The irony of cash for clunkers

[Questor]

I find it fascinating that the one thing that has stimulated economic activity, cash for clunkers, is basically just a variant on the concept of people spending their own money for goods desirable to them. The most ironic thing is that the car is the most lavish symbol of capitalist materialism.

[Questor]

There was a report on public radio last evening about how cash for clunkers is working in some dealerships. Since inventories are very low, the clunker program has reignited the practice of price gouging at some dealers. The dealers would have been happy to sell anything to anybody a month ago, but now due to scarcity, people wanting to trade in their clunkers are required to pay full sticker price at some dealers.

[nomosendero]

There was a report on public radio last evening about how cash for clunkers is working in some dealerships. Since inventories are very low, the clunker program has reignited the practice of price gouging at some dealers. The dealers would have been happy to sell anything to anybody a month ago, but now due to scarcity, people wanting to trade in their clunkers are required to pay full sticker price at some dealers.

I figured it was most doubtful that you would get the same selling price with this program as you would with a lowest cash price, as as in trade-ins in general, but most people don't really know how to get a deal on a car anyway.

[Questor]

How do you get a deal on a new car? I usually just buy used cars because I can get a great deal on a like-new car, and pay about half what I'd pay for a new one.

We were going to buy a used mini van for my wife, but the deals were so good on new ones at the time that it cost the same to buy a new one as it did to buy a used one 3 years old. There were good incentives at the time, so we ended up with a new car.

[Graybeard]

Saw an ad on TV last night, not sure if local or in B'ham but even that is almost local to me offering an additional $4500 discount on top of the trade in your clunker $4500 for a total of $9000 off. The thing is tho last year when I bought my new Toyota Sequoia the same dealers were selling new Dodge's at 50% of list. Some how I don't think $9000 off and you have to give them your current vehicle is much of a bargain compared to half off.

At the PD shoot this year Digger was driving a new Dodge 4x4 pickup I think he said he paid $14,000 for out the door. Now that's a bargain.

[SHOOTALL]

A deal on a new car ? knock 15% off sticker price and offer no more . If you have a trade in get the best price then tell them you have a trade in . Make sure you have the Bank loan value of your trade in and realize you need to knock off the 15% there also as fair is fair .
If ask how you arrived at the price you are willing to pay just say its all you have to spend . Watch dealer lots as they have to pay to floor plan slow movers , so if you can time it just before they have to pay they are willing to move it before it cost them . After they pay it becomes part of the price unless it is a real slow mover .
The main thing is to decide what you want and how much you are wiling to pay and DON"T GIVE IN ! if they won't meet your deal then leave your phone number and leave . I have been called twice when doing such . Once the next morning and once the phone was ringing as i got home .
Remember you can always change a no ansewer but once you say yes to their deal its over .

[Questor]

ShootAll:

That makes sense. I guess I've been applying variants of that all along. The main thing with me is that I am only willing to pay so much for a car, and I look for the deal that gives me what I want at the price I'm willing to pay.

[skarke]

What will surely follow is limitations on the manufacture of new large vehicles through expanding the mandates of CAFE standards.  They'll get my 98 suburban and 99 ford PU when they pry my cold, dead hands off of the steering wheel

[Land_Owner]

For the Whitehouse "Man in Black" that may be the acceptable proposal skarke.

[bilmac]

One of the commentators on Fox News pointed out what a dumb idea this is. We use taxpayer $s to buy some pretty nice used cars and then scrap them. Why not ship them to some third world country for resale?

[skarke]

I've always found it funny that we in the US, and in Western Europe, are so concerned about carbon output, when the two fastest growing economies in the world (China and India) are building coal fired generating plants at breakneck pace, dozens per year.  Russia loses 5 to 10% of its siberian oil production into the siberian countryside from pipeline leakage (about 50 exxon valdezes per year), and where is the greenies outcry?

While we're playing with our whirlybirds and "organic" gruel, they are creating an industrial revolution that is on pace to dwarf anything that we've ever done.

Do they think about their "carbon footprint"?  Heck no, the only footprint that they are concerned about is the one square in the middle of our backsides as they kick us off of the economic mountain top.

[Questor]

Skarke:

You are so right. The Chinese have a huge initiative that will build more coal plants in the next 5 or 7 years than currently exist in the US.

India does seem to think about their carbon footprint, to the extent of rejecting any proposals that they slow down their economic growth in favor of green initiatives. India's recent rejection of Hillary Clinton's suggestions was particularly amusing because they were so uncharacteristically blunt and direct.

What interests me is that there are quite a few plans for new nuclear plants here in the US. Some are in the advanced stages of planning, and have done almost everything to get started except actually breaking ground. The cynical side of me thinks that a lot of this nonsense about global warming here in the US is all about preparing the public for the necessity of new nuclear plants.

[rex6666]

I've always found it funny that we in the US, and in Western Europe, are so concerned about carbon output, when the two fastest growing economies in the world (China and India) are building coal fired generating plants at breakneck pace, dozens per year.  Russia loses 5 to 10% of its siberian oil production into the siberian countryside from pipeline leakage (about 50 exxon valdezes per year), and where is the greenies outcry?

While we're playing with our whirlybirds and "organic" gruel, they are creating an industrial revolution that is on pace to dwarf anything that we've ever done.

Do they think about their "carbon footprint"?  Heck no, the only footprint that they are concerned about is the one square in the middle of our backsides as they kick us off of the economic mountain top.

You have hit the nail, China will do as China pleases, and Russia will follow suit.
they will let us worry about the out come.

[SHOOTALL]

Questor,
for used trucks i figure 150000 mile life subtract the act. miles from that and divide into sal;es price to get cost per mile . Do the same for a new truck and compare as it would be a bad business choice to pay more for used per mile .

For diesel trucks I use 250000

[gypsyman]

Couple things come to mind about this cash for clunkes deal. Since I'm not in the market for a new vehicle, can I sit in somebody's to at least get the new car smell, since some of that $4500 is my tax money. Also, I had heard that the vast majority of new cars being bought, are Toyota,KIA, and Honda. Now those are some real American car compay's.
Now, the real deal. Anybody out there ever hear of borrowing from the future.(that shoud stimulate brain activity!)The car company's have been running on future sales for the last couple years. People that can't afford a new car, are being pushed into real good deals. No offense to anybody here, if you can afford to buy one, go for it. But,it sounds like to me that people that should be saving up to try and buy one, can't pass up this deal. Do the dealers that are having such good sales expecting to put in massive orders for the next batch. Or 6 months from now, is the car market going to be totally in the toilet. We shall see!!(I'm not sure if I'm a realist, or a pessimist.) gypsyman