Gas checked 170gr in 30-30, anybody shooting them?

[thejanitor]

My hunting buddy gave me a hand full of the Lymann 170 gr. .308 GC bullets to take home and load up to try in my 30-30. Do any of you use these? How about in a Handi rifle? I want to load them at a moderate speed but not as low as Trail boss. I have Unique, 3031 and one of the other powders his Lymann book listed But would like to hear how they performed in your gun, and a good hunting story never hurts to really emphesize the actual bullet performance   So please share what you did with these bullets and voice how you feel they worked. Thanks thejanitor

[mauser98us]

Yup use them in my 30-30 and 32 Special. Keep velocities around 1600 to 1700 fps. and have a blast. I like to use 5744 in my cast loads. Enjoy

[qajaq59]

If they are the Lyman #311041 with the flat nose then yes, I use them all the time. For hunting I use 24.5 grs of IMR 3031. Work your way up from the starter though because that amount may not be accurate in your rifle. And for plinking I like 9 grs of Unique. I cast mine from 50/50 pb and ww. They mushroom well and don't break up at all.

[mdi]

Get a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook. Everything you'll need to know about casting/shooting lead bullets...

[thejanitor]

Get a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook. Everything you'll need to know about casting/shooting lead bullets...

The friend who gave me the bullets has that book and let me copy the data from the 170 gr 30-30 section.

Thanks qajaq59- We cast last night using straight ww I believe.... I just followed his lead (LEED) and used the lead he had prepared ahead of time. But knowing we could go 50-50 means we will be much better off since I have a bunch of soft lead we could add to the mix. But how much of a leading issue would the softer lead cause? Or is this where the gas check saves the day?

Also we discussed it but neither of us knew (the book probably says) if we cast the lyman 170 gr .308 and they weigh heavier or lighter does that mean too much % lead or not enough? Just figured it would tell us by weighing the bullets after the gas check is on.

Thanks for all the posts! thejanitor

[qajaq59]

I'm not sure how much experiance you have loading so I'll assume it is little. If not, forgive me. It's just safer to assume that, then to have you get hurt.

The first thing you want to do is either borrow your friend's manual, or buy one as mdi suggested. You are going to need 99% of the information in there if you're going to be successful loading cast. Trust me. It is just easier to do it right the first time. Just read the manual from cover to cover and I guarantee that it will save you a LOT of frustration.

The second thing is to slug your barrel to see what size you need to size the bullets down to in order to have them fit properly. That alone will decrease leading problems by a long ways. If they don't fit, they will generally lead no matter what else you do. There can be other causes as well, but fit is a biggy. If you don't know how to slug a barrel I'll get you a link later on.

The bullets can vary in weight depending on what your alloy is. Just start at what the manual calls for as a starting load and you will find an accurate load as you go up. And NEVER go over max. I don't care who says it'is ok. It isn't. Plus you'll usually find the best load about 1/2 to 3/4s of the way up anyway.

 I usually weigh after I put the check on.

I hope this helps and someone will add whatever I am sure I have somehow left out.
 

[res45]

I shoot the Lee 150 and 170 gr. RNFP in a couple different 30-30 rifles,I just cast the bullet from straight WW alloy apply two light coats of Lee Alox/JPW lube and use no gas check.  I load 7 grs. of Red Dot with either bullet.  MV runs between 1150 and 1250 depend on which bullet I use great plinking and small game load,I haven't worked up a GC hunting load as of yet.

[mechanic]

I've shot gas checked bullets in .223, 22-250, 25-06, 243, 30-30, 308...the list goes on.  Just follow the Lyman book and you'll be ok.  Most leading is caused from pushing too fast and gas cutting the bullet.  For target and plinking, cast is about all I shoot.

[blhof]

I use the 150 Lee flat nose GC bullet cast with straight ww and water quenched in both my lever gun and T/C with excellent results.  I use the Thompson loading guide for loading the T/C rounds, I use Unique and 11gr, which is below the listed max, but is my most accurate with 1640 average speeds out of my 14" barrel.  I've had no leading problem and used them for years.

[jlchucker]

I shoot cast bullets in nearly every rifle that I own.  I've pretty much given up buying jacketed bullets for calibers like 357 and 44 mag (both leverguns), 35 Remington, and 45-70. If the bullet you are casting is the Lyman 311041, it's the very first one I've owned, and I still use it.  You said you had Unique and 3031 on hand.  Mauser98us mentioned 5744.  That's another good one.  I've always mixed my wheelweights with about 10 percent pure lead when casting--it seems to flow better that way.  Don't overlook cast bullets (any caliber) retrieved from the backstop berms at your local range.  They can be remelted and mixed in (sparingly) with your lead for casting.  All of the posters today have offered you good advice.  Probably the most comprehensive (and best I've read out of a couple of websites on this subject) is what Qajaq59 has said.  He stresses going for ACCURACY.  When you get to an accurate combination, write down the load for the rifle you are using, and stick to it.  When it comes to cast bullets, you can safely ignore those who've conjured up their own published loads, as well as the velocity freaks who have chronographs and feel they need to shoot bullets faster than the speed of light.  Stick within the ranges of published data, and work up your load for your rifle.  When you find the combination, believe me--it won't bounce off the game that you are likely to be hunting with a 30-30. 

[jlchucker]

Woops!  I meant "their own conjured up UNPUBLISHED loads".   Stick to data that has been published by reputable firms, like those who manufacture powder, molds, etc and have tested their products extensively for safety.  Homebrew loads by those who think they know what they are doing but don't, and have no testing equipment other than their own guns could hurt your firearm, and/or maim you.  Safety first!

[ButlerFord45]

...  When you get to an accurate combination, write down the load for the rifle you are using, and stick to it...

Where's the fun in this???  If that was all I wanted from it, I'd just go to wally world and pick a box of ammo.  Take "Published Loads" with a grain of salt, they can get you hurt.  Most of the mold makers will tell you that their mold will cast a bullet of xxx grains when cast of abc alloy which always seems to be something I don't have. The lyman 311291 is listed as a 160 grain bullet with load information for that weight in the manual I use most. My 311291, checked and lubed is 181gr.  Considerable difference in a cartridge as small as 30-30.  It is my belief that those espousing the need to settle for 16-1800 fps are usually the ones too lazy to even slug their bore and size accordingly, much less determine the proper alloy for the pressures to be used.  If it helps assuage your inadaquacies all me a "velocity freak", feel free but I don't see the need to limit my ammo because I'm unwilling to do the work necessary to have accurate loads at jacketed velocity.
Janitor, I've used 3031 for years and thought that it was the only power for the 30-30.  If you decide you like the bullets, give some consideration to Winchester 748.  Good Bullets, I think you'll like them.

[qajaq59]

I gave the OP the advice I thought was valid and useful.

--30--

[ButlerFord45]

I thought you did an excellent job of it.

[thejanitor]

Thank you all for the help. I still did not load the bullets he gave me, we got busy so I have no info to share about my cast loading. But I did learn from you all that I need a copy of the Lyman book and have much to learn before I really THINK I know anything about cast. I appreciate the time you put into your answers for me and I will read much more about the process.
I have loaded for 30 years but only cast bullets in pistol, over a mild low velocity powder. Never fired a gas check, and HATE lead in the bore..... so will read more before I make more work for myself and think I hate lead bullets when it isn't the bullets fault I have not done my part to know how to use them. So Thank you all!
thejanitor