Author Topic: Has anyone used the 200 grn .358 silver tip on game ? (Read 1590 times)

Country Boy · « **on:** February 10, 2010, 01:31:37 PM »

Planning to use the 200 grn silvertip, the one with the alumunim cap, on a bear hunt this spring. Has anyone had any experience with this bullet on game ?

Country Boy · « **Reply #1 on:** February 10, 2010, 01:32:43 PM »

Forgot to mention the rifle is a blr in .358 winchester.

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #2 on:** February 11, 2010, 06:42:58 AM »

C.B. I looked back at my notes on the .358...Have shot several hogs, antelope and one mulie with mine, but all were taken with hand loads....they worked fine..I am currently sighted in with 200 grain Silvertips..but as of now have not taken any game with them...Sorry..I took the rifle and ammo on a spring hunt last year, but did not get a chance to use it...let us know how yours works out...I think I would feel very comfortable using it on game......

BlackWolf · « **Reply #3 on:** February 11, 2010, 11:25:13 AM »

Country Boy, long time no chat. I got my rifle back last summer from the factory (also a blr). I didn't have time to do any testing with handloads since it returned and have only sighted in with the factory loads. So far I've found these to be very consistent, however, we closed on our new house the first day of bear season (we saw a couple of different ones but my father was scoping a buck when the one came past and didn't have time to get a shot off) and I didn't get out for deer season due to both the new house and doctor's appointments for the new baby that my wife and I are expecting - literally any moment... So unfortunately I haven't used these on game at all but I would not hesitate to use them on any bear short of huge charging brown bear (I feel pretty confident that I could stop one with a few well placed shots, but there are better tools for that job). Good luck on your hunt, I look forward to reading about it!

Country Boy · « **Reply #4 on:** February 11, 2010, 11:39:53 AM »

Thank yoy Blackwolf. I'm concerned if theseold factory 200 grn silvertip will shoot through a black bear. I was going to shoot one through a 4x4 log to see if it would penetrate at 25 yds. But, we have so much snow I can"t get out. I killed a few black bears with .250 grain reloads but no longer have the reloading stuff. But. I came by 6 boxes of the old .200 grn silvertip. I've never shot any game with them and am leary of their performance. Many years ago I did shoot a bear with one and it just drilled a hole through him and we had a long trail job and lost the bear thats when I switched to the .250's handloaded.

lgm270 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 11, 2010, 12:02:25 PM »

Quote from: Wyo. Coyote Hunter on February 11, 2010, 06:42:58 AM

C.B. I looked back at my notes on the .358...Have shot several hogs, antelope and one mulie with mine, but all were taken with hand loads....they worked fine..I am currently sighted in with 200 grain Silvertips..but as of now have not taken any game with them...Sorry..I took the rifle and ammo on a spring hunt last year, but did not get a chance to use it...let us know how yours works out...I think I would feel very comfortable using it on game......

You have to look at notes to know what rounds you've used on game animals?

You must have a huge amount of hunting and shooting experience. I really envy you. I wish I had done so much hunting and shooting I had to keep "notes" to know what animal I shot with what rifle.

Cheesehead · « **Reply #6 on:** February 11, 2010, 01:13:35 PM »

Where do you get silver tips?

Cheese

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #7 on:** February 11, 2010, 03:05:21 PM »

Cheese, I have bought silvertips in the last few years, but honestly I couldn't tell you when I bought the last ones...I think WW still loads them for the .358, but maybe not, I may have just picked up some old stock...

lmg270, I have kept notes from the time I shot my first deer, and even before that probably from about the time I was 14 or so...that will soon be 50 years of notes...this fall was my 50th as a licensed hunter...adds up to a lot of time in the field...It has been costly...I was just thinking today, I passed up a couple high paying jobs because it would have required a move to a huge city...here hunting was 3 blocks away...I would have made more money, but we only have so much time...I can always make more money, but my time on this earth is limited...I didn't want to waste it doing things I didn't like......any way the notes many journals are fun to look over now....somethings I have totally forgotten, others were not quite the way I remembered...thanks for the kind words...It has been fun, and I have very few if any regrets....hope everyone can say that ...

lgm270 · « **Reply #8 on:** February 11, 2010, 03:31:12 PM »

Quote from: Wyo. Coyote Hunter on February 11, 2010, 03:05:21 PM

Cheese, I have bought silvertips in the last few years, but honestly I couldn't tell you when I bought the last ones...I think WW still loads them for the .358, but maybe not, I may have just picked up some old stock...

lmg270, I have kept notes from the time I shot my first deer, and even before that probably from about the time I was 14 or so...that will soon be 50 years of notes...this fall was my 50th as a licensed hunter...adds up to a lot of time in the field...It has been costly...I was just thinking today, I passed up a couple high paying jobs because it would have required a move to a huge city...here hunting was 3 blocks away...I would have made more money, but we only have so much time...I can always make more money, but my time on this earth is limited...I didn't want to waste it doing things I didn't like......any way the notes many journals are fun to look over now....somethings I have totally forgotten, others were not quite the way I remembered...thanks for the kind words...It has been fun, and I have very few if any regrets....hope everyone can say that ...

A great statement.

Harry Snippe · « **Reply #9 on:** February 12, 2010, 04:01:14 AM »

I have used Winchester(308) silver tips on deer , but this goes back about twenty years . Some of the bullets fragmented on the way and deer were lost . We tired a few shots on paper thinking the rifle sites were off and this was what we found on target . Flakes of lead on the target instead of a round hole . We sent the box back to Winchester and in return they just sent us a new box.
Another deer was shot in the lungs with a quartering away shot, and took out the right shoulder with a big exit hole . Lots of meat lost . So quit using the silvertips and a lot more game went to the freezer.
So if your not reloading for the 358 BLR maybe you should.I already said what I was loading on another post for the 358 W.
Other than that buy two box's of winchester silver tips with the same lot number and shoot a few rounds on paper to insure they are good to go.

bigswede · « **Reply #10 on:** February 12, 2010, 02:16:27 PM »

A few years back I used the silvertips on a big boar. He was shot about 20-25 yds, over hounds, in a huge Red Fir, about 1/2 mile straight up off the mighty St. Joe River. The first two shots, I was trying to break his neck, missed the spine by an inch or two. The third shot I just plane missed, and the fourth shot went through his lungs and killed him before he hit the ground. After inspection one of the houndsman, who packs a 45/70 guide gun, said,"Holy Crap, what did you shoot him with, that was AWESOME!." I didn't recover any of the three bullets. I would say they should work fine. My kill should have ended with that first shot, the steep angle into the tree threw me off a little.

Country Boy · « **Reply #11 on:** February 13, 2010, 06:34:33 AM »

Thank you Big Swede. That is just the kind of info I was looking for. I have a little more confidence in this old factory load now.

bigswede · « **Reply #12 on:** February 13, 2010, 07:18:26 AM »

The 358 win is just a good cartridge. Period.

BBF · « **Reply #13 on:** February 13, 2010, 01:17:01 PM »

No expierence with the 358 ST myself, I did find out over the years when they were available that they gave much different results depending on caliber and weight. One of the worst of them was the 200 gr RN that was only loaded into the 308 Win. Even at the modest velocity the bullet fragmented badly.

jro45 · « **Reply #14 on:** February 14, 2010, 03:14:38 AM »

I haven't used the Silver tip bullet but I did kill a bear with a partition 200gr bullet. I used my 300 RUM shot it right threw the heart. One shot he was dead.

Harry Snippe · « **Reply #15 on:** February 14, 2010, 07:39:27 AM »

Quote from: BBF on February 13, 2010, 01:17:01 PM

No expierence with the 358 ST myself, I did find out over the years when they were available that they gave much different results depending on caliber and weight. One of the worst of them was the 200 gr RN that was only loaded into the 308 Win. Even at the modest velocity the bullet fragmented badly.

If you have a 358 W and you reload there is a lot of good 358 Dia bullets on the market to pick from . I do not really know why Winchester only loads for this cartridge . There are a lot of new BLR's going off the self in this round, so if some more ammo was on the self maybe too the sales too would increase .

flinter54 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 16, 2010, 12:02:27 PM »

I agree with Harry. With the recent interest in the .358 and the continued growth with the 35 Whelen and the 350rem mag there are some excellent bullets on the market. Barnes, Hornady, Nosler, Sierra, Speer, and Swift to name a few. They all make bullets to fit any situation suitable for the .358 and even expand its game taking ability. Like Harry alluded to, for those that don't reload, it would be nice to see other ammo companies start offering some .358 loadings.

Harry Snippe · « **Reply #17 on:** February 17, 2010, 06:49:26 AM »

I do not really understand companies that put out a product like Browning BLR and not have the ammo to support it . Federal has it's 338F and three loadings , but here in Central Ontario Canada there is a niche for the 358 W and there is a waiting list for any older used BLR in 358W.
There is mixed farms in this country with lots of bush lots . Lots of good sized deer , black bear and some moose. The 358 W is a cartridge that shines.
Most people reloadand the 225 Gr. is preferred in this cartridge for the best weight and retained energy.

So if you could buy some factory358W ammo at your local shop with differant bullet offering, I am sure there would be a lot more BLR's and Ruger Hawkeye coming off the self and heading to the woods .
But that is just us in Canada which I am told covers only about 10% of the market place , so it is up to you good guys in the states to start a fire under some ones butt to get some one to offer 358 W loads other than the only one under Winchester brand name.

So guys get in touch with Browning, Remington, Winchester and Federal and demand some ammo.

Country Boy · « **Reply #18 on:** February 17, 2010, 01:18:29 PM »

It is offered in the blr AND the Rugar 77 I've got both, great rifles and vel. you wouldn"t how about 2750 fps with the 200 grn hornady spire point ! or 2350 with the .250 hornady - TAC powder.

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #19 on:** February 17, 2010, 05:04:11 PM »

harry, I hear you about the .358 I have a model 99, but as I travel though much of the U.S. and always look at gun shops..the .358 just aint that popular...sorry to say...even in the whitetail country of the east coast most like a Rem. pump in .30-06...Ammo companies look a volume, and the .358 just doesn't have it and it never will...I hate to say it, but it is true..the 35's have never caught on here. at this time I feel they never will...It is like Bob Hagle said he can kill a buck in the brush with his 6mm at 75 yards..He can do the same with a say 35 Rem..His 6 mm will also take a buck at 350 with ease...the 35 is out of luck...Most of us hunt areas where a long shot CAN crop up...and as sure as it does, it will be at a huge buck..this is why the 35's awill not be popular in the U.S> I like mine, but it is more of a specialty item than allround hunting rifle...... $:-\$

Savage_99 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 17, 2010, 05:21:26 PM »

I have taken about 50 whitetail deer since 1966 with the 200 gr Silvertip handloaded in a .358 Win. M99. It had excellent performance and not one deer was lost. Most bullets exited the deer.

Ranges were from up close to about 200 yds.

I had to stop using the bullets as they were discontinued as components. I now load the 180 Speer. No bear were shot.

I would not use that bullet for just bear if a exit wound was wanted.

Instead ask about a stronger controlled expanding bullet.

lgm270 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 18, 2010, 02:50:24 AM »

Quote from: Savage_99 on February 17, 2010, 05:21:26 PM

I have taken about 50 whitetail deer since 1966 with the 200 gr Silvertip handloaded in a .358 Win. M99. It had excellent performance and not one deer was lost. Most bullets exited the deer.

Ranges were from up close to about 200 yds.

I had to stop using the bullets as they were discontinued as components. I now load the 180 Speer. No bear were shot.

I would not use that bullet for just bear if a exit wound was wanted.

Instead ask about a stronger controlled expanding bullet.

Hi 99. Where did you do most of your hunting? Would love to hear more of your experiences.

Harry Snippe · « **Reply #22 on:** February 18, 2010, 04:42:03 AM »

Quote from: Wyo. Coyote Hunter on February 17, 2010, 05:04:11 PM

harry, I hear you about the .358 I have a model 99, but as I travel though much of the U.S. and always look at gun shops..the .358 just aint that popular...sorry to say...even in the whitetail country of the east coast most like a Rem. pump in .30-06...Ammo companies look a volume, and the .358 just doesn't have it and it never will...I hate to say it, but it is true..the 35's have never caught on here. at this time I feel they never will...It is like Bob Hagle said he can kill a buck in the brush with his 6mm at 75 yards..He can do the same with a say 35 Rem..His 6 mm will also take a buck at 350 with ease...the 35 is out of luck...Most of us hunt areas where a long shot CAN crop up...and as sure as it does, it will be at a huge buck..this is why the 35's awill not be popular in the U.S> I like mine, but it is more of a specialty item than allround hunting rifle...... $:-\$

Well the 35 Rem hangs on, and is almost dead up here in Ontario Canada. I could never buy ammo for it locally as well as the 35 Whelan. The whelan never really caught on , but you can order Ammo for it as with the 35 Remington chambered by Marlin for the most part . The fact that you can not buy ammo unless you order from a supply house , is one reason your not seeing the chambering in the bush up here "UnLESS!!" one wants to reload, or the price is way abovewhat one would pay for the '06or 308W.
That too is the two reasons the 338 F sales are slow here too. Price and the lack of Ammo.
Now if one does not reload the question asked is always How much for ammo and where can I get it .Then next is lets look at that gun!!. If you reload you can get a deal on the 338F and 358W or whelan when a gun comes up.So most will just buy a 30 cal something 'cause ammo is every where period.
There is no demand here for the Marlin 308 and 338ME too for there is no ammo and the cost does up to order it in . Then I am sure they would be good to hunt with . The 308 ME comares to the 300 Savage in powder and there sure are alot of 300 Savage guns here and ammo is every where too.
So see a patern ?

Savage_99 · « **Reply #23 on:** February 18, 2010, 05:03:20 PM »

lgm,

Most of the deer and other smaller animals were shot in Vermont but some were taken in Maine, Connecticut and Penn.

Search for comments on 24HRcampfire by gunwriter John Barsness (Mule Deer) screen name. He writes that Silvertip bullets in general do not perform well. Of course I was using a large bullet on medium size game.

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/3509582/Searchpage/1/Main/272214/Words/silvertip/Search/true/Re_Winchester_Silvertips#Post3509582

jro45 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 19, 2010, 02:18:50 AM »

I killed a bear using Noslers 200 gr partition bullet Right thru the heart. It was an instant
kill.

jcn59 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 23, 2010, 04:40:49 PM »

You have lots of good info here.

I have a .358 BLR. Before I started loading for it I got an old box or two of those silvertips. I shot five or ten and noticed splits in the cases. Some kind of brass deterioration from the inside out. Never shot any more of those.

This type of "silvertip" is a fast expanding bullet not noted for penetration. They use the aluminum cap to protect a large expanse of exposed lead. Heck of a deer bullet. It'll kill the bejabbers out of a bear if you hit it right. Better to use a 220 gr. flat nose or a 250 I think.

Bigeasy · « **Reply #26 on:** February 23, 2010, 04:48:24 PM »

I have used the 358 200 grain silvertip factory load on four or five deer. It is a little on the soft side. My experience is it will go into a deers chest, and do a lot of damage without usually coming out the other side. Great for broad side shots, not so good for extreme angles, or really heavy game. In my .358 BLR, I like the Nosler Partition. It opens up easy and does a lot of damage, but the rear shank stays together for deep penetration.

Larry

Larry Gibson · « **Reply #27 on:** March 01, 2010, 04:01:00 AM »

I've 35 of the 200 gr STs left that I hoard for use in my .35 Rem. I have a M91 Mauser I rebarreled with a 26" barrel. I push them at 2300 fps with my reloads and they are death on deer. I don't think I'd want to push them any faster. My guess is they were made/designed for the 2000 fps out of Marlin .35 Rems.

I also have 95 left of the 190 gr ST .30 cals made for the .303 Savage. I load them to 2200 fps out of my 24" M94 and they also are death on deer and elk.

Larry Gibson