.25 acp breech plug........real or gimmick?

[walmpus]

Ok guys,

Here is my question: Is the .25 acp breech plug fact or fiction? He is why I am asking: Supposedly it eliminates fliers because it uses a small rifle/pistol primer that helps eliminate the bullet lifting from the powder (and its cleaner, more accurrate, ect) .So here is the meat and potatoes of this question. I have a .25 acp breech plug for my .45 cva kodiak but my huntsman still has the factory breech plug using the 209 carriers. Now I will admit that my .25 acp breech plug works, but after I started using it I am starting to question it. Why? Because if you use loose powder I dont think your going to get much of  a flier(s) reguardless of what kind of primer you use. The powder is solid and packed tight vs. the hole that goes thru T777 pellets that could allow your 209 primer to dislodge your bullet from the powder. So really the .25acp breech plug is only effective if you use loose powder. But then again if your using loose powder and a 209 primer, whats the difference? From what I have seen not much.

I have also done some testing because the .25 acp breech plug in my .45 also accepts 209 primers (just a shade of a loose fit) and I have noticed very little difference. I have had no problems with the gun firing or accurracy; although it is noticably dirtier with the 209 than the .25 acp. So I am just not totally convinced that if you still use pellets with a .25acp breech plug your gaining all that much.......at least from what I have personally seen. Sure my huntsman gets dirty with the 209, but using 2 pellets with a 245 grain aerotip powerbelt I can cover 5 shots at 100 yards with a 50 cent piece/silver dollar if I really take my time when I shoot. Plus that is one of the aspects that makes this gun so great! Yeah the primer carriers and ramrod are a pain, but that is one of the great traits that make it a huntsman. Plus, thats more than good enough (for me) to hunt with. So once again I am just not sure its worth the extra money to buy the .25 acp breech plug. Not to mention the time it takes to prime each piece of brass and then UNPRIME it. If you like the labor part thats is great......after a year of it I am just to tired of unpriming that small brass. What a pain. If brass was not so expensive I would just pitch the used ones and keep buying new bags of magtech brass and primers. Hey, to each is own, right? I am only asking to maybe save someone else a possible headache.....and maybe a few $$$$!

Anyone elses thoughts or input on this? Just looking for some other insight. Good shooting and keep'em in the 10 ring!

Walmpus

[PHATINJUN]

It's not a gimmick it does what it claims. Is it as dramatic as one may think probly not .Sliced bread probly had more of an impact on the cycle of life than the 25acp breech plug. ;)Kurt

[GRIMJIM]

For me, I like it. It burns cleaner, helped with my groups and maybe best of all for me the 25 acp shells are easier to handle than the 209 primers. Especially with cold fingers.

Was it a drastic improvement? Not really, but it does have its good points.

[walmpus]

I appreciate everyones input. I only asked because I am not an expert in muzzleloading, just like seeing smoke come out the end of the barrel. I just wish someone would come up with a standard breech plug for the NEF line. I certainly do not regret getting the .25acp conversion for my cva (just regret buying a cva). It does work and I like that its cleaner, its just that from what I have seen with this breech plug conversion, I don't know if spending 60 bucks is worth it. That is litterally half the value of NEF when I bought it brand new (plus add on I've had it a few years). One would think there has to be a more economic and effective alternative out there for 209's.

But at the same time I am glad to hear that those who have bought this conversion kit are happy with it and its results.  The search continues for a standard breech plug. Maybe I will ask Santa Claus for a lathe for Christmas 

[PHATINJUN]

I have to be honest here .I have had or have 3 25acp plugs and I have not yet paid more than half the price of a new one been lucky don't think I'd drop a 60 on one though. Kurt

[nrb]

My Huntsman is one of the earliest 24 inch barrel with 209 ignition and it has been great for accuracy, dependability, and knock down power with all kinds of bullets. It is just dirty and I do not like the blowback. I just tried out the 25 acp brass with small rifle primers to sight in for the season. I use 80gr of 777 with a 45cal sabot. Unfortunately, I had 4 out of 18 ftf. With the first  two, I just inserted a fresh 25 case and the charge fired. Unfortunately, the last 25 was a ftf, so I was left with a hot load and no more 25s. To be safe in traveling home, I wet the load through the fire channel. This has never happened with 209s.
But the big problem is how to remove the bullet and powder. With fire nipples, I could use a CO2 cartridge to blow the load out, but with the base design for the Huntsman, this does not work. A bullet extractor for lead balls will not likely grip the HP brass 45 bullet and sabot. Anyone have a tried and true suggestion??
Anyone have an answer for why the FTF with the 25s. I really wanted this to work so I could switch from the 209s.

best,            nrb

[nrb]

I forgot the Huntsman breech is open for cleaning unlike my other MLS. After I removed the 25cal breech plug, all cleaned out well.

But still, why the ftf with the 25 acp ignition. The fire hole is much smaller than the 209 plug hole.  Any suggestions??

best,              nrb

[grafik0117]

If you will pull the spent .25 ACP from the breach plug and swab barrel with a spit patch  it will solve the misfire problem.  Reason being, the breach plug has a small hole that can clog after a few shots, swabbing between shots not only increases accuracy and eases loading, but will keep the fire hole clear of fouling.  A small price to pay for no blow back and better accuracy.

[wild willy]

I had more trouble with a Encore swabbing between shots with a 25acp than I did if I didn't swab only thing I could think was that it pushed or knocked fouling in the hole if I fired a primer off before I reloaded I didn't have any trouble.There are a lot better options than the 25acp plug

[wreckhog]

I really dislike the H&R tool for loosening/tightening the breech plug. That alone, makes the .25ACP brrech plug better. $60 better? Who knows. It costs about a buck a shot, so $60 gets burned up in a couple trips to the range.

[DennyRoark]

After using one for 4 years, I offer this.  Great for cold stumpy fingers.  Very clean breach even after extended range sessions.  The bad...Magtech brass has a very wide tolerance for length, causing the occasional failure to lock up solidly.  Have had four FTF's in this time fame.  3 dented primers and an Oh gee, I didn't get that one primed.  Accuracy?  I honestly can't tell the difference, as she's a tack driver either way.  The ACP brass is never as clean as Cecil says, and I have taken to tumbling after each use.  And the tiny breech hole will plug up after several shots, easily remedied with a torch tip cleaner.  Definitely better than the orange carriers, not the best option as far as I can tell.  I will be trying an alternative ignition source this weekend and hopefully be done with the pistol poppers.

[jlbeebe]

Instead of the .25acp breech plug I use a 209-4 primer. It is used for the .410 shotgun and it is less powerful and less messy than the standard 209. I have not noticed the fliers.

[epanzella]

I was getting 25% misfires with the 25acp breechplug setup in my TC. Primer would fire but not light powder. Don't know why, others seem to like it. I use MMP black sabots with .452 jacketed bullets. It's a tight fit which may have been my problem. Back to 209's.

[DennyRoark]

I've shot about 250 rounds with mine and all went bang except 3.  Of course 2 of the three were shots at a deer!  All 3 had a decent dent in the primer, just went click.  The biggest problem I've had is the Magtech brass has a rather large length tolerance.  Had quite a few cause the action to not lock up solidly, so the rifle broke open during the shot.  I've taken to measuring the brass and tossing the long ones and no problems since.  Haven't loaded up any new ones in a while, so I don't remember the exact length #'s.  You should "size" your brass by locking up each one a couple of times before priming.  Not real happy with my alternative ignition experiment, so will probably go another season with the 25ACP's.  Really not a bad thing.....