Author Topic: I need a Good 44Mag powder other then W296 (Read 2015 times)

Chuck Buster · « **on:** September 06, 2003, 06:28:54 AM »

:? I am trying to find a good hunting load for my 44mag rev. using pills from 240 to 300gr. I dont like W296 and was wondering how Accurate #9 faired out? #9 seems to show good velocity figures, if it will hold good groups. And how does Lil-Gun perform in a 44mag, I know it gives some of the highest velocities in a 357mag but I cant find any written data on it for a 44Mag!

Graycg · « **Reply #1 on:** September 06, 2003, 06:33:52 AM »

try H or IMR 4227 or Alliant 2400. Honestly though, H110/WW296 is hard to beat in the 44.

regards,
Graycg

Graybeard · « **Reply #2 on:** September 06, 2003, 06:43:50 AM »

W296 and its twin H110 really is THE POWDER for all the magnum handguns. There is no equal.

But if you are bound and determined not to use either then I'd say in the order of my personal preference try H2400, AA9, Lil' Gun, H4227.

None of them are likely to get you the velocity/accuracy combination that W296/H110 will. H2400 and AA9 are fairly close. H4227 is quite accurate usually but at a good bit less velocity. Haven't tried Lil' Gun in the .44 Mag yet but didn't feel it lived up to its hype in the larger bores.

GB

Duffy · « **Reply #3 on:** September 06, 2003, 06:45:50 AM »

I used some #9 in the 357 and 454. It shot pretty good but like H110/296 you can't reduce it otherwise it won't light.
The lilGun tolerates down loading a bit better but will also get dirty when you do so. Not as bad as 2400 though. For max horsepower and accuracy though H110/296 is pretty hard to beat.

The loads I show in the Hodgdon book are all with a
Rem 2 1/2 primer and WW case out of a 8.275 BBL.

THESE ARE MAX AND SHOULD BE REDUCED 10% TO START.

200g Nosler JHP 29.5g 1794 fps 36,200 cup

240g Nosler JHP 24.5g 1582 fps 38,100 cup

300g HDY XTP 17.7g 1280 fps 37,600 cup

Ryan

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #4 on:** September 06, 2003, 08:48:46 AM »

Have you ever tried the Barnes 225 solid copper bullets in a 44mag? I know they work very well in my 15" Encore 444 Marlin and when those ends fold out the shock cavity effect is awesome!

Bullseye · « **Reply #5 on:** September 06, 2003, 05:19:09 PM »

Try IMR 4227. A little less velocity which leads to less noise and recoil. I can live with the recoil, but the muzzle blast from the 296 drives me crazy. The 4227 is just as accurate in my Contender and SRH.

WARPhEAGLE · « **Reply #6 on:** September 06, 2003, 06:19:00 PM »

I use 2400 in my SRH w/ 240 gr Hornandy XTPs. I don't consider myself
an expert, but I am very happy with the load.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #7 on:** September 07, 2003, 12:02:26 AM »

Ive had good luck with wc820 surplus powder and lil gun but for accuracy and power Like Graybeard said the standard is still 110/296

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #8 on:** September 07, 2003, 05:03:50 AM »

Well I guess that I will just have to, excuse the pun, bite the bullet and buy 8 more pounds of the dreaded 296. I wonder if Vitav#%*&, or however they spell it, has a sequel for W296? It comes in two lb cans and seeing that I dont use quite that much it might be the better way to go. I quit buying the other powders in the small cans because just about the time I get all the bugs worked out of a load I run out of the dumb powder and the lots always seem to be a little different with the 1 pound cans!
No one commented on the use of the Barnes solid copper bullets in a 44mag, I guess no one shoots them?? They are a little pricey but then again how many critters does a fellow get to shoot at each year?

Graybeard · « **Reply #9 on:** September 07, 2003, 06:22:49 AM »

Yes I believe VV has a proper powder but I've never tried it. I've never loaded ANY VV powder at all.

The .44 mag is not a high velocity round. It isn't tough on bullets and everything the round is capable of doing is done quite well with either hard cast bullets when you need penetration above all or conventional JHPS or JSPs when you want expansion combined with decent penetration. I just can't for the life of me see a valid reason to spend the money on a bullet like the Barnes for this round.

GB

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #10 on:** September 07, 2003, 08:25:03 AM »

I use Alliant 2400 in my 44 Mag. 240 to 300 gr. bullets. I get great results with it. I use the W296 in my S&W500MAG and it gives me great result in it. I have not tried W296 in my 44 mag because, I have had such good accuracy with the Alliant 2400.

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #11 on:** September 07, 2003, 09:54:05 AM »

As long as I can keep the FPS high and the groups small I will be happy; that is to say if a nice buck presents himself in range of said combination!

kciH · « **Reply #12 on:** September 07, 2003, 01:52:05 PM »

The VV N110 has proven to have all the power, and then some, of the H110/WW296. Here is a link with some info on the VV N110 that may be suprising to you. It's a good article in general. http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_notes/archive_tech_notes.htm/45

Mikey · « **Reply #13 on:** September 08, 2003, 04:04:44 AM »

Chuck Buster: I have to agree with the Graybeard regarding the use of H110/W298 as they will give you all you want and more. In addition, 2400 is an old standby I have used satisfactorily and will great results.

You asked about the (difficult to spell) VV powders and kcih gave you the specs about VV110, which is a pretty good powder that will give you all you need and probably more from the 44 magnum. I have used the VV powders and like them. I find them to be clean burning and consistent performers. Good luck and hope this helps. Mikey.

Questor · « **Reply #14 on:** September 08, 2003, 04:13:35 AM »

The problem with VihtaVuouri is that it's expensive. Why pay more for something that gives you no advantage. I still think 296 is the answer. 2400 may have been alright 60 years ago for Elmer Keith and his old hot loaded 44 specials, but 296/H110 is the best for the 44 magnum when full-power loads are desired.

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #15 on:** September 08, 2003, 05:45:37 AM »

That is basically the same conclusion that I am coming to but I wish someone would reply to my question on the Barnes 225gr solid copper bullets as I am very curious about their killing capabilities compared to a 240gr XTP!

kciH · « **Reply #16 on:** September 08, 2003, 05:50:00 AM »

Questor,
If you look at the artilcle I linked to, you might discover that VV N110 will do something that the H110/WW296 can't. Don't get me wrong, I use 20+ lbs of Hodgdon powder a year, but if it will do what the article claims, it can't be matched with H110 at safe pressure levels.

As far as the difference in cost, to try a pound of it to evaluate performance for some hunting loads, it's not even an issue. I don't usually run my loads at full maximum all year tound, and I don't think MOST other loaders do either. The few extra dollars for a pound of N110 to try it out and develop a hunting load seems petty compared to everything else many people try. Ever price a box of Partitions for you .44? Performance above other products typically comes at a greater cost.

Blackhawk44 · « **Reply #17 on:** September 08, 2003, 09:08:07 AM »

After 35 years of magnums, I keep coming back to 2400. Its much more flexible than the ball powders, velocity is close enough, blast and flash are less, and accuracy is usually better. In the 44 you can use anything from about 16.5gr up to about 21gr and all will be accurate. Unburned powder and residue depends about as much on your sizing dies, the diameter of your expander ball and your crimp as the exact powder. Been using my Lil Gun in the Hornet and 357 Max so far but not the 44 so can't give an opinion as yet.

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #18 on:** September 08, 2003, 10:06:18 AM »

:grin: I have 400 Hor. 240gr .430 dia. bullets on the way so I am going to do a lot of testing and shooting across my screens before I bore hunting this year!

SingleShotShorty · « **Reply #19 on:** September 26, 2003, 03:26:18 AM »

You can load the 44 mag with other powders but if you want to reach the 44's potential you can't get any better than W296 or H-110. :-D

Darrell Davis · « **Reply #20 on:** September 26, 2003, 09:26:59 AM »

Hey there handgunners,

Well now, this just may be my opinion, but reading the post gives me the feeling that AA #9 is in disfavor for the simple reason that it is tested by very few shooters.

Back when I had a BH Hunter w/2xLeupold, I went through a number of powders looking for "THE" one. Tried the old standbys, 2400 & 110, tried 296 because a friend thought it was pretty good and gave the newer kid, AA#9, a try.

That Hunter ended up shootiing groups at a 100yds. (with two witness)which are too small to mention. And the powder is ---------- AA#9!!!!!

It IS a good powder, every bit as good as the 2400, 110 & 296 and in that gun BETTER! Plus, it will more then likely meet or beat the velocity of the other listed powders.

I was impressed enough to to buy 8lbs. of the stuff, and have never seen any reason to change.

I have used this powder behind a 310LBT and a Lyman bullet which went about 345gr.

The Lyman mold was out of their reject list, and cast much heavier then the 325 it was listed at. That reject mold was also the mold used for the great groups.

Give it a try, don't think you will be sorry.

Keep em coming! :wink:

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #21 on:** September 26, 2003, 12:24:43 PM »

:grin: Thanks Darrell for the info,
I just loaded up a bunch of 240gr XTP's and 24gr's of Lil-gun and am anxious to shoot it over my chron. to see what kind of velocities its putting out. I will give the #9 the next test run.

Darrell Davis · « **Reply #22 on:** September 26, 2003, 01:02:51 PM »

Hey there Chuck Buster,

Keep us up to date as per velocity and group size.

When I was doing my tests with the Hunter and various powders, it was in the days before my Chrony, so it will be interesting to see just what you come up with. Have put em over the screens since that time, but it would have been interesting to follow the tests all the way instead of picking up on the tail end.

Keep em coming! :wink:

Dan Johnson · « **Reply #23 on:** September 28, 2003, 01:57:29 PM »

kciH;
I would caution you against taking web articles at face value. The guy who wrote this obviously had no means to pressure test his loads and made the critical mistake many do in relying on pressure signs in straight-walled handgun cartridges. Bad move and the fact he actually encountered some in the FA indicates to me his loads were likely way over SAAMI specs. Unfortunately, there are a lot of wannebe gun experts on the web.

That said, VV N110 does give excellent velocities in 44 mag.

Dan Johnson

Chuck Buster · « **Reply #24 on:** September 28, 2003, 03:33:52 PM »

:grin: Thanks for the heads up Dan, and I realize what you are saying.
Ive been reloading since 1954 and have been completive in almost every major shooting sport in the country.

kciH · « **Reply #25 on:** September 30, 2003, 05:57:53 PM »

Dan,
I understand about web "experts". I typically use new brass and the case head expansion technique when evaluating new loads and powders if the data is not available, or in question.