Author Topic: Two diameter resizing die for cast boolets? (Read 808 times)

Cat Whisperer · « **on:** October 25, 2003, 02:56:31 PM »

In experimenting with sizers and casting (with some frustration in making the boolet the RIGHT size to both be large enough to correctly engage the rifling and the nose of the right size to lightly engrave for bore riding.

SO - what about a two diameter sizing die for sizer-lubricators? Nose punch would have to be part of the eject rod and the pushrod would be flat based to push the boolet in nose-first and then be ejected by the eject rod.

The result would be a die that would ensure by sizing or swaging the cast boolet to fit the throat.

I would assume that the strength of a swaging press would be usefull.

Thoughts anyone?

Donna · « **Reply #1 on:** October 26, 2003, 05:09:15 AM »

Cat Whisperer

Why cast then swage? Granted my powers of perception do not run with casting but doesnt the swaging part negate the casting part? So, why? What am I not getting here? :?

Donna :wink:

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #2 on:** October 26, 2003, 08:04:59 AM »

It may be a simple matter to 'swage' a lead boolet to two sizes so that it fits exactly, perhaps just a little more work than lubricating-sizing. That keeps the costs down in both time and money.

There are some real advantages to non-jacketed boolets. High velocity isn't always an advantage.

Lead pot · « **Reply #3 on:** October 26, 2003, 01:15:14 PM »

Cat Whisperer.

I have cast and lube bullets I use for what I call match bullets,then run them through the swage press to bump them up to a larger diameter to fit a larger bore.(.002)with good results.It saves buying another custom mould when I already had the dies.
When you lube the cast bullet before you swage the lube grooves dont deforme,and you will get a verry uniform and sharp base bullet that shoots extreamly well.
I found swaging a lead bullet then grooving it that just dont work for Black powder you cant carry enough lube,and if you groove it deeper you will deform the bullet(push the extra lead elswere).
Untill they come up with a swage die afordable were you can swage the grooves this is the way I'm going to do it.

With my custom moulds from Paul and Steve I dont swage my lead bullets unless I have to.

Lp.

Lead pot · « **Reply #4 on:** October 26, 2003, 01:29:00 PM »

Cat Whisperer.

I forgot to say my moulds I had Paul and Steve build, do engage the bore and groove for my Shilohs and high walls.

Lp.

Donna · « **Reply #5 on:** October 26, 2003, 11:59:27 PM »

I have not done too much with non-jacketed bullets but swaging is not just for jacketed bullets. I guess it is just to have something else to do and as Lead pot said It saves buying another custom mould when I already had the dies. I still dont see much of in the way of merit in doing this but if it works for you to swage after casting more power to ya. Have fun guys.

Donna :wink:

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #6 on:** October 27, 2003, 01:05:00 AM »

LP -
Thanks for the info. You've brought up a perspective that I'd forgotton - a good concept of how to do this.

The issues involve sizing to two diameters. What I'd ASSUMED was that I was going to reduce BOTH to the desired sizes. What you'd mentioned, that I'd forgotton, was the concept of bumping up in diameter.

One of the other folks on another board had suggested in getting the smaller diameter die and reaming out a portion of it. That makes manufacturing sense.

Another suggested in starting by making a new die (without lube holes) as (in his case) the alloy would fill the lube holes on attempted ejection and destroy the boolet.

This all leads to something that can be simple or may be even more complicated - as two sizing dies - one for each end - each with it's own ejection process. Not something I'm going to START with.

Thanks ALL.

(I asked here because expertise is where you find it, not necessarily where it should be in the index.)

Lead pot · « **Reply #7 on:** October 27, 2003, 03:12:09 AM »

CW.

I had a machine shop make a die for me once for my saeco like you asked about.I had a long bore rider made up once with a lube groove on the bore section of the bullet.It was a long 560 gr .450-.460 bullet,with 3- .095 lube grooves for the groove and a .100 groove on the long bore section.It worked great for the oversized barrel on the rifle(.452-.460).I had a ejection pin to fit the ogive.The problem was when going with a .458 erducing sizing die.It would deform the lube grooves.That is why I started to swage the lubed bullet to eliminate that problem.The lube acts like a hydrolic ram and holds the lead in place and lets the excess lead blead out.

CW- I looked up your grid I cant get enough elevation on my Sharps :-D

Lp.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #8 on:** October 27, 2003, 11:50:53 AM »

LP -
Thanks for the response. I figured if I thought of it someone else has already done it.

In reference to deforming lube grooves - someone mentioned that they would size and lube (lightly size) and then with the lube grooves full they would do a radical resize. Is that fundamentally the process you're describing?

CW

(I'm at just under 2000' elevation, but from your vantage point the rotation of the earth won't help; but the prevailing winds should help - it's a tough calculation.)

Lead pot · « **Reply #9 on:** October 28, 2003, 03:37:36 AM »

CW.

I never had good results drastic sizing bullets down with a lube sizer,they like I said push the excess lead in the grooves.I never tried the light lube and sizing and resizing.With lubing then swaging the results have been working.

I might have known a canoneer would bring that earth rotation into the equation :roll:

Lp.