Wounded Warriors Taxed by ObamaCare

[wreckhog]

Life is not straightforward. You punish your children so they can be stronger. You burn a forest to promote growth. You get a painful divorce so that you can be happy. Yes, in some way, vets may show up in a ledger as costing more. It is accounting. Because that cost gets covered. Ultimately resulting in little change at the vet's level.

[teamnelson]

Ultimately resulting in little change at the vet's level.

I think that's a very large assumption. Again, I have to wonder 1) why Hatch proposed the amendment in the first place? He either felt that the Vets would experience alot of change, or he didn't. Since it did not propose protection for medical companies, I am left to assume that he and Republicans had a genuine concern for vets. 2) why did all but 5 Democrats oppose the amendment? Again, if this is no big deal, resulting in little change to the vet personally, voting for this legislation would've been a political statement without any true cost to anybody. It doesn't make sense if there is no change for the vets.

I found the quote you previously mentioned on a blog by a guy named bluehog (?) ... 7% of zero is zero. That's a red herring. It's not a zero - there is an actual and very large cost, and an additional 7% is a large number on a $100,000 leg. The manufacturer is not going to absorb that cost, it will go to the consumer (like all products). Where is VHP or TRICARE for Life (which is only a partial wraparound on Medicaid) getting the 7% more, by the way, to cover that tax? Those are federally funded "insurance providers" so the government is going to tax the companies, who will pass the cost of the tax onto the government in the form higher costs on medical devices, and claim a $20 billion revenue gain?!?  There is no way revenue will be generated from this unless the government introduces a new funding source ... who might that be?

And since the legislation this amendment attempted to block is just one piece of a march larger plan, which includes threats to VHP and T4L funding in the near term, there is no plausible way you can claim that the vet will have no or little change. Hatch was on to something, the Democrats knew it, which is why they voted it down, and why we're having this conversation.

[Squib]

social security will be down in the dirt long before us in our twenties are in our seventies, obamacare doesn't even make sense at all (to do anything but establish life and death authority for the god state), the va is a joke and fiscally vulnerable-

How long till disability pay and medical services get slashed across the board?  (before the welfare train for sure)

[wreckhog]

Ultimately resulting in little change at the vet's level.

I think that's a very large assumption. Again, I have to wonder 1) why Hatch proposed the amendment in the first place? He either felt that the Vets would experience alot of change, or he didn't. Since it did not propose protection for medical companies, I am left to assume that he and Republicans had a genuine concern for vets. 2) why did all but 5 Democrats oppose the amendment? Again, if this is no big deal, resulting in little change to the vet personally, voting for this legislation would've been a political statement without any true cost to anybody. It doesn't make sense if there is no change for the vets.

I found the quote you previously mentioned on a blog by a guy named bluehog (?) ... 7% of zero is zero. That's a red herring. It's not a zero - there is an actual and very large cost, and an additional 7% is a large number on a $100,000 leg. The manufacturer is not going to absorb that cost, it will go to the consumer (like all products). Where is VHP or TRICARE for Life (which is only a partial wraparound on Medicaid) getting the 7% more, by the way, to cover that tax? Those are federally funded "insurance providers" so the government is going to tax the companies, who will pass the cost of the tax onto the government in the form higher costs on medical devices, and claim a $20 billion revenue gain?!?  There is no way revenue will be generated from this unless the government introduces a new funding source ... who might that be?

And since the legislation this amendment attempted to block is just one piece of a march larger plan, which includes threats to VHP and T4L funding in the near term, there is no plausible way you can claim that the vet will have no or little change. Hatch was on to something, the Democrats knew it, which is why they voted it down, and why we're having this conversation.

We are all making assumptions. Saying that costs will be passed along to the consumer is one. Of course the manufacturers want to, but they don't always get what they want. Has Toyota raised the effective prices of all their cars to cover the brake recall related expenses? Just the opposite. I believe that both parties are capable of meaningless political statements. Remember "Freedom Fries"?

[teamnelson]

Didn't mean to distract with the "French" reference; they're a handy example of an immoral and free society, but Rosseau's ideas were the framework from which we developed our concept of community here in America. I concur that a lesson we could learn from the French is unity ... oddly enough, they're seeing increasingly high levels of anti-Arabism, anti-immigrantism - the voice of the people is unified and clear if not a little late.

Within the Union of Statists in Amerika, the "people" would have no voice, as government knows best. This is driving the veterans to speak in unison with patriotic Americans from every race, creed, color and financial status against the unjust burdens directed against all peoples ... a reciprocal mindset would be appreciated. I think there is sufficient evidence to assume that veteran's benefits have been an open target for a couple years now, specifically voiced both by the President and members of his party. No assumptions there. 

[scootrd]

I have a lot of criticisms for this administration (as well as previous) , But lets at least keep the facts straight. When it comes to Veterans affairs , Republicans plain and simple are not to be counted on. Dems by far have a much better voting record . And One of the worst voting records in support of Veterans... You guessed it...The maverick sellout himself John McCain.  And as a veteran I am even more disgusted with the man every time McCain plays the "I support the veterans" card.

But don't take my word for it. You can easily look it up for yourself.

http://www.votesmart.org/issue_rating_detail.php?r_id=3483

  

[Spirithawk]

There is no money to be made in cures. The big bucks are in the treatments. When's the last time something actually was cured?  Where Veterans are concerned, the VA often has the attitude of, " Let them die, then they don't cost us any more." It hurts to feel you're nothing more than a disposable comodity. Every day I live with that reality and worry what my youngest daughter's patriotism is going to cost her and her children in the years to come. She was forced to take a series of the Anthrax shots, thrown together at a moments notice with never a thought for long term effects. Now, for the second time, she'll be going into harms way as well. It hurts to know I was used. It hurts more to know she is as well. 

[Squib]

hey spirithawk, you know the military doesn't necessarily have to give you the shots they say they do right?  the military isn't required to follow informed consent practices/regulations/laws with military personnel (not sure about their families and tricare though)
1) think about that and all the gulf war syndrome stuff the military says was attributed to WMD that were never found.
2) smallpox used to just be a fact of life, it's not on the same level as ebola or bubonic plague... I don't think that's what the vaccinations are for.
3) tell her to look up the tuskegee experiments and how the CDC took it upon themselves to use humans like guinea pigs (in the 60's).

[Spirithawk]

hey spirithawk, you know the military doesn't necessarily have to give you the shots they say they do right?  the military isn't required to follow informed consent practices/regulations/laws with military personnel (not sure about their families and tricare though)
1) think about that and all the gulf war syndrome stuff the military says was attributed to WMD that were never found.
2) smallpox used to just be a fact of life, it's not on the same level as ebola or bubonic plague... I don't think that's what the vaccinations are for.
3) tell her to look up the tuskegee experiments and how the CDC took it upon themselves to use humans like guinea pigs (in the 60's).

Back in Basic  at Lackland AFB the USAF gave my fight, of 50 men,  some tablets telling us it was to prevent the Flu. A half hour later we all got deathly ill and broke out in rashes covering our whole bodies. They quarantined us for a solid week! Funny thing was, we were the only ones on the entire base to recieve those tablets. Have  to this day been unable to find anyone else, other than us, that they were given too. Years later I'm still trying to get my medical records. Despite numerous request I've yet to get them!

[Squib]

me and some guys in the school of infantry (san diego/camp pendleton) ended up with something like that, like chicken pox and red fingerpaint all over us for three days.  it was I think four students/boots and one instructor.  nasty.  in marine corps bootcamp guys are (at least most if not all of my 80 something strong platoon) were given some sort of erectile disfunction shot (I know because my di told me when I went to sick call complaining that it stopped working, I thought I wracked myself but he told me all about supposed "salt-peter" shots??).  also we all had our shots updated and current just to even SHIP to mcrd so why did we need MORE shots?!  I don't know what they test on people but it's scary and it's almost unheard of in the civilian world.  I really feel sorry for you older vets that had that PLUS crop-dusters dropping toxins right on you.  I don't know what it's like for you but I know you don't deserve the stuff you have going on.  are you getting better now?

[Spirithawk]

I was exposed to a wide range of toxic chemicals while serving. At 53 I suffered a massive heart attack. One year later everything was blocked again and they were only able to put one stent in. Another bypass is out of the question because the Dioxin exposure keeps my cholesterol highly elevated. It would just block up again. Very high doses of Statin type cholesterol medicine keeps me alive. My heart is enlarged and I have valve damage. Doctors say xrays of my lungs look like a road map of Baja California. I have a rare Thyroid disease known to be directly linked to Dioxin ( Agent Orange ) Same with my Pancreas. I dodged Diabetis II but have Hyperinsulinsm where my Pancreas puts out too much insulinism. A problem, again linked to Dioxin and which there is no treatment nor cure for.  I have recurring kidney trouble and severe bone, muscle and nerve damage as well. The VA admits what I was exposed to, when, how and where I was exsposed but because I don't, at least yet, have a cancer they recognise nor Diabetis II, they said in their exact words, " Tough luck!"  Even though their own fact sheet on Dioxin reads like my medical charts. Every problem listed as well as the time line that things appear after exposure was right on the money. Now I'm having severe nerve pain throughout my chest and trouble breathing. I have to take breathing treatments 4 times a day as well as Morphine and steroids. Am I ok now? Nope bud and it ain't gonna get any better. What hurts the most is seeing these problems now show up in my son and daughter. All because instead of burning my draft card, getting a deferment or running to Canada I enlisted. We AniKituhwagi (Cherokee) feel strongly about fighting for what is still our Country as well as your's. Would I do it again? To be honest I look at my children and wonder. I just don't know. I might have but if I knew what I know now I'd never have had kids. It's not fair to them. Thanks for asking though.

[Squib]

I have no shame for rushing into houses that were SUPPOSEDLY hiding evil insurgent boogeymen, no shame in standing post and/or patroling volatile streets for 18hr days, braving mortar fire or cleaning up dead bodies (you don't clean up live ones right?    )  I do have shame when I see gun-grabbers and globalists talking about "security forces" and "police" making us safe (instead of making us slaves), knowing that those security/police people will be doing what I did: getting the boogeymen, that are actually decent human beings.  (first it's "insurgents" in iraq, then right wing "extremists" in america)  If I could do it all over again I would not have.  I helped the nwo, I was ignorant of it at the time but I did the goon work.  I feel like I deserved the ied, but not to be crapped on afterwards by my own people.  I still cannot make peace with that part.  Whether I was a pawn or a patriot is irrelevant, I fulfilled my contract- what about uncle sam's end of the bargain?

I don't know what that has to do with obamacare... I guess it's just the icing on the cake to know that that jackass wants me to pay some of the bills for injuries I took working for his buddy george jr.