Author Topic: Crimping failure on .348 Winchester factory loads (Read 508 times)

BrushBuster · « **on:** October 12, 2003, 11:13:09 AM »

Could I have some assistance with a current problem. I recently acquired a Model 71.348 rifle which I dearly love and have been using steadily since acquiring it. Along with the rifle came 12 boxes of Winchester Silvertip 200 grain loads which were factory produced sometime in the 1950's.

The problem is that several of these cartridges have collaped, with the bullets dropping way down into the brass. There is only about 10% of the bullet extending beyond the brass. This has occurred during normal loading and unloading of the same cartridges as one does when hunting on a daily basis. I of course only become aware of this condition when I unload after the morning's hunt, and am not sure when this actually occurs. It could happen as I push the cartridge through the loading gate, or in the tube magazine.

Is this a dangerous situation if I should inadvertantly chamber and fire one of these very shortened rounds?

Can I have a friendly handloader reapply the crimping procedure and in effect "tighten up on the crimp", or should I use a product like the Lyman Factory Crimp Die on all my present ammo without creating problems?

If, and when, I begin handloading, can this crimping procedure be overdone, and does this have a significant effect on cup pressures and accuracy?

How does one safely extract a bullet that has settled so deeply into the brass without damage? I'm a little nervous about this, especially about firing a collapsed cartridge. HELP

Iowegan · « **Reply #1 on:** October 12, 2003, 06:37:46 PM »

It is NOT safe to fire a cartridge when the bullet has been seated too deep. Chamber pressure may skyrocket and damage you or the gun.

The bullets can be pulled with a kinetic bullet puller, a common tool that most reloaders have. If you can find a reloader that has dies for your rifle, they can be run through the bullet seater and crimp die for "repair".

With ammo that is over 40 years old, I would consider pulling the bullets, dumping the powder, removing the primers, sizing the cases, then reloading with a new primer and powder. The bullets can be reused. This would be inexpensive, much safer and the gun would shoot more consistant with new primers and powder. With cartridges that old, you never know if the powder and primers have chemically aged. Some may shoot fine where others may dud or shoot weak.

Blackhawk44 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 13, 2003, 01:30:42 PM »

To add to Iowegan, you should not try to deprime live primers. Very dangerous. It only takes one. Find a reloading friend for now. You may have to buy dies. A Lee Factory Crimp Die would also be good for a lever action. You could also run the rest of your rounds through it so it does not occur again. If only a few bullets have set back, take a strip of cut inner tube (probably bicycle), wrap around the base of the round, grip with a cheap pair of slip joint pliers, only hold tight enough to keep the round from slipping out of the pliers and rap the hinge of the pliers on the corner of a vise or similar hard surface. Go gently until the bullet is back in the correct location. You can single load these into the chamber for practice or re-crimp them if you bought dies. Until crimped, loading in the magazine will push them back again.

BrushBuster · « **Reply #3 on:** October 14, 2003, 07:31:21 AM »

Thank you both for your quick advice:
Common sense told me to stop using the gun and ammo. until I got this sorted out. I am in the process of locating an experienced handloader with the correct dies and will not take any chances. I plan to recrimp all that I have, and get into doing my own loading in future. I suspect that my habit of keeping my cartridges in my fleece pant leg pockets where they are quite warm when inserted into the gun has exacerbated things. Perhaps the brass expansion and lubricity have entered the picture. Don't know, but I wont let it happen anymore. Some of the bullets are so far down into the brass that they will not be easy to grab onto.

As a novice, I only partially understand crimping. I plan to purchase the Lee factory crimp die, and need to determine how much is enough crimp, and too little? I would also like to more clearly understand the reaction within the chamber of a cartridge that has a slipped bullet? Thanks again.

Blackhawk44 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 14, 2003, 07:43:18 AM »

Its not the heat of your body. That only effects the temperature of the powder and not enough to worry about. It has no effect on the metals. The crimps were weak to start with, then age relieved some of the stress of the original sizing and crimping and relaxed its hold further. Don't try to grip the bullet, use the pliers as an inertia bullet puller as described.