Author Topic: 7mm  (Read 2867 times)

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Offline ejpaul1

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7mm
« on: March 13, 2010, 05:26:10 AM »
I noticed someone had a post on 7mm-08 and comparing it to the parent case of the 308. I'd like to bring up the 7mm for discussion. I have shot several 7mm rounds and currently own a 7mm and am becoming a fan of the diameter for hunting. I have owned a 270 and loved it and woulod agree that in the smaller bullet weights, the difference is almost too small to notice a differenc eon game. Having said that, I also have a bunch of other chamberings from 45-70 all the way to a 223 and have gravitated towards the 7mm for almost all big game hunting involving a scope. I currently own a 7mm WSM and really like it for deer and elk. 160 grain accubonds (handloads) are coming in on the chrony at 3100 on average. The kick isnt too bad (noticable less than my 06) and the penetration on game is impressive.

My idea of a more perfect mountain rifle is currently 280 rem or a 7mm-08 in a lighter rifle, probably a kimber if I had my choice.

Anyone with a 7mm-08 or 280 want to ring in on the matter?

Offline Badnews Bob

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2010, 05:41:14 AM »
I have a .280 and a 7X57 thay are two of my favorite rifles, Easy to carry, easy to shoot and darned deadly on game. I have really come to love the 7mm and plan on owning a 7-08 and a 7mm TCU.

The .280 would cover it all but I like to have bunches of stuff. :)
Badnews Bob
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2010, 10:01:33 AM »
I guess that the 7mm bore is my favorite of them all. But in reality I think that the .270 Winchester bore diamer is actually closer to a TRUE 7MM than are the various 7mm rifles sold.

There is so little difference in on game performance between the 7-08, 7x57, .280 Remington and the various 7mm short mags as to be meaningless in the real world. I've owned a really large variety of the non magnum 7mms and can add the nearly same .270s as well. My smallest has been the 7 TCU and I really like it. I think a properly sized action chambered to 7 TCU with a 20" or so barrel would be a nice light little rifle to own.

I've used the 7-30 Waters and 7-08 most in the bore diameter and have gotten about as many one shot kills and DRT performance from them as from anything else I've ever used.

If it would shoot accurately enough a Kimber Montana in 7-08 should be a nearly ideal choice. When I asked Kimber what level of accuracy would be fair to expect from a Montana they hemmed and hawed but never would give me even a ball park figure so I passed on buying one and just picked up yet another Remington Model Seven as they always seem to be quite accurate.

Remington makes the LSS Mtn. Rifle as well as I think the detachable box mag Mtn. Rifle in both 7-08 and .280 Remington. You'll find a lot more factory loads for the 7-08 and the Hornady Light Mag ammo for it about matches the .280 factory numbers tho you can get an extra 100-150 fps from the .280 if you are a reloader. But game will never know the difference.


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Offline burntmuch

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2010, 10:06:48 AM »
Ive got a 7mm-08 in a rem model 7. Nice & compact. & light. Very little recoil shooting the 120s. & not much more with the 140s. I may be taking a pound off. replacing the wood stock with a synthetic For MY perfect mountain rifle. Wish I could push the heavier bullets a little faster with it though. My 7 mag in model 700 is a great shooter. Havnt started reloading for that yet. Something thats been bouncing around in my head for the last couple weeks or so. is getting my model 7 rechambered or rebarreled to .284 win. Or picking one up in 7mm wsm. The only thing stopping me is the al mighty dollar. My dreams are bigger than my bank account right now
I dont care what gun Im using as long as Im hunting

Offline charles p

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2010, 10:59:40 AM »
Don't know a thing about the 7mm WSM, but I do have a 280, 280AI. 7mm-08. 7-30Warter 14' Contender,  and a 7mm Rem Mag.  I like the 140 grain bullets in mine.  My 7mag and 280AI are too heavy to enjoy when much walking is involved.  My 7mm-08 is a 700 LVSF and perfect in every way.  MY standard 280 is also a light rifle.

I'm not an expert on elk hunting but I've probably taken two hundred whitetails. A 160 grain bullet is too heavy and not made for deer.  The 140 will be slightly hotter, flatter, and open very well.  Go with it on deer and use medium loads.










Offline yooper77

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2010, 11:39:14 AM »
I own a German Mauser 95 in 7x57 Ackely Improved and I handload IMR-4350 with Hornady 154 grain and its perfect deer medicine.

I also have a Weatherby Mark V Sporter in 7mm-08 which I will handload H4895 with Hornady 120 grain for youth deer loads and also any 140 grain bullets for deer.

Also have a 270 Winchester which I handload IMR-4831 with any 150 grain bullet for deer which is more of a 7mm.

yooper77

Offline ejpaul1

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2010, 05:20:54 PM »
Anyone notice I am not saying anything extrordinary about my 7mm WSM? Well, thats because there really isnt anything extrordinary about it other than the fact that it seems to recoil a bit less and weighs less than the 7mm rem mag I had. Really, you can get such good accuracy out of the 7mm Rem mag that there isnt any noticable difference between the regular mag and the WSM. Now a funny thing is that with hand loaded ammo my WSM is a bit faster overall than my old rem mag. I am finding as I get older that even the difference of 150 FPS ist the difference between success and failure. Thats why I am currently lusting after a 7mm-08. Any one run a 7mm-08 through a chrony? I am suspicious that a 140 grain bullet could get dangerously in the territory of the velocity of a 280. Someone her ementioned the hornady superperformance stuff. Lets hear it if you have any numbers!

Heres a few from my WSM in case anyone wants to know:
145 grain grand slam is averaging 3250 fps with 73 grains of magpro (real good accuracy)
160 grain accubond is averaging 3130 with 70 grains of magpro (real good accuracy)
150 grain  power point is averaging 3150 with 70 grains of magpro (pretty good accuracy)
139 grain hornady SST averaging 3350 with 73 grains of magpro (I cant get these to shoot worth a darn no matter how much or little powder I use or how I seat the bullet)

Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2010, 05:52:24 PM »
I guess that the 7mm bore is my favorite of them all. But in reality I think that the .270 Winchester bore diamer is actually closer to a TRUE 7MM than are the various 7mm rifles sold.
...

The BORE size of a 7mm is .... 7mm or ~0.2756".  The GROOVE size is .284".

BORE diameter for a .270 Win is ... .270".  GROOVE diameter is .277".

That means the BORE size of a 7mm is closer to 7mm than is a .270...

Coyote Hunter
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Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2010, 05:54:39 PM »
...
My idea of a more perfect mountain rifle is currently 280 rem or a 7mm-08 in a lighter rifle, probably a kimber if I had my choice.
...

A 7mm-08 in a compact handle makes a pretty potent, easy-to-carry rifle.
Coyote Hunter
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Offline yooper77

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2010, 06:15:08 PM »
I guess that the 7mm bore is my favorite of them all. But in reality I think that the .270 Winchester bore diamer is actually closer to a TRUE 7MM than are the various 7mm rifles sold.
...

The BORE size of a 7mm is .... 7mm or ~0.2756".  The GROOVE size is .284".

BORE diameter for a .270 Win is ... .270".  GROOVE diameter is .277".

That means the BORE size of a 7mm is closer to 7mm than is a .270...



It depends on how you look at it and actually most people consider the 270 is closer to 7mm.

.277" diameter bullet is 7.0358mm
.284" diameter bullet is 7.214mm

yooper77

Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2010, 01:11:07 AM »
It depends on how you look at it and actually most people consider the 270 is closer to 7mm.

.277" diameter bullet is 7.0358mm
.284" diameter bullet is 7.214mm

yooper77


yooper77 –

No, I doesn’t depend on “how you look at it”.  BORE diameter and GROOVE diameter are different and have specific meanings, regardless of whether or not individuals understand the difference.

Bullet diameter corresponds to GROOVE diameter, not BORE diameter. 

BORE diameter, by necessity,  is the smaller of the two measurements.

Calling a “cat” a “dog” doesn’t make it so.
Coyote Hunter
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2010, 01:43:34 AM »
I too share your affinity to the 7mm diameter.  As I kid growing up, my dad, uncles, great uncles and older cousins all had 308's. My grandfather had the '06 and 8mm's. EVERYONE had 30-30 Winchesters. I wanted something different, something no one else had and that "opinion" continues today. I always gravitate to the less popular rounds. I always wanted a 35Rem Marlin 336. One of my cousins also liked that model and bought one. As soon as I put my hands on it, MAN I was in love. But pop told me it wasn't what I wanted. It was a close range gun and not suited for the longer shots we occasionally had. So I shifted gears and looked at bolt guns and calibers, the 700 Remington and the 280 Rem came into focus. I was beginning my own hunting career and forming my own opinions on what a good caliber made. Gun Rag authors fueled the fires in my soul and when my ability to buy my own rifle came along that Remington 700 BDL in 280 Remington was mine. But with its long barrel and the woods hunting I had gravitated to didn't "jive". I ended up with a 358 Win in a Browning BLR. I hunted that rifle for many years leaving the 280 in the gun rack. Times changed and the 280 became the 7mm Express. I was rejuvenated and took the 280 out. (I still didn't have a 35Rem) A friends wife came to me looking to buy her hubby a rifle for Christmas and he wanted a 270 Rem pump. I looked and looked but none where available... but the 280 was!! That's what we got him. He thought it was typical "wife" nomenclature misnaming the caliber from lack of interest... he called me up later that morning with a thank you and an question as he never herd of the caliber. Together year after year we put and kept venison in the freezer with our 280's.

Threw the years I have owned and still own many 7mm's. (more than a few marlin 35Rems too.) I own more 7mm's than any other single caliber, followed by 35's. Like Bill, I discovered the 7mmTCU in a contender with my silhouette stint in the late '80's and early '90's. Then, I bought a 7mm/08 in early '85 just after they where introduced. The 7mm Mauser came later but it merely spanned my interest in the case and the 257 Roberts. I began building Mauser's for myself and the 280 was another must have caliber.

Unfortunately, that first Remington 280 is long gone. One of my most cherished rifles is a Argentine Mauser in 280 Remington, and a slick as grease functioning Marlin in 35 Rem.

Yup, I love the 7mm's too... It's a rainy day here, I think I'll head down to the safe and give 'em all a rub down...

CW
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Offline ejpaul1

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2010, 03:47:59 AM »
Thanks for the story cwlonshot. Good to hear about family traditions in hunting. We had none. I had to learn on my own. My dad went on his first deer hunt last year and got his first deer in the same trip with an old win 94 sesquintennial my grandfather aquired long ago. Now, he is a 30-30 fan. He just bought a henry 30-30. He lives in Kansas it looks like I'll be headed there again next year.

Is rifle building hard? I have wanted to do a re-barrel job on an old surplus rifle like a 7mm mauser but havent done any smith work. I have a degree in industrial engineering so I know enough to be concerned with safety. Can you work with old surplus actions?

Offline yooper77

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2010, 06:05:06 AM »
It depends on how you look at it and actually most people consider the 270 is closer to 7mm.

.277" diameter bullet is 7.0358mm
.284" diameter bullet is 7.214mm

yooper77


yooper77 –

No, I doesn’t depend on “how you look at it”.  BORE diameter and GROOVE diameter are different and have specific meanings, regardless of whether or not individuals understand the difference.

Bullet diameter corresponds to GROOVE diameter, not BORE diameter. 

BORE diameter, by necessity,  is the smaller of the two measurements.

Calling a “cat” a “dog” doesn’t make it so.


The thing is I do understand fully about groove vs. bore diameter.

Yes, It does depend on how you look at it, but I can agree to disagree with you.

yooper77

Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2010, 01:02:46 PM »
It depends on how you look at it and actually most people consider the 270 is closer to 7mm.

.277" diameter bullet is 7.0358mm
.284" diameter bullet is 7.214mm

yooper77


yooper77 –

No, I doesn’t depend on “how you look at it”.  BORE diameter and GROOVE diameter are different and have specific meanings, regardless of whether or not individuals understand the difference.

Bullet diameter corresponds to GROOVE diameter, not BORE diameter. 

BORE diameter, by necessity,  is the smaller of the two measurements.

Calling a “cat” a “dog” doesn’t make it so.


The thing is I do understand fully about groove vs. bore diameter.

Yes, It does depend on how you look at it, but I can agree to disagree with you.

yooper77


Apparently you DON’T understand or you would agree that the BORE diameter is not subject to interpretation.  The BORE diameter is the diameter of the hole in the barrel before the rifling grooves are impressed or cut.  For a .270 it is never .277”, it is .270” nominal.  For a 7mm it is never .284, it is 7mm or .2756” nominal.

Some cartridges get their name from GROOVE diameter, some from BORE diameter.  In the case of the .270 and 7mm’s the name is derived from the BORE diameter.  No matter “how you look at it”.

Go tell a custom barrel manufacturer you want a barrel chambered for .270 Win with a BORE diameter of .277” and see what they say…
Coyote Hunter
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Offline roper

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2010, 02:32:01 PM »
CH, you may want to check but the Groove dia on the 7mm is .2840" and Bore Dia is .2770"
Here what your claiming

"Some cartridges get their name from GROOVE diameter, some from BORE diameter.  In the case of the .270 and 7mm’s the name is derived from the BORE diameter.  No matter “how you look at it”.

Here Bartlein site on caliber bore/groove dia http://www.bartleinbarrels.com/calibers.htm

Offline yooper77

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2010, 02:33:42 PM »
It depends on how you look at it and actually most people consider the 270 is closer to 7mm.

.277" diameter bullet is 7.0358mm
.284" diameter bullet is 7.214mm

yooper77

yooper77 –

No, I doesn’t depend on “how you look at it”.  BORE diameter and GROOVE diameter are different and have specific meanings, regardless of whether or not individuals understand the difference.

Bullet diameter corresponds to GROOVE diameter, not BORE diameter.  

BORE diameter, by necessity,  is the smaller of the two measurements.

Calling a “cat” a “dog” doesn’t make it so.


The thing is I do understand fully about groove vs. bore diameter.

Yes, It does depend on how you look at it, but I can agree to disagree with you.

yooper77


Apparently you DON’T understand or you would agree that the BORE diameter is not subject to interpretation.  The BORE diameter is the diameter of the hole in the barrel before the rifling grooves are impressed or cut.  For a .270 it is never .277”, it is .270” nominal.  For a 7mm it is never .284, it is 7mm or .2756” nominal.

Some cartridges get their name from GROOVE diameter, some from BORE diameter.  In the case of the .270 and 7mm’s the name is derived from the BORE diameter.  No matter “how you look at it”.

Go tell a custom barrel manufacturer you want a barrel chambered for .270 Win with a BORE diameter of .277” and see what they say…


Yes I do understand, but I wasn’t talking about bore diameter, I was talking about bullet diameter (groove diameter).  Like I have said earlier, it does depend on how you look at it.

Overall it doesn’t matter since the differences between the 2 are so close.  Basically splitting hairs, my 270 Winchester vs. my 7mm-08 Remington are truly identical in performance with the same weight bullets.

Truly we can beat this subject to death, but I am bored of it.

yooper77

Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2010, 05:05:07 PM »
CH, you may want to check but the Groove dia on the 7mm is .2840" and Bore Dia is .2770"
Here what your claiming

"Some cartridges get their name from GROOVE diameter, some from BORE diameter.  In the case of the .270 and 7mm’s the name is derived from the BORE diameter.  No matter “how you look at it”.

Here Bartlein site on caliber bore/groove dia http://www.bartleinbarrels.com/calibers.htm

roper –

You make my point.  7mm is ~.2756” (rounding to nearest 0.0001”).  Barrel makers tend to drill the 7mm BORE a hair (0.0014”) larger at .277”.

As I stated before, the GROOVE diameter of the 7mm’s are .284” and the BORE diameter “is 7mm or .2756” nominal”.  In another post I said the same thing: “The BORE size of a 7mm is .... 7mm or ~0.2756".  The GROOVE size is .284".”  If you want to discuss the meaning of the mathematical symbol “~” or the word “nominal”, we can have that discussion.  In my statements I was using them synonymously.

If you look at Bartlein’s web site, or Krieger’s, you will see the following (the capitalization is mine):

Caliber  BORE Dia.    GROOVE Dia.
.270      .270          .277
7mm       .277          .284

Exactly what I’ve been saying…


The statement I took issue with initially was “the .270 Winchester bore diamer [sic] is actually closer to a TRUE 7MM than are the various 7mm rifles sold”.

The question then becomes “Which is closer to 7mm (.2756”) - .270” or .277”?  Very clearly is it NOT .270” unless you are in some kind of “new math” hell where 1+1=3…

Go to Bartlein and tell them you want to build a .270 Win with a .277” BORE diameter and see what they say.  They will be polite and probably won’t laugh until after you hang up the phone.  (That BORE diameter would work just fine for a 7MM, however…)

For what it is worth:

.270” = 6.858mm
.2756”= 7.000mm
.277” = 7.036mm
.284” = 7.214mm



Coyote Hunter
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Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2010, 02:50:34 AM »

Yes I do understand, but I wasn’t talking about bore diameter, I was talking about bullet diameter (groove diameter).  Like I have said earlier, it does depend on how you look at it.


yooper77 –

The discussion was about BORE diameter, not GROOVE/BULLET diameter.  The two diameters are not interchangeable.  If they were you could drill a .277” hole in a barrel blank and use the blank to make either a .270 or a 7mm barrel.  You could also get rich if you discover the secret to perpetual motion.  Good luck with both.

My post with which you took issue was very specific as to the differences between BORE size and GROOVE size.

Calling a “cat” a “dog” doesn’t make it so.  No matter “how you look at it” they are not the same.


Quote
Overall it doesn’t matter since the differences between the 2 are so close.  Basically splitting hairs, my 270 Winchester vs. my 7mm-08 Remington are truly identical in performance with the same weight bullets.

Truly we can beat this subject to death, but I am bored of it.

yooper77

I agree there isn’t much difference between the capabilities of a .277” bullet and a .284” bullet when they are of comparable weights and construction, but that is completely irrelevant to the discussion.
Coyote Hunter
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Offline roper

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2010, 03:10:13 AM »
CH, you may want to check but the Groove dia on the 7mm is .2840" and Bore Dia is .2770"
Here what your claiming

"Some cartridges get their name from GROOVE diameter, some from BORE diameter.  In the case of the .270 and 7mm’s the name is derived from the BORE diameter.  No matter “how you look at it”.

Here Bartlein site on caliber bore/groove dia http://www.bartleinbarrels.com/calibers.htm

roper –

You make my point.  7mm is ~.2756” (rounding to nearest 0.0001”).  Barrel makers tend to drill the 7mm BORE a hair (0.0014”) larger at .277”.






CH, I don't know if you ever got a good barrel in your hands but on the chamber end they list bore/goove dia  Bartlein  list bore/groove tolerance to +.0005" and Bore and Groove uniformity along entire length of barrel +.0001/-.0000.  Kreiger has the same spec as Bartlein.

What it all means in 7mm is you can get a bore dia of .277" to .2775" and groove dia of .284" to .2845"

Here what Lilja says about bore/groove dia
"Some may wonder why I left bore and groove diameters out of the first part of this article. Mainly because I don't feel that there is an exact size that a barrel must be for a nominal caliber. For example, a .30 caliber barrel does not have to have a groove diameter of exactly .30800" to be super accurate. While we do hold close tolerances on groove diameters (within about .0003") that actual diameter is not as important as the unifomity end-to-end. Actual bore diameter is less important than groove diameter too, but uniformity is still a necessity"



Offline AtlLaw

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2010, 04:07:48 AM »
"Some may wonder why I left bore and groove diameters out of the first part of this article. Mainly because I don't feel that there is an exact size that a barrel must be for a nominal caliber.
(emphisis added)

While I agree with what was said after the quote above, the author was talking about exact size as relates to what makes a barrel accurate.  Not industry standard dimentions.

In either event he qualifies his statement with "I don't feel ."  And, like opinions, feelings are neither right nor wrong.  They are just... feelings!   :-\  And both of those are kind of like the human butt... everybody has one, some stink, some don't.   :P

What WAS the name of that cartridge Rigby called their rifles chambered for the 7X57...  ???

   ;)   ;D
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Offline drdougrx

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2010, 06:22:51 AM »
Hey Richard!

7x57 was called the .275 Rigby.
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Offline roper

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2010, 06:43:43 AM »
"Some may wonder why I left bore and groove diameters out of the first part of this article. Mainly because I don't feel that there is an exact size that a barrel must be for a nominal caliber.
(emphisis added)

While I agree with what was said after the quote above, the author was talking about exact size as relates to what makes a barrel accurate.  Not industry standard dimentions.

In either event he qualifies his statement with "I don't feel ."  And, like opinions, feelings are neither right nor wrong.  They are just... feelings!   :-\  And both of those are kind of like the human butt... everybody has one, some stink, some don't.   :P

What WAS the name of that cartridge Rigby called their rifles chambered for the 7X57...  ???

   ;)   ;D
 

I disagree with you about how you interpret what Lilja is talking about since he makes a barrel and sells them to  buyers that demands accurate barrel.  If you don't like his barrel don't buy them why worry about what his butt smells like.

Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2010, 07:54:57 AM »
CH, I don't know if you ever got a good barrel in your hands but on the chamber end they list bore/goove dia  Bartlein  list bore/groove tolerance to +.0005" and Bore and Groove uniformity along entire length of barrel +.0001/-.0000.  Kreiger has the same spec as Bartlein.

I think you would have to consider the Krieger barrel on my 6.5-06AI a “good one”.

Quote
What it all means in 7mm is you can get a bore dia of .277" to .2775" and groove dia of .284" to .2845"

Which is exactly why I used the mathematical symbol “~” and the word “nominal” when specifying 7mm bore diameter.  The tilde (“~”) means “roughly approximates” while "nominal” as used in my posts means “in name only” or “approximate”.  As a trained machinist and someone who earned their living at that trade back in the 1970’s I fully understand the concept of tolerances.

Still, you once again make my point - unless you want to argue that a BORE diameter of  .270-.2705” is closer to 7mm ( .2756”) than  a BORE diameter of .277-.2775”.

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Here what Lilja says about bore/groove dia
"Some may wonder why I left bore and groove diameters out of the first part of this article. Mainly because I don't feel that there is an exact size that a barrel must be for a nominal caliber. For example, a .30 caliber barrel does not have to have a groove diameter of exactly .30800" to be super accurate. While we do hold close tolerances on groove diameters (within about .0003") that actual diameter is not as important as the unifomity end-to-end. Actual bore diameter is less important than groove diameter too, but uniformity is still a necessity"

Did you note that Lilja, like Bartlein and Krieger, specifically differentiates between BORE and GROOVE diameter?  Do you think the reason might be that they are NOT interchangeable?  

You do understand that this discussion is about BORE diameter for the .270 and 7mm, not GROOVE  or BULLET diameter?



Coyote Hunter
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Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2010, 08:03:34 AM »
"Some may wonder why I left bore and groove diameters out of the first part of this article. Mainly because I don't feel that there is an exact size that a barrel must be for a nominal caliber.
(emphisis added)

While I agree with what was said after the quote above, the author was talking about exact size as relates to what makes a barrel accurate.  Not industry standard dimentions.
...

I concur with AtLaw.  A barrel's bore and groove diameters can be undersized or oversized from industry specifications and still be wicked accurate.  Within limits, consistency of the diameters are more important than the actual diameters.
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Offline AtlLaw

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #25 on: March 15, 2010, 08:12:00 AM »
275 Rigby!  Thanks Doug, I knew it was 270 something...  ;) ;D

I disagree with you about how you interpret what Lilja is talking about

Great!  Then you agree with me that everyone has their own opinion on things that are said!?   ;D 

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since he makes a barrel and sells them to buyers that demands accurate barrel.

Well then, maybe he's better at building barrels then sentence structure...  :-\  Heck, what do I know, maybe we got an English Major around here that can help... Oops!  I mean a member who, in collage, had as his primary area of concentration, the study of the English language; not a Field Grade Officer in the British Army...  Funny how the written word can be interpreted a number of ways... ;)   :D

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If you don't like his barrel don't buy them

 ???  I like Lilja Barrels... at least the one I have... don't remember I saying I didn't...  :-\  Oh well, I'm sure it was something I wrote that gave you that impression... I'm sorry...   :'(  I should know how the written word can be misinterpreted... :-[

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why worry about what his butt smells like.

I dunno,  :-\  my wife always said I was a dog, but...  :P
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Offline mrbigtexan

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2010, 02:14:18 PM »
all this discusion and noone brought up the 7mm saum? i love it!

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #27 on: April 25, 2010, 09:00:43 AM »
all this discusion and noone brought up the 7mm saum? i love it!

Saw a Remington M700 7mm SAUM at the gun show yesterday, very reasonably priced.  Also saw a Ruger MKII stainless/laminate in .30-06 for the ame price.  Both like new.  I bought the Ruger .30-06.

Now I have three .30-06s, a Rem M700 and two Rugers, one each M77 and MKII.  Already have a 7mm, a Ruger M77 in 7mm Rem Mag.  My next 7mm will likely be a 7mm-08.  No love for the SAUMs here.
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Offline mrbigtexan

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2010, 05:52:45 PM »
all this discusion and noone brought up the 7mm saum? i love it!

Saw a Remington M700 7mm SAUM at the gun show yesterday, very reasonably priced.  Also saw a Ruger MKII stainless/laminate in .30-06 for the ame price.  Both like new.  I bought the Ruger .30-06.

Now I have three .30-06s, a Rem M700 and two Rugers, one each M77 and MKII.  Already have a 7mm, a Ruger M77 in 7mm Rem Mag.  My next 7mm will likely be a 7mm-08.  No love for the SAUMs here.
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Offline Coyote Hunter

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Re: 7mm
« Reply #29 on: April 25, 2010, 08:15:28 PM »
...  No love for the SAUMs here.
you dont know what your missing friend ;D

Not really.  No love for the WSM’s either.  By contrast,  I do like the RCM’s and the Ruger rifles chambered for them - but don’t see myself buying one any time soon.

A 7m-08 or .308 Win is about as much as I need in a short action and/or light rifle.
Coyote Hunter
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