Author Topic: New to the board  (Read 871 times)

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Offline Rotunda

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New to the board
« on: October 28, 2010, 11:36:25 AM »
Hi every one, this is my first post as a new member but I have been following this board for some time and have been very impressed how helpful everyone is.

While on holiday last week I happened to find a pair of rifled cannons to photograph and thought they might be of interest.




Any ideas

Offline Zulu

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2010, 11:55:04 AM »
Welcome Rotunda,
Where are these located?  What are the rectangular things on the breech?
Zulu
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www.jmelledge.com

Offline Rotunda

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2010, 12:16:38 PM »

Hi Zulu

They were taken in Tenerife, in the north of the island, in Puerto de la Cruuz.
I thought someone would notice  the rectangular things on the breech, that’s what got my attention.




Rotunda

Offline Cat Whisperer

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2010, 12:50:28 PM »
Rotunda --

WELCOME, old timer!

INTERESTING pix.  Tune in for the next half dozen responses detailing them....

What do you / would you like to shoot?

Tim K                 www.GBOCANNONS.COM
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Chief of Smoke, Pulaski Coehorn Works & Winery
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N 37.05224  W 80.78133 (front door +/- 15 feet)

Offline Cannoneer

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2010, 01:03:45 PM »
Hi Rotunda!
It is definitely an interesting piece, the rectangular projection contained the sliding breech block, and the muzzle face has each land of the rifling numbered (1-24), so this cannon seems to be an "experimental" Spanish breech loading bronze rifle. The gun was cast is Seville, but I can't make out the date on the outside face of the breech (18??).
RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline dominick

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2010, 01:42:03 PM »
Interesting barrels.  Reminds me of the 3" Ordinance rifles that were converted to breech loaders sometime in the late 1800's.

Offline KABAR2

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2010, 03:09:15 AM »
I think they may be copies of the early Krupp system I have to look for some photo's to compare to.
I would say these were beyond experimental with a serial # in the 570's .
Mr president I do not cling to either my gun or my Bible.... my gun is holstered on my side so I may carry my Bible and quote from it!

Sed tamen sal petrae LURO VOPO CAN UTRIET sulphuris; et sic facies tonituum et coruscationem si scias artficium

Offline Rotunda

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2010, 09:53:00 AM »
Cat Whisperer ,

You daren’t mention “Shoot” on this side of the Pond.
I have three cannons on the go at the moment, a 68 PDR Carronade,  a British 51/2 inch Howitzer, both desk top size, and the latest is a 1/4 inch scale 3” Parrott.

Boom J,

I think this photo shows the cannons date better.




But what really got me interested was of the photo showing where the Breach Block would slide in from the side.




Dominick,

There is a number 9 stamped on the Muzzle, could this stand for 90mm, which is nearly 3 1/2 inches.

Offline Cannoneer

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2010, 12:09:44 PM »
Thanks Rotunda, that photo makes the marks on the rear of the gun perfectly clear. I think you're right about the muzzle face mark representing the bore size and it is 90mm, but it's marked in centimeters measured from land to land.

Allen,
I don't doubt that N. 570. designates the foundry number, but I do highly doubt that 570 of this model rifled bronze breech loader were ever produced by any foundry in Spain at that time. A foundry number is the manufacturer's own internal control number, and the number stamped on an artillery piece doesn't necessarily represent the actual number in a series of a specific model that were produced by that foundry.

To me the date of 1896 is perhaps the most interesting thing about this bronze cannon; even a few years later at the time of the Spanish-American War, Spain's most current artillery was bought from other countries (Krupp and Hotchkiss). I wonder if they were experimenting with rifled bronze artillery at that late a date in some kind of desperate attempt at producing their own armament? At any rate it shows just how far Spain had slipped backwards as regards it being taken seriously as any kind of military power; remember that the venerable French 75mm was already in service by 1897.
RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline Rotunda

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2010, 12:39:26 PM »
Boom  J,

I think you will be interested in the date on the breech photo of the other cannon.





Offline Cannoneer

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2010, 02:16:01 PM »
Yes I do find it interesting Rotunda, this is getting to be like a three stooges schtick and I'm playing the roles of two of them. :D

Ok, the date of 1884 is at least a little more reasonable for a bronze BLR cannon, but it's still astounding that they were casting a new one in 1896.

Now Rotunda, if you have another photo of a third cannon of this type on the island that happens to have the cypher of Philip II on it, please keep it under wraps, because if I see it I will probably flip my chair over backwards and hurt my noggin upon landing. :) ;D :D
RIP John. While on vacation July 4th 2013 in northern Wisconsin, he was ATVing with family and pulled ahead of everyone and took off at break-neck speed without a helmet. He lost control.....hit a tree....and the tree won.  He died instantly.

The one thing that you can almost always rely on research leading to, is more research.

Offline RocklockI

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2010, 02:22:19 PM »
Hi Rotunda , Welcome !

That looks like an ammo hopper on top of the barrel to me .

But I have never seen such a thing .

Gary
"I've seen too much not to stay in touch , With a world full of love and luck, I got a big suspicion 'bout ammunition I never forget to duck" J.B.

Offline Victor3

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Re: New to the board
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2010, 09:35:26 PM »
 Interesting how they made it so there's no way to put the breech block in backwards. The part that the block slides into appears to be a separate casting inserted into the barrel.

 I'm thinking these have to be some kind of R&D pieces. With the relatively small diameter of the breech and thin sections on either side the only points keeping it from blowing off, the whole affair looks pretty flimsy.
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly, one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

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