Author Topic: FAQ New Info Added 7-1-08  (Read 14495 times)

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Offline moto357

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FAQ New Info Added 7-1-08
« on: January 19, 2008, 01:50:47 PM »
New FAQ info added. Feel Free to add info.
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Offline quickdtoo

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FAQ
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2008, 09:23:16 AM »
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Offline Busta

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Re: scope bases for a White
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2008, 10:24:57 AM »


The bases (Model 51258) that Tim provided links for will work, however if you install them with the levers on the left as designed you will not be able to move the cocking lever into the safety detent due to a conflict for the same space. Another option is to turn the rear base and ring around so the lever is on the right, the front base lever has to remain on the left due to its design, this is not as appealing aesthetically, but would allow you to fully engage the cocking lever safety.

While these Leupold QR bases work as designed on the "W"-Series Super-91/Model-98 Elite/Thunder Bolt style action Whites, they are not as friendly on the "G"-Series Whitetail/Blacktail/Bison/Odyssey/Model 97/Ultra-Mag style actions. They should work excellent on the White Lightning actions, since the cocking lever is on the right side on those.

The Model# 51258 is for the "G" Series, the "W" Series has a wider radius and is what I have mounted on my M-98 Elite.

Unfortunately White bases are getting VERY scarce, there are other bases that can be modified to work on a White. IIRC the #11 and #35 (check before buying) Weavers will work, although the radius is better suited for the larger "W"- Series receiver. Warne was the company that made the White bases, but last I knew they no longer had any in inventory either. Might be worth a call to Warne to check though.
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Offline 30-06man

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T7
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2008, 02:54:48 PM »
Triple Seven
120 grains of LOOSE triple seven is a magnum charge and is equivlent to 150 grains of blackpower. It is equal to 3 50 grain pellets.
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

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Offline 30-06man

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Unloading a ML
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2008, 02:58:06 PM »
Muzzleloader Unloading.

You can buy a Co2 unloader or you can simply pull the breach plug and use the ram rod to push the powder out. After each time I unload my ML I run a little oil down the barrel and put it up. You can also fire it if you like,
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

Rick

Offline Double 30

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Accuracy Suggestions
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2008, 09:08:26 AM »
If  your formerly super shooting inline suddenly cant find the target  despite your best efforts:Remember to always swab between shots. Take a bore brush to her to get any plastic fouling out. You can use one of the super plastic solvents but they have dangerous fumes and they STINK.Swap out breech plugs or nipples/primer holders (if so equipped).My Omega Z5 starts to enlarge groups after the plug has about 3-400 rounds through it.Changing plugs results in an instant restoration of happiness.In my exprience , nipples last about the same.Lastly, try different sabots.My Omega loved MMP's until she hit the 1000 round mark.At that point her groups opened without remedy so I switched to Harventer sabots and I now have a MOA muzzleloader.Lastly( again) , try some .44 cal bullets, espicially the Hornady XTP's.Slightly better secional densities than their .451 brethern and increadibly well matched velocity/expansion parameters for muzzleloading use.
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Offline Underclocked

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Re: scope bases for a White
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2008, 11:24:22 AM »
WARME

W" series
Front Gloss - M846G... Matte - M846M... Silver - M846S

Rear Gloss - M892G... Matte - M892M... Silver - M892S

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"G" Series
Front Gloss - M838G... Matte - M838M... Silver - M838S

Rear Gloss - M886G... Matte - M886M... Silver - M886S

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Model 97
Front Gloss - M923G... Matte - M923M... Silver - M923S

Rear Gloss - M925G... Matte - M925M... Silver - M925S

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Model 98
Front Gloss - M953G... Matte - M953M... Silver - M953S

Rear Gloss - M955G... Matte - M955M...Silver - M955S

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

WEAVER MOUNTS
"G" Series Grand Slam S439 front - S452 rear

"W" Series Grand Slam S442 front and S455 rear

Weaver standard bases - front 11, rear 35, barrel (?)46(?)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

LEUPOLD QR base sets  - see issues Busta pointed out above


White "W" Series part # 50162 (matte) #50069 (silver)

White "G" Series part # 51258 (matte)


Many of these bases are no longer available (a few are).  A call to Warne would probably be your best shot.  Several other mount bases can be fairly easily modified to work on Whites.
WHUT?

Offline 30-06man

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Bullet Diameter
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2008, 05:13:29 PM »
Like I said, a little! I have dabbled with saboted bullets and conicals over the years, but have been oblivious as to the sabots actual diameters with bullets. I know all the exact diameters of the conicals I shoot, however. Well today, I figured I would document some sabot sizes for myself, and figured I would share this little information with others. This is probably nothing new to most of you guys that shoot smokeless, but may help some of the new Blackhorn 209 shooters.

I have only checked a few bullets, but if you use the diameter of the bullet, and the diameter of the saboted bullet, you should be able to figure out the exact size of what your bore likes.

First up was the 250/300 grain .452 diameter SST/Shockwave bullets.

250 gr SST./Shockwave


300 gr SST/Shockwave


In order from left to right in both pictures, as the diameters (.452") are the same for both bullets. The following is sabot and bullet diameters.

Black Harvester Crush Rib High Pressure Sabot = .503"
Black MMP HPH 24, T/C Shockwave supplied sabot = .504"
Black MMP HPH 12, Hornady SST supplied sabot = .506"
Red Harvester Crush Rib High Pressure Sabot (for smokeless) = .508"
Black Knight High Pressure Sabots (MFG# 900128) = .511"

Those Knight sabots are a SOB to load in my .5015" Knight! It actually deformed the petals. Might be just what you need for a loose bore though.


Next up is the 250/290 grain .451" diameter Knight PBT/Barnes TMZ in both the old yellow sabots, and the new blue EZ Load sabots.



The 250's on the left and 290's on the right are the same diameter, but the sabots are not.

New Blue EZ Load High Pressure Sabots with bullets = .501"
Old Yellow High Pressure Sabots with bullets = .506"

My Knight loves the old yellow sabots, I sure hope they have not discontinued them in favor of the new EZ Loads. :( 


Last up is a couple .44 caliber (.429/.430) bullets. You can determine the bullets from the boxes behind them.



The Speer 270 grain Gold Dot bullets actually measured .4295, a tad larger than advertized.

Green Harvester High Pressure Sabots = .503"
Green Knight High Pressure Sabots = .5065"

The Hornady 300 grain HP/XTP bullets measured .430 as advertized.

Green Harvester High Pressure Sabots = .503"
Green Knight High Pressure Sabots = .507"

If you have a large bore, or desire a tighter sabot, those Knight HPS load hard, too hard for my liking.

I hope this little bit of information helps somebody. If your bullets are .001" bigger or smaller than mine, you can still figure it out without having to go buy a bunch of sabots that you don't need. I don't have many, so if anyone has other sabots they could add to this, PLEASE DO!
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

Rick

Offline Buckskins & Black Powder

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Game, Set, Match. Powerbelt Bullets Info
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2008, 06:18:36 PM »
GAME, SET, MATCH

Know your game
    Set your limits
        Match the bullet to the game and limits

    Step one; Match the bullet to the game.
   
    We need to look at the ‘Momentum Value’ and what roll this plays in our bullet choice. (See the Kevin “Doctari” Robertson book, ‘The Perfect Shot, African Big Game’, Page 12) Here is the formula for pounds / feet per second.
BULLET WEIGHT IN GRAINS x VELOCITY IN FPS / 7,000

Wt x fps / 7,000
Let’s look at few different bullets.
                                                                    Momentum Value
.45 cal.  175 gr.  x  2,469 fps  /  7,000  =           61
.45 cal.  275 gr.  x  2,111 fps  /  7,000  =           82
.50 cal.  530 gr.  x  1,350 fps  /  7,000  =           102

    Now what about a couple of our .50 cal. Power Belt bullets.
                                                                     Momentum Value
223 gr. x  2,321 fps  /  7,000 =                           73
245 gr. x  2,268 fps  /  7,000 =                           79
444 gr. x  1,330 fps  /  7,000 =                           84

    If you were to push the big bullet faster it would dominate even more. A big heavy bullet will out perform a little light bullet in every category…except trajectory, and this, unfortunately, is the one chart that everyone wants to look at. Ballistics are much more than just the drop in the bullet at 200 yards. There is the energy to consider, the accuracy, the bullet expansion, the penetration, shock and trauma. The general idea is that the bigger the game the bigger the bullet. A .50 cal. 245 gr. A.T. is great on Deer but is absolutely out of its league when it comes to Elk, same with the .45 cal. 225 gr. A.T.
    For many hunters that have spent years shooting their .30-06 rifles with a 180 gr. bullet a 245 gr. seems huge, it’s not. In a .50 cal. big doesn’t start until you get over 300 gains. Consider that a .50 cal. round ball is between 178 and 180 grains with a ballistic coefficient of about .90 and the .30 cal 180 gr. has a B.C. of .300 to 540, depending on the design, they are worlds apart. Big game, big bullet.
    For Elk and Moose I recommend the .45 cal. 275 gr. A.T. and the 300 gr. Platinum and in the .50 cal. the 338 gr. Platinum, with a magnum load or the 444 gr. Flat Point Copper with 100 to 150 grains.
    For big Deer I recommend the .45 cal. 223 gr. Platinum and the 225 gr. A.T. and in the .50 cal. I recommend the 270 gr. Platinum the 295 gr. and the 300 gr. Platinum.

    Now for the set.
   
    Have you SET limits on how far you are going to shoot? Have you SET standards on what is and what is not a ‘good’ shot to take? You need to SET your limits in order to choose the right bullet. For example, if you’re going to be shooting Deer at 130 yards or less then the .50 cal. 245 gr. A.T. or the 295 gr. H.P. are a great choice. Both of these bullets will give you excellent accuracy, expansion and penetration from 30 to 130 yards and a 100 grain charge is all that is needed for optimum results. (Pelletized Powder or the equivalent).
    If you want the option of taking that long shot out to 200 yards but might have an opportunity at the 30 yard range then the 270 and 300gr. Platinum were designed for just this reason. The tip design gives these bullets a better B.C. than the regular Power Belts so that they retain more energy down range and it also controls the expansion at close ranges.
    We get calls from hunters that love the 245 gr. for deer but then try and take a 300 lbs Hog with the same set up. Not good. A 120 lb Deer is in no way shape or form even close to a 300 lb Hog or even a 200 lb Hog. Hogs are tough, thick skinned and tenacious. The 245 gr. is not the bullet to go after Hogs with. In fact I like the 348 gr. or bigger for the mean things, and if your talking an ugly beast of over 300 lbs then the 338 gr. Platinum with a heavy charge or the 444 gr. FPC are the one to go with. It is showing very little respect for the game to try and harvest a big animal with a little bullet just for the sake of convenience.
    In the same way it is poor judgment to sight your rifle in ‘dead on’ at 100 yards and then try to make a clean shot on that big Buck at 200 yards when you haven’t even taken one shot at the range at that distance! ‘Bad Form’, as Capitan Hook would say. If you think you ‘might’ take a long shot then by all means go to the range and SHOOT at that distance! Know where your rifle shoots by shooting it and not by reading ballistic charts. Every gun has a personality of its own, every gun is different, every gun has likes and dislikes when it comes to powder, bullet and primer combinations. Not to mention clean bore and fouled bore performance, but that’s another subject. SET your limits and stay with them.

    MATCH the bullet to the game.

    We have already covered this above to some degree because all three are so closely tied together but let’s MATCH up a few more bullets to game scenarios.
    BEARS. Bears are tough and a wounded Bear can cover the ground like nothing else. Shock, Trauma and Penetration through the vitals is what works to put one down. Now even though they are ‘tough’ they have a relatively thin hide but it’s their muscle mass that is what can restrict penetration. Again the same rule applies here as to any Game, the bigger the Bear the bigger the bullet. Our 444 gr. FPC has taken a number of Large grizzlies and at least 2 Kodiak Bear with superb results. It each case this bullet delivered all three qualities that dispatched the animals quickly and humanely. The only other bullet I would recommend for the Big Bears is the 338 gr. Platinum with a magnum load, or the .45 cal. 300 gr. Platinum with a magnum load. When I say Big Bears I am talking any thing above 400 lbs. When it comes to Bears that are going to weigh in under the 400 lbs mark then I am comfortable with a little lighter bullet say the 348 gr. or the .45 cal. 275 gr.
   
    ANTELOPE. Most hunters are going to want something that will shoot flat and hit hard. The .45 cal. 223 gr. Platinum with a magnum load is and excellent choice, the 195 gr. will work but I prefer the heavier bullet, it carries more energy at the long ranges and the drop in trajectory is not that much more. For the .50 I recommend the 270 gr. Platinum, as with the above mention 223 the 270 will carry more energy than the 245 gr. and shoot flatter than the 295 gr. with plenty of energy to do the job clean and quick.

    MOOSE are the same as Elk, big Game Big bullet. .45 cal. 300 gr. Platinum or the 275 gr. A.T. platinum or the .50 cal. 338 gr. Platinum with a magnum load or the 444 gr. with the 100 grain charge. Because the 338 grain is lighter we need to crank it up to produce the same energies as the big 444 gr.

    SMALL DEER that go between 80 and 120 lbs can be hunted with a wide range of bullets from the .45 cal. 175 gr. to the 225 gr. H.P. and in the .50 cal. everything from the 223 A.T. gr. to the  295 gr. H.P., although I would prefer the 195 gr. A.T. to the 175 gr. When going with a bigger bullet on smaller game it is better to use the Hollow Point to allow the bullet to expand on impact and create a large wound channel through the animal, the lighter bullets are traveling faster and will expand easier and we need the Aero Tip to control that expansion. The Hollow Point will expand on contact creating a lot of shock and Trauma while the Aero Tip will push in and then mushroom retaining more bullet weight. This is why I would suggest a 245 gr. A.T. and the 295 gr. H.P. for many of the same applications. You will see similar results on Deer size Game.

    DEER from 120 to 180 lbs. I recommend the .45 cal. 223 gr. Platinum the 225 gr. A.T. or possibly the 275 gr. H.P. or the .50 cal. 245 gr. A.T., 270 gr. Platinum, 295 gr. H.P. and possibly the 348 gr. H.P.

    BIG DEER that go 200 plus lbs I would recommend the .45 cal. 223 gr. Platinum, 225 gr. A.T., both with a magnum load, or the 275 gr. H.P. or the .50 cal. 295 gr. A.T., 270 gr. Platinum or 300 gr. Platinum both with magnum loads or the 348 gr. H.P.

    ELK, Bull or Cow, we recommend the 338 gr. Platinum with a magnum load, if your rifle is magnum capable. In Colorado you have to use LOOSE powder and so I recommend 120 grains of Triple 7 Loose with the 338 gr. Platinum. 150 grains of Pyrodex or 150 grains of American Pioneer (or any other equivalent powder) will work but I prefer the Triple 7 because it is hotter and the Platinum performs great with this hot Loose Powder. Remember that 120 grains of T-7 Loose is equal to 150 grains of Pyrodex.
    The .45 cal. 275 gr. A.T. or the 300 gr. Platinum are great choices with Magnum loads if the state you are hunting in allows .45 calibers to be used in the Elk season, check the Regulations.

    BISON (BUFFALO), same as Elk.
    ELAND, KUDU, WATER BUCK, and WART HOGS all the same as Elk.

   CAPE BUFFALO AND ELEPHANT are in a league of their own and require the use of the Steel Tip Dangerous Game Bullet. Now with these bullets the hotter the load the deeper the penetration, they are a non expanding bullet designed to penetrate the tough thick hide and bones of the largest, meanest animals on earth and they work quite well. Unfortunately we no longer manufacture these bullets, the cost of producing them was very high and therefore the cost on the shelf was very high also, and as you might well imagine, we didn’t sell very many.

    The above suggestions are things to think about before heading to the store or heading out into the field. I would urge each and every hunter to show respect for the game they intend to harvest by putting some time, effort and thought into what they are going to use in the field. Know the GAME you are hunting, SET your limitations and stand by them, MATCH the bullet to the Game, and last but certainly not least, go to the range and shoot. Get familiar with your rifle and know where it is shooting at the distances you are going to be hunting.
          Good Luck and Good Hunting.
               Dan Hall
               6-27-07