Author Topic: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??  (Read 1569 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

TM7

  • Guest
Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« on: April 15, 2010, 05:40:06 AM »
fyi....archaeological news disturbing to some...??.....TM7

Source of Bible Covenant with God discovered?   
April, 14 2010 
 
 
Archaeologists working in Turkey have unearthed an Assyrian tablet dating to around 670 BCE that "could have served as a model for the biblical description of God's covenant with the Israelites." What this fascinating discovery suggests, of course, is that the Bible tale of a divine pact does not represent "history" or a "factual" event, but is instead a fictional rewrite, borrowing or plagiarism of this older Assyrian treaty.



Over the centuries, many Bible critics, minimalists and mythicists have asserted that much of the Old Testament constitutes not factual history but a rehash of ancient myths and traditions dating to before the founding of the Jewish kingdom. This new find apparently adds more evidence to that theory, and it is quite refreshing that both the scholars and the media are spelling out clearly this possible "borrowing," without prejudice in favor of bibliolatry or upholding unprovable matters of faith.
Ancient treaty resembles part of the Bible

Canadian archeologists in Turkey have unearthed an ancient treaty that could have served as a model for the biblical description of God's covenant with the Israelites.

The tablet, dating to about 670 BC, is a treaty between the powerful Assyrian king and his weaker vassal states, written in a highly formulaic language very similar in form and style to the story of Abraham's covenant with God in the Hebrew Bible, says University of Toronto archeologist Timothy Harrison.

Although biblical scholarship differs, it is widely accepted that the Hebrew Bible was being assembled around the same time as this treaty, the seventh century BC.

"Those documents...seem to reflect very closely the formulaic structure of these treaty documents," he told about 50 guests at the Ottawa residence of the Turkish ambassador, Rafet Akgunay.

He was not necessarily saying the Hebrews copied the Assyrian text, substituting their own story about how God liberated them from slavery in Egypt on the condition that they worship only Him and follow His commandments.

But it will be interesting for scholars to have this parallel document.

"The language in the [Assyrian] texts is [very similar] and now we have a treaty document just a few miles up the road from Jerusalem."...

Notable is the fact "it is widely accepted that the Hebrew Bible was being assembled around the same time as this treaty," i.e., during the 7th century BCE. The case for this "late" dating of the Old Testament's compilation - with a significant part of it also written later, after the Jews' "Babylonian Exile" (597-538 BCE) - has been made by Israeli archaeologists, including and especially Israel Finkelstein in The Bible Unearthed.

Although the article states that the archaeologist Timothy Harrison "was not necessarily saying the Hebrews copied the Assyrian text, substituting their own story about how God liberated them from slavery in Egypt," it is nonetheless raising that very issue in a manner which breaks with the centuries-old tradition of bending all finds in the "Holy Land" and other places of biblical interest to fit the Bible, in attempts to prove the "Good Book" as "history." It is obvious that this sort of bibliolatry appeasement from the more scientific segment of society is losing ground precisely because of such discoveries - and the implication of this one is a doozy.

No historical covenant with God?

It needs to be emphasized that this intriguing development concerns not just any biblical event but the very covenant between God and the Israelites - here indicated as not something supernatural that actually occurred but, rather, as mere human propaganda based on older texts from other cultures. This discovery, therefore, would essentially negate the basic premise of the Old Testament: To wit, that the Hebrews, Israelites and Jews are the "chosen people" of the Lord of the universe.

Needless to say, for those of us who have been stating as much for many years - and getting pilloried for our efforts - this archaeological find is very exciting, as it adds to the growing body of hard, scientific evidence that the Bible is not "God's Word" but a manmade cultural artifact designed for propagandistic purposes.

Furthermore, as the Old Testament is thus apparently in significant part a rehash and rewriting of the traditions and myths of other cultures, so does the New Testament story of Jesus Christ represent a remake of the mythical motifs of pre-Christian cultures, combined with OT scriptures serving as "blueprints" for the gospel tale's creation
 
 

http://www.archaeologydaily.com/news/201004143809/Source-of-Bible-Covenant-with-God-discovered.html


...

Offline Bob Riebe

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7461
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2010, 05:57:12 PM »
Logical thinking, the others copied the covenant between the Jews and God, really rather simple.

Offline teamnelson

  • Trade Count: (30)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4487
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2010, 09:42:32 PM »
Thank you Bob. Yes, a covenant made to an oral society 4000bce (give or take) would probably be known throughout all of Canaan for the Assyrians to copy. No threat here.
held fast

Offline teamnelson

  • Trade Count: (30)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4487
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2010, 11:44:52 AM »
There is only one name by which men (even the insentient ones) may be saved - that is the sum of all the covenants.
held fast

Offline saddlebum

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1694
  • Gender: Male
  • "I ain't never been killed in my life."
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2010, 11:50:36 AM »
Nice try anyway.........
" FIREARMS STAND NEXT IN IMPORTANCE TO THE CONSTITUTION ITSELF. THEY ARE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE'S LIBERTY TEETH AND KEYSTONE UNDER INDEPENDENCE."       George Washington

“OUR CONSTITUTION WAS MADE ONLY FOR A MORAL AND RELIGIOUS PEOPLE. IT IS WHOLLY INADEQUATE TO THE GOVERNMENT OF ANY OTHER."           John Adams

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2010, 12:43:39 PM »
I don't know why you guys bother.Tm is on a mission. Mission Impossible, but a mission just the same. He furnishes you something to argue with, and debate him about, and you will never win. He wants to prove to you that he is right, and you want to prove to him that you are right. Kinda of a musical chairs game without the chairs. Its a timeless game though, if you like monotony, and repetition.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2010, 04:23:07 PM »
Welllllll, TM, while I don't consider myself all that dogmatic, I am content with the truth I've found in Christ, and have no need to stumble around in the dark, but don't really mind if you do. God has given us His Word, and I See no need to dispute it, as it is the truth, and I really don't have the courage to try and make a liar out of Him, or see the end purpose in such an endeavor anyway. But once again, I don't mind if "you" try. It's something you'll have to take up with him anyway, as it doesn't matter what I think, it's a matter of what He thinks.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline teamnelson

  • Trade Count: (30)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4487
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2010, 05:24:01 PM »
Dee, what were you saying? ;D

TM7, kinda hard to go back before the adamic covenant.
held fast

Offline bearmgc

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (8)
  • A Real Regular
  • *****
  • Posts: 966
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2010, 09:37:58 AM »
What I don't understand is your constant searching, the use of so much of your time and effort to disprove the Old Testament, and Jewish covenant with God. What would that suggest?   And why do you find it obsessively necessary to argue this belief with others who have no intention of changing their beliefs? I have no further bones to pick with you, because I see this unfortunate pattern you have, that for some obsessive reason, you feel you must continue.

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2010, 09:45:04 AM »
That has been my point bearmgc for a couple of years now. It is endless, and for me to debate, useless. Nothing will change his mind, but then again nothing will change mine either. I have not a clue how one could believe in Christ yet debate the accuracy of the Bible.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline saddlebum

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1694
  • Gender: Male
  • "I ain't never been killed in my life."
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2010, 10:13:02 AM »
Surely, you don't think there is a monopoly on covenants and a monopoly on salvation for folks ..?
TM7                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    SURELY I DO KNOW there is a monopoly on God's covenants, promises, and salvation. God owns that monopoly and it is fulfilled through His Son Jesus Christ and HIM ONLY........... It is written," No one comes to the Father except through Me", "...to the Jews first and then to the gentiles".
" FIREARMS STAND NEXT IN IMPORTANCE TO THE CONSTITUTION ITSELF. THEY ARE THE AMERICAN PEOPLE'S LIBERTY TEETH AND KEYSTONE UNDER INDEPENDENCE."       George Washington

“OUR CONSTITUTION WAS MADE ONLY FOR A MORAL AND RELIGIOUS PEOPLE. IT IS WHOLLY INADEQUATE TO THE GOVERNMENT OF ANY OTHER."           John Adams

Offline bearmgc

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (8)
  • A Real Regular
  • *****
  • Posts: 966
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2010, 10:25:14 AM »
That has been my point bearmgc for a couple of years now. It is endless, and for me to debate, useless. Nothing will change his mind, but then again nothing will change mine either. I have not a clue how one could believe in Christ yet debate the accuracy of the Bible.

Clue: From an old Ukranian saying, "Better to be hated than pitied..."

Offline bearmgc

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (8)
  • A Real Regular
  • *****
  • Posts: 966
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2010, 11:27:57 AM »
 So, a "Noble Cause" you say. I say not so much a cause, as a symptom.....

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2010, 12:26:23 PM »
TM, I think the confusion is (at least with me) what you do and do not believe in regards to Christ. Whom do you believe he is, and his purpose?
In the present state the Jew is hell bound on a bobsled. He, (the Jew) until accepting Salvation thru Christ is as lost as any Muslim, and his Judaism will not get him a free pass. BUT! My first couple of sentences could do wonders in regards to my confusion of you, IF you choose to answer.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2010, 12:39:53 PM »
So your not gonna give me an answer on my two questions regard your belief of whom Christ is and His purpose?
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2010, 02:38:47 AM »
I don't need a synopsis. I'm just askin you if you think Christ is "WHOM" He says He is, and is "WHAT" He says He is? This can be answered with simple yes or no answers. There's nothing complicated about it.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Swampman

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (44)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16518
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2010, 02:42:30 AM »
"In the begining was the Word......."

Looks like they copied us to me.  Jesus Christ is God.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
919th Special Operations Wing  1983-1985 1993-1994

"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline Swampman

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (44)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16518
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2010, 04:20:22 AM »
Who do you believe invented the official religion of Christianity.....?

Constantine invented The Church of Rome in 325AD

Do you think Jesus actually represented the God of the jews, Yahweh...?

They are the same being

Or do you think Jesus challenged the authority of the jewish God, Yahweh, God of Israel...?

No he said he didn't

Do you think your, Dee's, saddlebum's, Tnel's belief system is in unison with what Jesus taught and preached...?

I couldn't say

Do you believe that the government of israel and the US of A was put there by the God Jesus talked about...?

Yes, once again Jesus is God.


Do you believe Jesus was actually crucified... and the Cross-crucifix is a symbol of this act...?

Yes

Do you understand the prophecies mention in the short unexpurgerated Gospel of Judas....?

It's not a Gospel, it is nothing.

"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
919th Special Operations Wing  1983-1985 1993-1994

"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline Dee

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23870
  • Gender: Male
Re: Oh-Oh...Source of Bible Covenant with God Discovered...??
« Reply #18 on: April 24, 2010, 04:30:36 AM »
I don't need a synopsis. I'm just askin you if you think Christ is "WHOM" He says He is, and is "WHAT" He says He is? This can be answered with simple yes or no answers. There's nothing complicated about it.
.

.
Well synopsis?,,,, I thought you were case building...you know...force of habit and all. Yes, I believe Christ is who he said he was and how he acted, just not exactly what you and various 'churchs' say he was.    Let's see if you or others care to answer above questions...

...TM7

I believe that Christ, healed the sick, raised the dead, was crucified, and rose on the third day to defeat death, and His blood paid for our sins, and He is the ONE AND ONLY mediator for us to God the Father, and He is the ONLY means thru Him to get to Heaven. Do you believe that. Yes or no, is all that is required?

And no, I am not case building, I am trying to figure out just where you stand without all the sniping.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett