New guy wanting cannon

[Victor3]

I was annoyed to see folding knives on the list of prohibited items.

I gather Bowie Knives were OK?   

 Far as I know, as they were not listed. Since people were gonna be cooking meals, they didn't want to ban 'fixed blade' kitchen knives.

 I said screw it and brought my little Leatherwood multi-tool with scissors. Good thing, since I let about 20 people who didn't bring a knife use it to help their kids build the rockets. You do have to CUT some parts to put the things together....



 So... Swiss Army knife = bad..... Missile = good...

[KABAR2]

We've got some time before the national jamboree in 2010, so we're still exploring our options here.  2010 is the BSA Centennial, and we'll be at Fort A.P. Hill in Virginia next year - so I suspect our Scouts will get the chance to see some significant firepower - even if we don't bring our own. 

- Tom

Tom,

The location where the Centennial Jamboree is being held adds a new layer to the equation Fort A.P. Hill is Federal Property as such it would be illegal to bring a firearm on to the property, 
just like I can't bring my licensed  concealed  pistol into the post office,  you would not be able to bring a shooting cannon onto the base, 
the men who shed their blood to bring us the freedoms and the Republic which we hold so dear  and you wish to honor would shake their heads in wonder as to what has become of this country.

You need to contact the base commander's office before attempting to bring a cannon there,  there are ways around this provision, as there have been live firings of civilian owned cannon on Federal installations there have also been re-enactments held on military bases in the past so there are ways to be able to do this you just need to go through proper channels. 

the suggestion of using a scaled down Hern barrel with no touch hole drilled would also constitute it not being a firearm.
That  or as I suggested a wood or concrete barrel may be the way to go.

If you do get this cannon built as a troop project I wager there will be a lot of Carpentry and metal working merit badges handed out! 


Allen <><

[TABatOBNJ]

Allen, thanks again for your insight.   Excellent advice -and much appreciated.

I know...the concept of the Scouts bringing an operational cannon onto a military base... seems to raise all kinds of issues.   It reminds me a little of that line from Dr. Strangelove:  "Gentlemen!  You can't fight in here!  This is the War Room!" 

The more digging I do, the more it looks like a wooden barrel will be the way to go for our gateway gun.
There will definitely be a bit of woodworking and metalwork for the carriage, though - so I'm thinking this is still a good project.    If we do decide to proceed with a metal barrel, I will certainly take a look at the Hern swivel gun RocklockI recommends.    The $400 price range seems very reasonable for something new that can later be used later to shoot.   

One of the Dad's sent me a link to a re-enactor's British light 3 pounder reproduction for sale (http://cannonsuperstore.com/reenactors.htm)  It's a very pretty piece and comes complete with a trailer - but the $9,500- price tag is a bit out of our range.  It's a good model to work from though - if that turns out to be the gun we want to represent.  Besides, it's fun to look - I understand his enthusiasm!
I'll keep you posted.

Victor3 - great shots of your rocket shoot!  That's always a Cub crowd pleaser - and our older guys enjoy it too.  I ALWAYS carry a Leatherman at any Scout event - they're just too handy to be without.  They should be part of the standard-issue equipment as far as I'm concerned.

Thanks again for your consideration.   I'm making notes for our next troop committee meeting!

Regards,
- Tom

[Double D]

You won't find Cannonsuper store on out resource list for a very Good reason...Cannonmn can tell hyou all about them...when he sees you post his BP will jump 30 points.

[KABAR2]

Tom,

I am glad to be able to help, now that you have decided on a direction here are some links and books you may find helpful,
the first link will take you to Museum Restoration Services which publishes some great books on 18th C. artillery I recommend the first,
and if you really want to know everything there is to know about 18th century artillery the book "A Treatise of Artillery by John Muller"
Should be considered the artilleryman's bible.

http://www.armscollecting.com/Titles_on_Artillery.htm

39     Grasshoppers and Butterflies: The Light 3-Pounders of Pattison and Townshend


        A Treatise of Artillery. John Muller.London, 1780.

Here are a couple of web sites on the subject also. you might want to give your scouts a research project, even though you have all this at your fingertips
have them do internet research on this subject,  maybe there will be another merit badge out of this.... I'm sure there is one for computers these days. If you want
I can make up a list of key words to search under and I would include in this some history items like the American Revolution, the Battle of Monmouth etc.
Also I see a possible tie in on the Citizenship merit badge. 


http://johnsmilitaryhistory.com/threepdr.html

http://www.americanrevolution.org/artillery.html

One last thing you can use the line drawings in the aforementioned books for turning your wood pattern, if the pattern is good enough
you could later hand it over to a foundry to be turned into a pattern for casting in iron or bronze,  a good machine shop should be
able to bore and sleeve the tube for you it won't be cheap but it will be satisfying .


Allen <><

[RocklockI]

the herns spanish howie is cheaper but would look good on a grasshopperish rig .

i just cant really see why you'd put all that work into a wooden tube  .....if you do , the swedish had 'leather guns' maybe they could get a 'leather working badge' too .

if they see a small cannon go off ...i think you'll have a struggle getting them to buy into wood .....

jmho and AS ALWAYS i could be wrong .....so there is that too .

[KABAR2]

RocklockI,

It's more a case of the loss of freedom & political Corectness gone amiss..... between N.J. State laws, Rules that may govern the BSA
and bringing a live cannon on Federal land are a lot of hoops to go through,

In 1981 I participated in the York Town Re-enactment, because the President would attend everyone had to be vetted, 4000 re-enactors, + campfollowers, children etc. when we marched out onto the paradeground and the president was in the stand, we were required to leave our ramrods in our tents, originally they wanted us to remove our locks from the muskets, and all this with the president behind 2" of bullet proof enclosure...... things have gotten worse since 1981 freedom wise nuff said.

Allen <><

[RocklockI]

yes i did not really take that into mind , you probably are right .

[TABatOBNJ]

Allen, Gary,

Thank you.  I had a hunch I was in the right place.   These are precisely the kind of research materials I'm looking for - and I truly appreciate your perspective and your guidance.  The internet is FULL of references - and I am certain you've saved me a great deal of time vetting all that information to find what I need.   Thank you again - you've really helped point me in the right direction - and now I've got a good reading list!

We have a troop committee meeting Thursday night, so I'm going to relay your perspectives - including your comment on the cannonsuperstore link - and get some feedback on where we want to go from here with our gateway display.     I will keep you posted.   

Thank you vary much once again.

Regards,

- Tom

[GGaskill]

if they see a small cannon go off ...i think you'll have a struggle getting them to buy into wood .....

It might be a good exercise to introduce them to the realities of the nanny state.

[RocklockI]

well , dont go away ! you will need to know the exact color of a piant and +/- chip,  for the color for the carriage . 

i know you wont , BUT you may ask at some point .....and you be guided  by this place ,any little hardware part needed , or elevation screws , tools for loading , uniforms ....blah and blah  pretty much anything to do with cannons .

even if you never vent a hern tube it wont lose any money , thats for sure . . a real investment  ...... layaway ... whatever it takes 

good luck ,
gary
 

Allen, Gary,

Thank you.  I had a hunch I was in the right place.   These are precisely the kind of research materials I'm looking for - and I truly appreciate your perspective and your guidance.  The internet is FULL of references - and I am certain you've saved me a great deal of time vetting all that information to find what I need.   Thank you again - you've really helped point me in the right direction - and now I've got a good reading list!

We have a troop committee meeting Thursday night, so I'm going to relay your perspectives - including your comment on the cannonsuperstore link - and get some feedback on where we want to go from here with our gateway display.     I will keep you posted.   

Thank you vary much once again.

Regards,

- Tom