Author Topic: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added  (Read 2557 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« on: October 11, 2010, 04:35:40 PM »
I have been working a on a fully rifled slug gun that would launch something a little more stout that then 90 to 110 grain factory offering.  The gun i am using is a modified 444 that shots 410 hulls, brass base with plastic.  The attached pic is my best group to date.  I haven't been trying to optimize the accuracy, just find the limits of the 410 hull with different powders and bullets.   I am not going to post the powder type or weight because I don't want to have some one try this load in a 410 bore shotgun.  This load was shot in an H&R with a modified rifle barrel with an SB2 frame.  No attempt was made to zero the gun at 100 yards because I was shooting a number of different combinations of powder charge, bullet and hulls.  I should have chrony results for this round in the next few weeks but based on the drop from 50 to 100 yards I would estimate it is in excess of 1600 fps.  

BB

pic of loaded rounds, from left to right 444 Marlin w/240 grain HP/XTP, 410, 275 grain HP, 310 grain WNFPGC, 330 grain FPBB, & 355 grain WNFPGC (thanks Quick!)

RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline tacklebury

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (12)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3633
  • Gender: Male
  • Central Michigan
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2010, 04:59:02 PM »
Looks deer zero'd.  ;)  Nice work!
Tacklebury --}>>>>>    Multi-Barrel: .223 Superlite, 7mm-08 22", .30-40 Krag M158, .357 Maximum 16-1/4 HB, .45 Colt, .45-70 22" irons, 32" .45-70 Peeps, 12 Ga. 3-1/2 w/ Chokes, .410 Smooth slugger, .45 Cal Muzzy, .50 Cal Muzzy, .58 Cal Muzzy

also classics: M903 9-shot Target .22 Revolver, 1926 .410 Single, 1915 38 S&W Break top Revolver and 7-shot H&R Trapper .22 6" bbl.


Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43301
  • Gender: Male
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline Lon371

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (53)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2486
  • Gender: Male
  • Why Not a Handi?
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2010, 10:24:26 PM »
 That looks good. I know you dont want to post the load, But would you tell us what bullets you are working with?

Lonny

Offline ruppster

  • Trade Count: (5)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 82
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2010, 02:44:55 AM »
Not allowed to use brass cases in OH for deer. ??? I played around with a Survivor barrel for a bit. Used some 450 Mongo ideas.

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2010, 04:50:19 AM »
Ruppster is correct, regulations state no all brass shells and no necked down shells for shotgun deer hunting.  Regulations are silent on OAL, bullet proturding from the hull, and just about everything else.  Diameter of the round can be no smaller than 410 bore or larger than 10 ga.  The standard for a 410 bore is .410" plus 20 thousands (.430"), my barrel slugged @ 0.4295"  ;D

Tim I would love to use an all brass hull, I think the ones from Magtech have more case capacity than a 444 Marlin. ::)

Bullet is a 310 grain WNFPGC from Oregon Trail I believe.  It is the bullet that has silver in the alloy.  I have also tried some 240 cast PB, 240 grain HP/XTP, 275 grain lead HPGCs and 330 grain lead plain base bullets.  Horndays work fine as did the 275 grain GC HPs, the plain base bullets have not been very accurate, I think I am pushing them too hard.

I think the key to making this work is to have a very tight fit round.  If the round is loose in the chamber the weak hull will expand too much and you will have a gas leak and loss of velocity.  I hand fit each round to my gun and have eliminated leaks around the brass/plastic joint.  The only pressure leaks I  have had are at the rim and never bad enough to give a visibile notice while shooting.  I can tell the difference in recoil when a shell leaks.  Also, when you get to the limit of the hull you will get vertical stringing as each hull leaks a little differently. 

The Winchester AA-HS hulls (2.5") are by far the strongest hulls I have tried.  I have not had a case head leak with these hulls.

This gun when finished will still be a shotgun, not a CF rifle.  The load is equivalent to a mid range power inline 50 MZ shooting  a 300 grain sabot.  The velocity will be well under the starting load for a 444 Marlin with the same bullet.  My 12 ga. slug gun will shoot a heavier slug at a higher velocity than this 410 is capable of, however this gun doesn't punch me in the forehead everytime I pull the trigger. :P

BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43301
  • Gender: Male
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2010, 05:04:07 AM »
That's too bad on the brass cases, most people aren't aware they're available, that's why I mentioned them.

Good work and good luck hunting.  ;)

Tim
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline Spanky

  • Moderators
  • Trade Count: (96)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4627
  • Gender: Male
  • USMC Semper Fidelis
Re: 410 Slug Gun
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2010, 03:37:30 PM »
How did you have to modify the 444 barrel to shoot the 410's?
This is a pretty cool project.  Have you looked at the Hoening 410 slugs... they get some awesome performance out of the 410's.



Spanky

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - 355 BTB target pics
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2010, 09:48:46 AM »
Quick range trip today with the 410 slugger (as in Quick sent me some 355 grain BTB bullets to try out ;D)

15 to 25 MPH cross wind and shooting offhand.  Gun is zero for a lighter and faster bullet.  Was shooting to determine acceptable powder charges not for groups so much.  Anyway, two (2) 3 shot groups @ 100 yards, one approx 2" other approx. 2.5".

thanks for the lead Tim.

What do ya'll think about my fancy Dollar General targets?



BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43301
  • Gender: Male
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2010, 10:04:47 AM »
Nice work BB!! Paper plates have been a standard deer camp sight in target, my Dad's standard for MOD(minute of deer) was always 50-75yds standing offhand, if they always hit the plate, he was zeroed!!  ;D

Tim
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline 32 Magnum

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 269
  • Gender: Male
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2010, 11:26:14 AM »
What do ya'll think about my fancy Dollar General targets?



BB
Didn't they have any of the floral ones left?
Jim Hauff,  H&R Collector

RIP Jim, passed away on October 12th, 2012

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2010, 01:00:29 PM »
What do ya'll think about my fancy Dollar General targets?



BB
Didn't they have any of the floral ones left?

I bought 50 of dem flowerery plates but da wife took um and said day was fore turkeydaydinner. ;D
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline Topper

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 63
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2010, 02:59:25 PM »
 "Dad's standard for MOD(minute of deer) was always 50-75yds standing offhand, if they always hit the plate, he was zeroed!!

MOD (minute of deer) - Love it!, good one, Tim.

Offline gendoc

  • SWAMP GROCERIES RULE !!!
  • Trade Count: (329)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3957
  • TRUTH AND HUMOR, thatsa what i'm talk'n bout
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2010, 02:43:47 PM »
What do ya'll think about my fancy Dollar General targets?



BB
Didn't they have any of the floral ones left?

I bought 50 of dem flowerery plates but da wife took um and said day was fore turkeydaydinner. ;D


bb. u shur u ain't from ah... L.A.  !!! ;)
sea-ya.....
in tha meen time, i'm wait'n for tha  7th trumpet ta sound !!!

gotta big green tractor ana diesel truck, my idea of heaven's chasin whitetail bucks and asa country boy, you know i can survive............

hey boy, hit this mason jar one time...
burn ya lil'bit did'nt it. ya ever been snipe hunt'n ?  come on...

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2010, 04:06:40 PM »
Doc,

Back in the day I spent a lot of time in the Big Easy.  Love the food, music and da way dem folks celebrate CHRISTmas with Papa Noel.  Took me a few of dem Cajun/Creolo cookin' classes and used to drink beer, and watch Mr. Wilson drink wine and eat mud bugs on the TV. ;D  Learnt how to deep fry a turkey 30+ years ago before it got popular with the yankees.  A Coonass who live on dat big mud puddle next to Nawlins show me how to cook da big byrd.  The last 25+ years in NW Ohio and I done forgot how to speak proper. :P

BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline john-78

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 88
  • Gender: Male
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2010, 05:21:52 PM »
Tom, if your not carful ODNR is going to add to allowable hunting equipment " No homemade shotguns"  ;D  i'm still going with the .410/45, with the choke removed and a good limbsaver i think .jr will be able to handle it, i just want him to go hunting with his papaw before papaw can't go anymore.

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2010, 05:26:05 AM »
John,

Good luck to you and JR during gun season.  I'll be in the Zaleski St. Forest the first 3 days of gun, maybe I'll see you at the check in station. 

BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2010, 02:10:25 PM »
last trip to the range today with the 410 H&R rifle slugger.  Attached are the targets,  both shot 1 & 5/8" groups at a 100 yards with some wind and rain and old eyes and not so steady hands.  Be glad when my kid gets home from F-16 school so I can find out what this gun is really capable of shooting.  The 355 BTBs are from Tim and I will be using these in the gun opening morning of Ohio deer gun season.   With any luck might be able to post whitetail pic shortly.

BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.

Offline dave29

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (93)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1256
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #18 on: November 19, 2010, 05:43:45 AM »
Nice! That is very impressive for a .410.

Offline Rustyinfla

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (4)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1744
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #19 on: November 19, 2010, 11:13:17 AM »


  Nice work. I'm wonderin what can be done with a .410 set up as a smooth boore?
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tuff

Offline gcrank1

  • Trade Count: (24)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7644
  • Gender: Male
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #20 on: November 19, 2010, 11:24:37 AM »
Really well done project, Tom! If a deer comes within range you got 'em. Shame you cant use the 45-120 but this is pretty neat.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline bikerbeans

  • Trade Count: (168)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4070
  • Gender: Male
  • BANDIT - North American Snake Hound
Re: 410 Slug Gun - Ammo PICs added
« Reply #21 on: November 19, 2010, 11:44:53 AM »
Rusty,

There's a guy on gunbroker selling loaded 168 grain smoothbore slug ammo for the 410.  His slug rounds, if accurate, would be a significant step up on bullet mass over the 90 to 110 grain factory 410 slugs.  IMO the best smoothbore slugs are the Brenneke.  I had acceptable accuracy with them out to 60+ yards in a 22" smoothbore, but the mass of about 109 grains is just to little for use on deer, again my opinion.  I think most of the other factory smoothbore slugs suffer bad accuracy because they are significantly underbore size.  The Brennekes are close to .41" diameter.  If you are in a 410 legal deer state that allows buckshot you would probably be better off shooting the buckshot over the little 410 foster style slugs.

gcrank,

I'm going to use the 45-120 for my primary ground hog gun next summer.  Going to load 180 grain 40 cal MZ bullets with 40/45 sabots and let here rip.  See if 3,000 FPS is possible.  ;D

BB

BB
RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.