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Author Topic: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?  (Read 1480 times)

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Offline Doublebass73

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H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« on: March 07, 2009, 04:29:48 PM »
I was at one of my favorite gun stores today and noticed he had an old H&R so I asked him to take it down so I could check it out. It was marked 44-40 on the barrel but it was a smoothbore. It was in pretty good shape. Is anyone here familar with these? I've never seen one like it before.
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Offline GatCat

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2009, 12:52:32 AM »
I've never heard of such a critter. I wonder if someone rebored the barrel to use shot cartridges, or maybe also rechambered it to .410??
Perhaps it was old enough to have been used with black powder, had a ruined bore, hence the mods??
A mystery!
Mark
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Offline tony212

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2009, 01:04:27 AM »
Years ago I was given a very old H&R marked 44-40/410 on the barrel.  Unfortunately it had neglected for years and when I brought it to my gunsmith he said it was unsafe to shoot. I really don't remember if it was rifled or not.
Tony 212
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Offline mechanic

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2009, 01:24:47 AM »
I have one of the 44 - 410's, but it is not designed for 410 shotshells.  My understanding is instead it was designed for a brass cartridge shot shell?  A 410 is so loose in the bore you can see daylight around it.  Perhaps the 44-40 you saw was similar?
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Offline MSP Ret

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2009, 01:49:53 AM »
buy it?....<><.... ;D
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Offline jlwilliams

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2009, 03:33:11 AM »
  I just checked "Cartridges of the World" and couldn't find any reference to a 44-40 shotshell or shot loads for the 44-40 .  I'm thinking someone reamed out a worn barrel to shoot hand rolled shotshells.  Maybe?
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Offline bilmac

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2009, 03:49:55 AM »
I have a faint dim memory of something called a 5 in 1 or maybe a 3 in 1 system involving the 44-40, and that it included a brass 44-40 case loaded with shot. Maybe if you looked closer on the barrel you might find this terminology.
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Offline billy_56081

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2009, 04:02:19 AM »
There were 44-40 shot shells, I wasn't aware of H&R making a gun for one, but I think maybe Marble?

I think the Marble Gamegetter.

http://www.municion.org/44_40/44GameGetter.htm


And to think in todays world that is considered a weapon to dangerous for most to have.
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Offline Doublebass73

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2009, 04:09:01 AM »
This was definitely a factory offering. I think it may have said "shotshell" on the side of it. I asked the shop owner how old it was and he said it was from around 1900. He hadn't priced it yet but he said he was going to ask around $300 for it. The gun was in pretty good shape for its age.
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"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."

---- William Pitt (the Younger), Speech in the House of Commons, November 18, 1783

Offline Doublebass73

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2009, 04:20:45 AM »
I did some searching and came up with an old for sale ad for one of these. This is what it looks like except the one I saw is in nicer shape than the one in this ad - http://www.joesalter.com/detail.php?f_qryitem=3709
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"Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."

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Offline coyotejoe

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2009, 04:59:02 AM »
Yes, there were 44/40 factory loaded birdshot cartridges. One version used a paper tube to extend the brass case to hold the birdshot and another variety used a hollow wooden round nosed "bullet". The famous "Marble's Gamegetter" was chambered in 44/40 prior to the introduction of the .410 shotshell. There also was a 44/40 blackpowder load with a single round ball for use in smoothbores.
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Offline Jeff H

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2009, 02:49:46 PM »
Quote from: coyotejoe on March 08, 2009, 04:59:02 AM
Yes, there were 44/40 factory loaded birdshot cartridges. One version used a paper tube to extend the brass case to hold the birdshot and another variety used a hollow wooden round nosed "bullet". The famous "Marble's Gamegetter" was chambered in 44/40 prior to the introduction of the .410 shotshell. There also was a 44/40 blackpowder load with a single round ball for use in smoothbores.

There was at least one other variation without the cardboard or wood - one with a simple over-shot card and a REALLY heavy roll crimp.  I was grubbing for clean, vintage .35 Remingtons in a big box a friend brought home from an estate auction last summer.  While grubbing I found a nearly pristine box of 44-40 shotshells in excellent condition.  Just based on what I have seen over the years, I judged the box to be from sometime in the forties (butu couild be very wrong) and I believe it was of Canadian manufacture but don't remember for certain, "CIL," maybe?  I would have to go back and look.  I remembered the cartridges becasue they reminded me of some GI .45 ACP shot loads my Dad had over forty years ago - no "casing" of any kind to contain the shot extending beyond the case mouth.
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Offline mechanic

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2009, 02:53:58 PM »
Quote from: Doublebass73 on March 08, 2009, 04:20:45 AM
I did some searching and came up with an old for sale ad for one of these. This is what it looks like except the one I saw is in nicer shape than the one in this ad - http://www.joesalter.com/detail.php?f_qryitem=3709

Looks just like the gun I have, which is marked 44 - 410.  It was my grandpa's gun, and I've never considered shooting it, just one of those "neat to have" things.

He got it when he about 12 years old, and the family made a wagon train trip to visit his grandpa who had moved to Red River, Tx.
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Offline jlwilliams

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Re: H&R 44-40 Smoothbore?
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2009, 09:11:23 AM »
  I thought the Marbles Gamegetter was a proprietary cartridge, not a 'standard' offering prior to switching over to the .410.  Not the first time I've been mistaken though.
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