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Author Topic: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target  (Read 1266 times)

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Offline ncsurveyor

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HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« on: October 03, 2009, 11:18:04 AM »
Guys,

I have an unfired Huntsman from 2002.

at 40 yards my saboted rounds are all over the target.

Using pyrodex pellets (2-50gr) and either 240gr 44 cal sabots (believe they are shockwaves) and some 45cal sabots (believe they are older than dirt) I am getting shots anywhere from 4" to 18" from point of aim!! ???

Also, had one round hit the target sideways!

I've recovered most of the fired sabots about 10-15 yards from the gun and all of them are petaled nicely.

What is going on?

I'm really frustrated.  Is this a break-in issue, or some other malevolencey?

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Offline bubba

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2009, 11:48:05 AM »
It coulld very well be not the load for your gun.  Did you look at the stickies and see all the little tweaks to make the gun more accurate?  some things such as an oring for flosting the barrel and making sure that the forarm screw is tightened about the same every time?  I would get some loose powder and start around 80 grains and work from there. 
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Offline ncsurveyor

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2009, 12:21:46 PM »
I tried o rings and screw pressure.

To be honest, this doesn't seem like an accurizing issue.  12 shots and anywhere from a foot high and a foot left, to 16" left, to a foot low.

A couple low between 4 and 8", a couple high and left about 8-10"

One actually hit where I was aiming, and a couple missed the cardboard target altogether.

All at 40 yards.
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Offline bubba

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2009, 12:45:19 PM »
scope or not is the scope tight is the scope any good
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”A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.”

Molon Labe

Remember... Four boxes keep us free: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.

Offline ncsurveyor

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2009, 01:55:02 PM »
Quote from: bubba on October 03, 2009, 12:45:19 PM
scope or not is the scope tight is the scope any good

Iron sights.  ;)


I owe you an apology.  I assumed my problem was special and as it turns out, after a few more shots, I tore everything down and lo and behold found a wood chip between the forearm and barrel near the stud.  Once removed  I put a shot on line and 3" low and 40 yards.

Followed by a shot 12" low and on line at 120 yards, which is about correct, by proportion.

I adjusted the rear sight a calculated 0.04" and drilled the 6" circle on the third shot.

Just goes to show how much a pressure point makes not only a dramatic difference, but the difference between consistent and erratic.

I owe you a beverage.

Jeff
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Offline bubba

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2009, 02:54:04 PM »
nah glad to help.  No need to apologize but Ill send you my mail address for the beverage lol.  Good luck, sounds like you are on the right track
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”A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.”

Molon Labe

Remember... Four boxes keep us free: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.

Offline ncsurveyor

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2009, 03:40:44 PM »
Quote from: bubba on October 03, 2009, 02:54:04 PM
No need to apologize ....

You had to be here when I said, "What the heck does Bubba know?  He needs to see this $#*&@ target!"

Anyway, when you come to High Point, NC, first one's on me.  ;)
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Offline bubba

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2009, 04:01:34 PM »
I dont know it all for sure. But through trial and error,I have made mine shoot very well. It is all good
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”A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.”

Molon Labe

Remember... Four boxes keep us free: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.

Offline jmv

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2009, 08:23:41 AM »
New to forum.  Whats a stickey and where do you find it with more info?  I have similar issue with bullets flying all over the paper at 100 yds. no forearm issues.  I looked all over your page. sorry, jay
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Offline zr800o1le

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2009, 10:38:09 AM »
Pellets could have something to due with it. I was talking to the Hogdon Rep Last weekend and he said that the Pellets should be thrown out after 2 years, They can pick up moisture from sitting and throw the burn rate off as much to interfere with consistant shots.
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Offline jmv

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2009, 06:17:02 AM »
crap !!  that makes my jug of Shockeys pellets kind pricey after 2 years.  100 pellets lasted too long. Hopefully fresh pellets and new suggestions on sabots will take care of my shooting issues next Spring.  You guys are are wealth of info. 
Speaking of which. what does a guy do with old pellets?
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Offline PHATINJUN

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2009, 06:48:42 AM »
I have always wondered about the Shockeys "Sticks" are they round pellets or square sticks? I use Shockey's Gold in my .58 Huntsman and love it not that I have any intrest in using it but I was curious about the sticks. I just thought even when I used pellets in my other Huntsmans that if I was not getting a tight packed powder charge I would be looking at problems .I wonder if that has anything to do with your issues? Kurt
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Offline jmv

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2009, 07:19:02 AM »
The Shockey Gold are elongated retangular pellets.  They are 50 gr each.  The are slightly narrow at one end to facilitate sliding into the barrel. Easy to use. never break apart.  It came recommended as a cleaner blackpowder.  I noticed the other day he has some that are 150gr  and just one long pellet.  I wanted simple to extend my deer season to take advantage of the separate muzzlelader season.  Inexpensive $85 barrel to swap for .223, no casting lead, no measuring powder,no side locks.  However the more you get into it, it seems you could get addicted to this past time.
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Offline Oscar2287

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2009, 05:51:07 PM »
Just want to jump on that thought you had PHATINJUN... I was ALWAYS told that it was important with black powder to have a packed charge (I've heard the same about using bp in cartridges) and I've wondered what effect all the air around the square (or even undersized cylindrical) pellets would have.  Maybe the air doesn't matter at all and the pack on the charge was misinformation so if somebody knows the answer to that I'd like to hear it.

Thanks
Isaac
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Offline jmv

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2009, 03:47:42 AM »
Are you thinking the Huntsman with standard 209  5/8 breechplug wasn't meant to work with pellets?
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Offline Oscar2287

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2009, 06:29:04 AM »
Nothing of the sort.  I'm proposing that pellets were designed to work well in all inlines - in order to make the process of loading and cleaning easier than when using loose bp - I'm asking whether there is any negative effect of having air pockets in the powder charge as a result of the shape or size of the pellets and how they fit into the chamber area.

I would assume the answer is that there is very little to no effect and that whatever effect there is is offset by the advantages of having a precisely measured load (consistency) every time.  More than anything I would think this based on the success that pellets have had in the muzzleloader community - if they didn't work nobody would use them. 

At the same time I find it to be an interesting possibilty and find myself wondering then how important it is to have loose powder compression loaded?
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Offline Paints-n-cows

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Re: HELP! HUNTSMAN throwing bullets all over the target
« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2009, 03:04:39 AM »
I was kind of wondering the same thing.  A friend of mine uses those pellets in his .50 ML and I use the regular powder in my Huntsman.  We got to talking about the air around the charge thing (square pellet in a round barrel) and from what I remember, air around a burning charge of blackpowder causes it to explode instead of burn.  Wouldn't that cause the pressures to jump dramatically?
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