

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2008, 06:07:06 PM »
the carbon fiber system for the 10-22 is a barrel liner stressed inside a carbon fiber tube the carbon fiber does not touch the metal of the barrel liner
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Offline trotterlg

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2008, 06:08:36 PM »
I will blast it and then parkerize it for you free and even pay the shipping if you do the test, I think a parkerized barrel is a better finish than blue any day.  I've done a bunch and they come out very nice.  Same holds true for anyone willing to offer up a barrel for testing, I will also square up the breach and cut a new target crown on it while I am at it.  Larry
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Offline Wakaba

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2008, 05:38:43 AM »
Quote from: trotterlg on November 24, 2008, 06:08:36 PM
I will blast it and then parkerize it for you free and even pay the shipping if you do the test, I think a parkerized barrel is a better finish than blue any day.  I've done a bunch and they come out very nice.  Same holds true for anyone willing to offer up a barrel for testing, I will also square up the breach and cut a new target crown on it while I am at it.  Larry

Larry, check your PM's
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Offline Hofs01

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2008, 07:29:25 AM »
I have a 243 superlight I will offer up, if one is still needed.

Will need to be after Thanksgiving when I get back
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Offline Qaz

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2008, 08:16:26 AM »
 Wakaba- If what you say is correct then after you coated the oil pan on your car then it no longer comes up to operating temp. I could see that big a change with a faulty thermostat but not with a change to the oil pan!

Qaz
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Offline Wakaba

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Re: cool barrel system
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2008, 05:41:24 PM »
Quote from: Qaz on November 25, 2008, 08:16:26 AM
Wakaba- If what you say is correct then after you coated the oil pan on your car then it no longer comes up to operating temp. I could see that big a change with a faulty thermostat but not with a change to the oil pan!

Qaz

Thermostat is functioning properly, as proved with ECT readings before and after opening temp (190*)
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-Rich
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