Informative look at mag capacity regulations.

[Old Syko]

Had they left out the references to the left and their convoluted views, this video could have been used as a good educational tool.  Sometimes we just can't seem to keep from shooting ourselves in the foot while trying to express our rational views.

[Redhawk1]

Liberals don't care what or how we say it.. They want to get rid of all the evil guns... 

[Old Syko]

Liberals don't care what or how we say it.. They want to get rid of all the evil guns... 

Extremists on either side of the fence on any issue don't care how or what is said because they won't change their minds.  It's those who are undecided or not completely unreasonable that we must convince.  It's a perception issue.  You can not only get people to come to your way of thinking, but to join you in your efforts to convince others if you regulate how they perceive things.  Starting off with something an extremist would regard as degrading comments (even when we feel them to be true) is not the way to accomplish this goal.

[scootrd]

Good video.


The Argument put forth (as I understand it to be ) was in the case of the AZ shooting that in between magazine changes , individuals were able to intervene before an additional mag could be used.  I don't buy that argument . The person or persons who took the heroic efforts in AZ should be commended  However all shootings are different and they just happened to be in the right place at the right time with the right sequence of events.

If the heroic intervening persons  had been say perhaps 10 or 12 steps away as an example , as the video shows there would not be enough time to stop a shooter even during reload, and even taking into account a crazed person who may not even be as familiar with reloading a weapon as  the two in the video were.

Grateful those brave people jumped in , but better line of defense is if someone with concealed carry intervened as well irregardless of a mag capacity .  Limiting a mag capacity is just a feel good position being put forth , I don't believe it hold up to further scrutiny as the video shows - JMHO

 -  I also wish they had made it unbiased so the left considers the true merits of what they are demonstrating and focus in on substance of demonstration rather than possibly considering it an attack.

[vabowhntr]

Introduced yesterday (I love how they wind up with firearms related title numbers: HR 1022, HR 45, now HR 308):

H.R.308 -- Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device Act (Introduced in House - IH)


HR 308 IH


112th CONGRESS

1st Session

H. R. 308
To prohibit the transfer or possession of large capacity ammunition feeding devices, and for other purposes.


IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

January 18, 2011
Mrs. MCCARTHY of New York (for herself, Mr. CLAY, Ms. NORTON, Mr. WEINER, Ms. ESHOO, Mr. ISRAEL, Mrs. MALONEY, Mr. ACKERMAN, Mr. MORAN, Ms. MCCOLLUM, Mr. BRADY of Pennsylvania, Mr. SERRANO, Ms. PINGREE of Maine, Mr. GEORGE MILLER of California, Mr. MCGOVERN, Ms. HARMAN, Mr. PASCRELL, Ms. HIRONO, Mr. VAN HOLLEN, Mrs. LOWEY, Mr. NADLER, Ms. EDWARDS, Mr. HASTINGS of Florida, Ms. MATSUI, Ms. WATERS, Mr. CICILLINE, Ms. CHU, Mr. SHERMAN, Mr. HOLT, Mr. CONNOLLY of Virginia, Ms. SLAUGHTER, Mr. ELLISON, Mr. QUIGLEY, Mr. MEEKS, Mr. HIMES, Mr. HONDA, Mr. LANGEVIN, Ms. SPEIER, Mr. COHEN, Mr. WAXMAN, Mr. CONYERS, Mr. FARR, Mr. YARMUTH, Ms. JACKSON LEE of Texas, Ms. WOOLSEY, Mr. BLUMENAUER, Mr. BISHOP of New York, and Ms. DEGETTE) introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


A BILL
To prohibit the transfer or possession of large capacity ammunition feeding devices, and for other purposes.


Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device Act'.

SEC. 2. PROHIBITION ON TRANSFER OR POSSESSION OF LARGE CAPACITY AMMUNITION FEEDING DEVICES.

(a) Definition- Section 921(a) of title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting after paragraph (29) the following:

`(30) The term `large capacity ammunition feeding device'--

`(A) means a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar device that has a capacity of, or that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition; but

`(B) does not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.'.

(b) Prohibitions- Section 922 of such title is amended by inserting after subsection (u) the following:

`(v)(1)(A)(i) Except as provided in clause (ii), it shall be unlawful for a person to transfer or possess a large capacity ammunition feeding device.

`(ii) Clause (i) shall not apply to the possession of a large capacity ammunition feeding device otherwise lawfully possessed within the United States on or before the date of the enactment of this subsection.

`(B) It shall be unlawful for any person to import or bring into the United States a large capacity ammunition feeding device.

`(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to--

`(A) a manufacture for, transfer to, or possession by the United States or a department or agency of the United States or a State or a department, agency, or political subdivision of a State, or a transfer to or possession by a law enforcement officer employed by such an entity for purposes of law enforcement (whether on or off duty);

`(B) a transfer to a licensee under title I of the Atomic Energy Act of 1954 for purposes of establishing and maintaining an on-site physical protection system and security organization required by Federal law, or possession by an employee or contractor of such a licensee on-site for such purposes or off-site for purposes of licensee-authorized training or transportation of nuclear materials;

`(C) the possession, by an individual who is retired from service with a law enforcement agency and is not otherwise prohibited from receiving ammunition, of a large capacity ammunition feeding device transferred to the individual by the agency upon that retirement; or

`(D) a manufacture, transfer, or possession of a large capacity ammunition feeding device by a licensed manufacturer or licensed importer for the purposes of testing or experimentation authorized by the Attorney General.'.

(c) Penalties- Section 924(a) of such title is amended by adding at the end the following:

`( Whoever knowingly violates section 922(v) shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both.'.

(d) Identification Markings- Section 923(i) of such title is amended by adding at the end the following: `A large capacity ammunition feeding device manufactured after the date of the enactment of this sentence shall be identified by a serial number that clearly shows that the device was manufactured after such date of enactment, and such other identification as the Attorney General may by regulation prescribe.'.

[lakota]

After viewing this video I'm sure "liberal logic"(is that term an oxymoron?) would state "if thats the case then we should ban magazines all together"

[scootrd]

Wonder how this would affect PUMA sales

[thxmrgarand]

While I cannot imagine this legislation being enacted it does underscore that gun owners need to participate in the process of democracy.  By itself, voting is not enough; we have to work for pro-gun candidates for elected office, we have to let elected officials know of our concerns, and we have to support the NRA (and similar organizations if we like).  It's because of the NRA that Democrats who represent conservative districts and states (such as senators who were not up for re-election last year) hope this legislation dies an early and quiet death.

[scootrd]

While I cannot imagine this legislation being enacted it does underscore that gun owners need to participate in the process of democracy.  By itself, voting is not enough; we have to work for pro-gun candidates for elected office, we have to let elected officials know of our concerns, and we have to support the NRA (and similar organizations if we like).  It's because of the NRA that Democrats who represent conservative districts and states (such as senators who were not up for re-election last year) hope this legislation dies an early and quiet death.

It won't ..It's a media taking point now picked up by the 24/7 news cycle.. and every Newscast has to interview a so called expert.  - Ridiculous

[Redhawk1]

Liberals don't care what or how we say it.. They want to get rid of all the evil guns... 

Extremists on either side of the fence on any issue don't care how or what is said because they won't change their minds.  It's those who are undecided or not completely unreasonable that we must convince.  It's a perception issue.  You can not only get people to come to your way of thinking, but to join you in your efforts to convince others if you regulate how they perceive things.  Starting off with something an extremist would regard as degrading comments (even when we feel them to be true) is not the way to accomplish this goal.

It is almost like a political correctness issue.. I am so sick of tip toeing around issues..  I deal with masses of people all the time on legislative issues.. We have tried every way possible to get people on our side. Now it is the responsibility for the people to wake up, and vote in people that understand the Constitution and make common sense laws.

I have brought a lot of people that were on the fence over to the pro-gun side presenting them with facts, and showing them how the liberal agenda is attacking our fundamental rights.. So it works, and I think there message works..  Enough with the politically correct B.S. !  We have done that for far to long!

[Old Syko]

Redhawk let's not confuse manipulation with the PC crap as there is a difference.  I've also changed a few misguided minds but couldn't have done it by talking down to them first.  I assure you the bull in a china shop approach doesn't get the job done.  As a matter of fact it usually ends in the opposite effect.  Look at all the cult leaders who have manipulated droves of people as far as suicide in years past as an example.  They worked their way into the minds of these people first, then adjusted them the way they wanted.  They didn't first point out their stupidity and then offer them options.  I sometimes fear some of the voices of the left understand this more than we do.  They sell their stance by manipulating the ignorant with distorted views while convincing them they have made their own decisions.

One individual I dealt with was a high school history teacher turned politician who thought a militia was a specific organization.  I used his own text books to point out to him that at the time the constitution was drafted the militia was actually any and every available individual.  We talked on his level using only his own information until he convinced himself of the truth.  He's now on our side and quite active in proving it.

I too am tired of having to censor my own words in order to let the facts be known and understood when I would rather use a ball bat but I'm finding when it is done right it is very effective.

[Redhawk1]

Old Syko, some people here know I am active in a 9-12 group, I am one of the co-founders, and I am the 2nd Amendment person as well.  I know what you are talking about, and agree to a point. I use the same message as those guys do in the video, and recently have more people interested in backing the 2nd amendment , and are actually purchasing guns now as well.

Just a little information, our group is getting a CCW class together for our members, mind you a lot of our members are already CCW holder. As of today we have 34 people signed up for the up coming CCW class, and have 2 months before the class starts at our local gun range for the State required class. Not bad for a common sense approach, and factual representation of the liberal agenda.. People are seeing what is going on and don't like it.

[Old Syko]

Redhawk I appreciate all you do in your area and understand we must all do what we can from where we are.  Our actions and words don't go unnoticed when we play our cards right.  My state is now facing legislation that would eliminate the requirement of licensing altogether which we feel is an encroachment on our rights.  We already are able to carry either concealed or open as long as we have a license with no state required training.  Wish us luck.  It is a step in the right direction.