medium velocity, heavy bullet loads for .338 Federal

[jumpsteady]

Does anyone have any experience with a medium velocity, heavy bullet load set up. I posted this on another forum a while back, but wanted your guys opinion. I have come to believe that most all ammo company's are on a speed trip, the more velocity the better. Its kinda like the big three car companies MORE HORSEPOWER,(which is fine with me but anyway). I started my deer hunting career shooting a 25-06. And it seems to me that the more velocity I got out of my loads the more meat damage I got. I am interested in trying to get the same type of results as the 6.5mm x 55 Swedish Mauser. It shoots a 120-140 grain bullet with a sectional density of between .270 and .290 at a velocity of between 2300 and 2500 feet per second. It has been used on everything from varmints to caribou. It has  also been said to have been used on elephants in Africa. I am now shooting a .338 federal and want to create a load with tons of momentum but not tons of energy. Momentum is what drives a bullet through muscle, bone, sinew, and cartilage. Energy is what causes a bullet to expand or fragment. Energy is also what causes shock damage to living tissue. You can't really have too much momentum, but you CAN have too much energy. The .338 federal is recommended for use up to 225 grain bullets. I am looking at using Nosler Partitions or Accu-bonds, both in 225 grains. These both have a sectional density of .281. Does anybody have any experience with either of these bullets in this caliber. I live in NE Kansas, and I am looking to make up 1 load that will work for everything from Coyotes to Elk, with Whitetails being the most common game I am after. What got me to thinking about this is two articles written by Eben Brown. They can be found on EABCO.COM . Go to the ammo and reloading supplies page then go to custom cartridge brass and dies page. Once there click on BR Magnum philosophy link. it is written mostly based on their 6.5mm BRM cartridge, but the concept intrigues me. I am still in the brainstorming and research stage so any help on this theory that I came across and on medium velocity heavy bullet load would be great. Thanks.

Jumpsteady

[Pinkerton]

I'm just trying to go off memory but google 338 Federal Chuck Hawks, and I think he has an article that may help.

I went the opposite way this year with my 338 federal and used Barnes 160gr for antelope with good results.

Good Luck.

[SDS-GEN]

I am hand loading the 185gr Barnes TSX in my Ruger.  I tried the 210Gr TSX with good results but went back to the 185.  One thing I found was my loads were consistantly 175-200fps slower than the factory rounds.  I was using powders that were listed as producing the highest velocities in the manuals.  All loads were compressed. 

Incidently, I shot a cow elk with the 185 handload this year, had a complete pass through, elk went about 30 yards.  There was significant meat damage on the off side shoulder.

[reelhook]

My  answer is to go to LIGHTER bullets such as Barnes-160's or 185's-They will not give you the meat damage that other bullets will.

[Casull]

If you're going to load a 225 grain bullet in the .338 Federal, you ARE limited to medium velocity.  According to the Hodgon data, max velocity with a 225 grain bullet is about 2400 fps.

[nomosendero]

If you're going to load a 225 grain bullet in the .338 Federal, you ARE limited to medium velocity.  According to the Hodgon data, max velocity with a 225 grain bullet is about 2400 fps.

    

Casull, you are correct!! If you want to use the 225, you could not make the 338Fed. a high vel. round if you wanted to, so what's the problem?

[coyotejoe]

I don't see the 225 grain as being a "heavy" bullet for .338 caliber. Way back in my Elmer Keith days when I believed .338 was the smallest caliber for elk I had two loads for my M-70 .338 Win mag which shot close enough to the same zero to be used interchangeably. I loaded the 225 Hornady spire point to about 2800 fps for long shots and the 275 Speer semi spitzer at about 2400 for a brush load. I've since learned you don't need a .338 mag to kill elk and there is no such thing as a brush load. Besides which, since I've grown old and scrawny, I no longer enjoy being kicked around by heavy recoil. I now hunt with a 6.5x55 and load 140 grain bullets at bout 2600 fps for deer and elk, it works as well on one as the other and meat loss is very little if I keep it behind the shoulder. If I were to draw an antelope permit I would load the 120 grains up near 3,000 fps for a flatter trajectory but so far I've only fired those at paper.

[SDS-GEN]

Coyotejoe, we are talking about the 338 Federal, not the 338 Win Mag.  A 225 gr bullet is a heavy bullet for the Federal.  Recoil is very mild in the 338 Fed.

[usherj]

I have the 6.5 x 55 and 338 WM. Current favorite loads for both run about 2700 fps. 140 NP for the 6.5 (RL22) and 210 NP (AA3100) for the 338. Check the book (338 Fed not in mine) for a 210 load. That might be a nice compromise. Try starting loads and hopefully you'll find one your gun likes.

[Bugflipper]

 Here's a load I worked up in ar 10 for elk. Can't find the pic, was a medium 6x6. Able to recover bullet in hill behind elk. Fully expanded and held together. It was a 271 yard shot.

225 gr partition OAL  2.82"  Varget 44.5 gr. Fed 210 primer 2420 fps 24" barrel

Couldn't find any group size info in my notes I know it was under .5" though.
Haven't shot anything else with it, so no idea on using it for other critters.
Good Luck

[jumpsteady]

Thanks everybody for the help. Im fighting bedding issues right now and deer season starts next wensday. im just going to shot what i have for now and go back to load development after the season closes. Thanks again.

[JD338]

The 225 gr PT should be a nice bullet for you. I used this bullet in my M700 Classic 35 Whelen to take well over a dozen WT deer and a 250 lb black bear. I always got an exit with out excessive meat damage.

JD338

[jumpsteady]

Thanks JD338. That is kinda what i was wanting to hear. How fast were you pushing your loads?

[kombi1976]

It's interesting that you speak of heavy loads and talk the 225gr.
Like coyotejoe I'd be thinking 250gr or even 275gr and then you begin to run into OTHER problems.
The main one is bbl twist and the second is expansion.
The heavier 338 pills are designed for the 338 Win Mag, 340 Wby and other magnums so they are unlikely to expand under modest velocities.
However at short ranges the less velocities would work a little like the old lever gun cartridges.
The advantage of course, is that a 250gr pill has a BC of .470 or more unlike the old FP bullets.
What you lose in velocity you should make up in ballistic coefficient.
But yeah, stick with 225gr.

[john keyes]

I would try to mimic the .358 Win stuff and go from there

I shoot 180 gr out of a .308 sav99 and I'm pretty sure I'm not setting any speed records.