Gun smiths opinion on a ithica shotgun

[fox fire]

 I ran into a Ithica 37 ( I think thats the model #) turkey gun with full camo and a ported barrel, looked real nice, but I havent had a Ithica in about 10 years and was curious if ther has been any major changes in them since???  and compared to the Remington or a Mossberg how are they???   I'm wunderin about the barrel design ( forcing cone/ finish on the bore/ect.) if it mite be made any better than some others.
 
 One reason I'm askin is my cousin has a older Ithica 20 gauge single shot that's made like a lever action that shoots great, it'll knock a squirrel out of a tree top as good as some 12 ga., we've miked the inside of the choke and it's titer than most we've compared it to.
 
   Just figured ther mite be someone that really knew more and mite give me some food for thought, wouldnt mind buy'n it for this turkey season if it's a better than average gun.
   
                                                                                           Thanx in advance

[fox fire]

I found some info on the turkey slayer last nite, according to the write up they(Ithica) were producing these guns with "excessively long forcing cones on both end's of the barrel".   
And if I remember rite the longer the forcing cone the better the gun SHOULD shoot, correct???
 
 It also stated that the chokes wre compatable with the winchokes, so any choke tube that fits a winchester should work with this barrel.
 
 Sounds interesting to me, next time I visit the store it'll probably come home with me.

[mannyrock]

  I am not a gunsmith, so sorry for butting in.  But, I have been hunting steadily since the mid-1960s, when the Ithica 37 was in full production.  In my experience, they were never viewed as being superior in any way to the Remington 870 Wingmaster.   The vast majority of folks preferred the Wingmaster, and those that shot the Ithica did so because because they were left-handed (it ejected spent cases from the bottom), or because "their grandfathers owned one", and they just bought them out of sentimental purposes.  The Ithica also seemed to have a regional following in the New England area, though I am not sure why.   

     I know that the Remingtons have twin action bars, but I am not totally sure that the Ithicas do.

   The Remington 870 Wingmaster has been, and continues to be, the gold standard of pump shotguns, for 50 years.

[Three44s]

The Rem 870 is the gold standard ...........

....... but it's hardly the last word on shotguns.

The gold standard of:  Durability is certainly important ........ especially in a defensive shotgun.

But shotguns are measured in other parameters.

And the Winchester mod 12 and the Ithaca 37 as well as some other pump guns rate high amoung bird hunters, particularily upland hunters.

My wife and I own 870 Wingmasters ...... we also own Ithaca's ..........

We cherrish both guns.

Three 44s

[fox fire]

 You aint buttin in, no problem with your input, rite.    Only reason I mentioned gunsmiths was I figured they could offer some insight on the forcing cone, but from what I've read a longer forcing help with a tighter pattern, particularly with some of the newer types of shot (hevi shot and the like) but lead shot can deal with a shorter forcing cone better because it's softer. (if I remember)
   just thought they would have the knowledge to set me straight.

[gunnut69]

I've worked on a lot of shotguns over the years and several 37's. They main complaint is poor extraction/ejection. For some reason, not sure why, the 37's seem to have a propesity to rust the chambers. Combined with less than stellar extraction leverage and well you see where we're at. The main difficulty with the 37 overall is that it does too much on a single fore and aft movement. It limits the leverage of the extraction and raising the new round for feeding. I grew up with a M12 Winchester and find even the 870 rougher in its action. The 870's main claim to fame is reliability. I really don't think the twin action bars make any difference, at least they haven't for me. Also of all the 870's I've worked on and that's a bundle, none have ever exihibited a badly rusted chamber.. Some had rust but not bad...That I just don't understand. Really early 37's don't have interchanggeable barrels. The must be factory fitted. It's based on the serial number..

[fox fire]

 Thanx a bunch gun nut, I was ponderin on the twin action bars today, just kinda curious as to how much of a difference they realy make, I'm not educated in this enuff to say but I dont see a big benifit but then again what do I know.
 I'd realy like to try it out, I've been diggin around outher sites and aint found a lot of info on the 37, thers a fraternity of people that love them but ther far and few between.

[Rangr44]

[The Ithica also seemed to have a regional following in the New England area, though I am not sure why.]

1) Ithaca Model 37's offered the best weather protection to the ammunition, in the days before sealed plastic hulls, because they have no openings in the top or sides of the receiver.
The same would hold true for today's rifled slug ammo, with open-ended hulls.

2) Ithaca Deerslayer barrels were bored undersize, giving superior RS (Foster type) accuracy.

In matter of fact, I won more than a few 100yd shooting competitions (turkey shoots) against CF rifles (most scoped) before the sponsors changed the rules to "rifles ONLY" to save them embarrasment.

3) I've NEVER seen a worn out or broken Ithaca Model 37.

.

[fox fire]

 Sounds like a no non sence testamony, I thought that the popularity up north mite have been because they were made in New York ( if I'm rite) and they were supportin the home team.

[mannyrock]

  Make no mistake.  I'm not saying that the Ithaca 37 was a bad shotgun.  It wasn't.  For many many years, the Ithaca 37 Deerslayer was absolutely the best slug gun you could buy.   With a smooth bore and Foster Slugs, my brother use to get 2 and 3 nch groups at 100 yards, remarkable accuracy for its day.

    But, the Ithaca 37 as a shotgun never enjoyed the reputation or following of the Winchester Model 12, or the later Remington 870 Wingmaster.

     I have found that the Remington 870 Wingmaster, with its twin action bars, gives easy and positive extraction, and  there is no binding or twisting since there is a steel bar on each side of the forearm.  As for being smooth, after about 500 rounds, the Wingmaster is as smooth as glass. 

      Now, I'm talking about the Wingmaster version of the Remington 870s. NOT the plain 870s or the Sportsman 870s.   Those actions are terrible.

      If you want a relatively light, reliable, upland game shotgun, then I think the Ithaca will work fine for you.

Regards,

Mannyrock   

[mbopp]

I had a 16 ga M37 as my first shotgun, I later traded it on a handgun. My current 12 ga M37 was made in 1977 in Ithaca, NY.

We were hunting in freezing rain years ago. The M37's were the only shotguns functioning, the Remy's and Brownings had frozen up into single-shots.
But the skeet and trap shooters didn't like them, saying they shot loose a lot quicker than an 870.
And I thought I read somewhere the M37 was actually designed by John Browning.
Ithaca went bankrupt and their equipment was sold. A few folks who worked at the factory now advertise for Ithaca repairs. I've seen a website where Ithaca is being resurrected somewhere in Ohio but don't know if that's currently correct.
I had a 20" slug barrel that wouldn't shoot worth a darn but I hear the 24" barrels were better. Years ago I took a 28" VR modified barrel, cut 2" off the end to get rid of the choke, and fitted some home-made sights to the rib. This was before rifled barrels and fiber optic sights were available. I put a scope on last year and with Federal Foster slugs it'll do 3" at 75 yards. Not bad for a smoothbore.

[drdougrx]

I've had a deerslayder deluxe (cheesey painted on high gloss finish) with an extra vented bird barrel since 1982.  Accurate with foster slugs?  Amazing!  My only complaint is that it knocks the crap outta me!!!!

[Cheesehead]

I bought a 37 in 1980 and it was old then. Has always been reliable. I wonder how old it is and if I could put a slug barrel on it.

Cheese

[gunnut69]

The early 37's had to have the barrels factory fitted. On the later guns barrels were interchangeable. The break was defined by serial number but I don't know the number off hand. I'll see if I can find it and post back.