Author Topic: Carry A Back-up? (Read 1814 times)

Spirithawk · « **on:** February 28, 2011, 04:55:24 PM »

How many of you all carry a back-up weapon? To me it just makes sense. First, should your primary weapon fail, you have another firearm to fall back on. Also, with two weapons, in two locations, you double the odds of being able to reach one when needed. I also believe, in most situations, it is faster to draw a second weapon than to reload if you find yourself in an extended shootout versus an over quick situation. Last, but not least, it gives me a reason to own two handguns instead of just one.

Mikey · « **Reply #1 on:** March 01, 2011, 02:05:40 AM »

Spirithawk: I have no problem with that notion and would agree that is a good idea for a LEO but civilians aren't usually thought to think the same, as we are but mere (tax paying) servants of the state, and although I have done the same (packed two) often enough, in places like ny if the locals caught up to you when you were packin' double irons I do believe they would call you a 'cowboy' and do their best to get you off the street, and not treat you very courteously in the process, whether you were doing anything wrong or not. If you are 'found out', most cops in this state will be able to determine your law-abiding status within moments and as a law abiding and (of course) cooperative citizen they will treat you like a criminal knowing you will just take it in order to keep your rights. For some reason, most LEOs I have met seem prefer a police type state where the bumbling, tax-paying citizen has relegated alll means of defense to the local police who can't get there in time to prevent a crime. Go figure.

So, a pistol or revolver and a reload is one thing, but the old 'neu yawk reload' of a 2nd gun only sits well with LEOs - there is no civilian equality in ny as civilains should not have the need for a reload or 2nd piece because we are the mere and lowly subjects of the realm and can carry guns only because the courts have said we can and have held local municipalities and the state to task.

Actually, since you have reminded me of the idea of double-packing I should get back to shooting two handed, that is, with a gun in each hand at the same time...........

cwlongshot · « **Reply #2 on:** March 01, 2011, 02:37:53 AM »

Spirithawk,
I have to say the more of your posts I read the more I agree with your live of thinking...

. I agree and most often I do! Spot on brother!!

Mikey,
I sympathize with the station of people living under such idiotic laws. I could go on and on with my opinions of such things. Sufice it to say; I would rather be judged by tweleve than carried by six and I would rather opologise than ask permission. If I break a law to keep myself or a loved one alive and no one but the bad guy gets hurt, I'll pay that price.

CW

Old Syko · « **Reply #3 on:** March 01, 2011, 04:10:19 AM »

Quote from: cwlongshot on March 01, 2011, 02:37:53 AM

If I break a law to keep myself or a loved one alive and no one but the bad guy gets hurt, I'll pay that price.

CW

+1 many times over.

Too many put too much emphasis on not only staying within the law, but staying well within the law out of fear of government control and repercussions. Such weakness doesn't do any of us any good. I too know and understand the consequences to my actions and am willing to chance paying that price if necessary.

As far as carrying a second, I would feel only half dressed without it. Been doing it too many years to change now.

LocnLod · « **Reply #4 on:** March 01, 2011, 07:46:59 AM »

I don't carry a back-up. If I was LE I would pocket carry a backup on the weak hand side (it would go into the winter coat weak side pocket during that season) and also have a very light one on the left ankle.

Mike in Virginia · « **Reply #5 on:** March 01, 2011, 03:09:06 PM »

I did before I retired, now I don't. But it's the smart thing to do. A back-up can be a "reload" as well as a back-up. Some of the smaller guns like the LCP are lighter than a full clip of big bullets.

Mikey · « **Reply #6 on:** March 02, 2011, 01:22:23 AM »

cw: I think you're readin' me wrong buddy. I'm sure not against it, just lamenting the local estata de policia we have locally. You will rarely find me without a 'reload' and it hardly matters to me what someone would think if I had to use it; that's why I have a good lawyer................

cwlongshot · « **Reply #7 on:** March 02, 2011, 01:29:17 AM »

Quote from: Mikey on March 02, 2011, 01:22:23 AM

cw: I think you're readin' me wrong buddy. I'm sure not against it, just lamenting the local estata de policia we have locally. You will rarely find me without a 'reload' and it hardly matters to me what someone would think if I had to use it; that's why I have a good lawyer................

Roger that and good to hear! Kinda sorry we need to resort to that but your correct it's the world we live in today. Having a lawyer on retainer today is akin to carrying a gun a hundred years ago. Both are there just in case.

CW

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #8 on:** March 02, 2011, 02:19:27 AM »

Sometimes , always in the vehicle. always if a knife counts ( carried a knife for years before the gun).
Would also ask if you tote a non lethal type of protection ? It could matter in some places ...

Spirithawk · « **Reply #9 on:** March 02, 2011, 08:09:09 PM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on March 02, 2011, 02:19:27 AM

Sometimes , always in the vehicle. always if a knife counts ( carried a knife for years before the gun).
Would also ask if you tote a non lethal type of protection ? It could matter in some places ...

Never, ever, underestimate a knife. It's a proven fact, can't recall the exact distance but think it's about 10 yards and maybe a bit farther, that a person with a knife can close the distance and stab you before you can draw and fire! I use to carry a taser but to be honest that dang thing scared me!

Spirithawk · « **Reply #10 on:** March 02, 2011, 08:34:38 PM »

Quote from: cwlongshot on March 01, 2011, 02:37:53 AM

Spirithawk,
I have to say the more of your posts I read the more I agree with your live of thinking... . I agree and most often I do! Spot on brother

Thanks. I can be as wrong as anyone but I believe in saying what I think. Often it's based on personal experience. I believe that when it comes to self defense the better prepared you are; mentaly, physicaly, and weapons wise, the better your chance of being the one that survives. There was a case of a woman and her parents eating in a restaraunt. A guy came in and started shooting people. The lady made it outside and escaped but both her parents were killed. Her greatest regret, besides losing her parents, was that she had a pistol but had left it in the glove box of her car. It doesn't do you a bit of good if it's not on you and easily accessable when you need it. I have a Walls jacket that I cut the pocket out of on the side I carry my PF-9. When going to and from my car I walk with my hand, seemingly in my pocket, but actually resting on the grip of my PF-9. In warm weather I carry with my shirt untucked covering my two pistols and I keep my right hand empty and always close. Paranoid? Not really. Try living in N. St. Louis for a week or so. You'll learn quick to always be aware and ready. I grew up there. A BG can be on you in the blink of an eye! Should for some reason I lose one pistol in a scuffle, it jams or fails to fire for any reason, I don't intend to stand there with an OH S@@ look on my face at the BG's mercy! I look at a second gun, plus a knife, as an upgraded insurance policy.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #11 on:** March 03, 2011, 03:49:57 AM »

Quote from: Spirithawk on March 02, 2011, 08:09:09 PM

Quote from: SHOOTALL on March 02, 2011, 02:19:27 AM
Sometimes , always in the vehicle. always if a knife counts ( carried a knife for years before the gun).
Would also ask if you tote a non lethal type of protection ? It could matter in some places ...

Never, ever, underestimate a knife. It's a proven fact, can't recall the exact distance but think it's about 10 yards and maybe a bit farther, that a person with a knife can close the distance and stab you before you can draw and fire! I use to carry a taser but to be honest that dang thing scared me!

21 feet is the accepted distance after the victom knows its comming . One thing is for sure knives seldom need reloading

. They are quiet also.

MGMorden · « **Reply #12 on:** March 03, 2011, 08:11:47 AM »

I personally don't carry one. Just about the risk mitigation for me. Any weapon I carry has already been thoroughly tested for reliability, the risk decreases significantly.

With that in mind, consider the likelihood of each of the following:

a) I actually need to pull the gun
b) I am able to draw in time
c) The criminal/perp doesn't take off immediately
d) My primary gun fails
e) I then have enough time to draw a second gun

That is the chain of events that needs to be all be true for me to need a backup gun. Only A & B need be true for me to need my primary. So we're talking around 3 orders of magnitude less of a chance to need the backup gun. To me, that's just in the realm of unlikelihood where if all that happens, it was probably my time.

Not that I fault anyone for carrying one, but there always comes a point where you say "I'm safe, that's enough.". I'm sure to some people carrying only 2 is unacceptable. What if BOTH of your guns fail. Do you have a backup to your backup? Just as with the first BUG, it's a possibility, but it's even less likely. It's always about finding that acceptable level of risk, and personally I feel safe enough only having the 1 gun on me. Besides each gun you strap on you you must be mindful of an keep concealed (ie, if you're wearing a jacket to keep one concealed then the jacket can't ever come off in a restaurant or the like). It's less stressful to limit myself to only thinking about the first one

.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #13 on:** March 03, 2011, 09:07:33 AM »

When I carried, I carried one.
While the belt and suspenders idea is a good one.
Too many options too can get you caught up in a split second desicion.
Do I go for this or that. With only one - that's the one your going for.
Police carry a back up. Makes sense to me that they would. they are running to the gun shots while most of us will e checking to see if our loved ones are alreight and leaving. In an active shooter that is in the work place or in a public place the fight will not last long. A second firearm will give you the ability to arm another person but I don't think it would help you.
A gun fight is going to last about the time it take for a gun to be emptied. Either you will have provided cover for people to leave, the problem has ended or .....
With that said I do take two guns with me when I go hunting. in case one is damaged. Having a second gun near is never a bad idea.

Shawnee Gene · « **Reply #14 on:** March 07, 2011, 07:08:55 AM »

Always.

Savage · « **Reply #15 on:** March 07, 2011, 08:33:10 AM »

Rarely do I carry two guns. Not a bad idea, I guess. Carried one always on duty. Just too lazy now days I guess!
Savage

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #16 on:** March 07, 2011, 09:15:54 AM »

Quote from: MGMorden on March 03, 2011, 08:11:47 AM

I personally don't carry one. Just about the risk mitigation for me. Any weapon I carry has already been thoroughly tested for reliability, the risk decreases significantly.

With that in mind, consider the likelihood of each of the following:

a) I actually need to pull the gun
b) I am able to draw in time
c) The criminal/perp doesn't take off immediately
d) My primary gun fails
e) I then have enough time to draw a second gun

That is the chain of events that needs to be all be true for me to need a backup gun. Only A & B need be true for me to need my primary. So we're talking around 3 orders of magnitude less of a chance to need the backup gun. To me, that's just in the realm of unlikelihood where if all that happens, it was probably my time.

Not that I fault anyone for carrying one, but there always comes a point where you say "I'm safe, that's enough.". I'm sure to some people carrying only 2 is unacceptable. What if BOTH of your guns fail. Do you have a backup to your backup? Just as with the first BUG, it's a possibility, but it's even less likely. It's always about finding that acceptable level of risk, and personally I feel safe enough only having the 1 gun on me. Besides each gun you strap on you you must be mindful of an keep concealed (ie, if you're wearing a jacket to keep one concealed then the jacket can't ever come off in a restaurant or the like). It's less stressful to limit myself to only thinking about the first one .

f) bad guy pins me so I cvan't draw primary weapon . There was a study in NC where it was common to be attacked at the urnial and just such occured most of the time . Main reason I never use one in a public bath room

Cottonwood · « **Reply #17 on:** March 07, 2011, 09:27:09 AM »

Smith & Wesson SD9 ~ 637 is my back up.

Old Fart · « **Reply #18 on:** March 07, 2011, 09:33:26 AM »

Two is one.
One is none.

My little LCP has become second chair to my Kahr CW45.

Dee · « **Reply #19 on:** March 07, 2011, 09:44:09 AM »

In the old days back in the 70 and early 80s, I carried a set of matching satin nickel Colt Combat Commanders. One in a shoulder holster, and one in a pancake hip holster. No one ever asked why I wore a windbreaker year round. I also carried two spare magazines on the belt, a boot knife, and there were magazine pouches screwed into the driver's side inside door panel above the arm rest. They held 6 45 mags, and four M-16 mags. I was the only one in my county assigned to narcotics. I took the dope dealers seriously, and they took me seriously. When I carried a revolver, I carried a Colt detective special as a belly gun. Still carry a belly gun.
Today I no longer hunt bad guys, so I carry a Benchmade 710 lock blade, and Model 60 Smith in 357 mag, or a Model 686 2 1/2 in 357 mag. Most people don't take an old man seriously, but the folks that know me still do, and not everyone that knows me, likes me.
If your turned to carry a second gun, then by all means do. I highly recommend it.

Dee · « **Reply #20 on:** March 07, 2011, 09:45:51 AM »

Quote from: SHOOTALL on March 07, 2011, 09:15:54 AM

Quote from: MGMorden on March 03, 2011, 08:11:47 AM
I personally don't carry one. Just about the risk mitigation for me. Any weapon I carry has already been thoroughly tested for reliability, the risk decreases significantly.

With that in mind, consider the likelihood of each of the following:

a) I actually need to pull the gun
b) I am able to draw in time
c) The criminal/perp doesn't take off immediately
d) My primary gun fails
e) I then have enough time to draw a second gun

That is the chain of events that needs to be all be true for me to need a backup gun. Only A & B need be true for me to need my primary. So we're talking around 3 orders of magnitude less of a chance to need the backup gun. To me, that's just in the realm of unlikelihood where if all that happens, it was probably my time.

Not that I fault anyone for carrying one, but there always comes a point where you say "I'm safe, that's enough.". I'm sure to some people carrying only 2 is unacceptable. What if BOTH of your guns fail. Do you have a backup to your backup? Just as with the first BUG, it's a possibility, but it's even less likely. It's always about finding that acceptable level of risk, and personally I feel safe enough only having the 1 gun on me. Besides each gun you strap on you you must be mindful of an keep concealed (ie, if you're wearing a jacket to keep one concealed then the jacket can't ever come off in a restaurant or the like). It's less stressful to limit myself to only thinking about the first one .
f) bad guy pins me so I cvan't draw primary weapon . There was a study in NC where it was common to be attacked at the urnial and just such occured most of the time . Main reason I never use one in a public bath room

SHOOTALL, I still carry a belly gun. Standin at a urinal...... Well I think you get the picture.

Spirithawk · « **Reply #21 on:** March 07, 2011, 12:28:41 PM »

[/quote]

SHOOTALL, I still carry a belly gun. Standin at a urinal...... Well I think you get the picture.
[/quote]

Yes, but is it a mouse gun?

Sorry bud bud I couldn't resist!

bighemidaddy · « **Reply #22 on:** March 07, 2011, 02:11:51 PM »

officer 1911 and my small kel-tec 380

bighemidaddy

Dee · « **Reply #23 on:** March 07, 2011, 03:11:37 PM »

Quote from: Spirithawk on March 07, 2011, 12:28:41 PM

SHOOTALL, I still carry a belly gun. Standin at a urinal...... Well I think you get the picture.
[/quote]

Yes, but is it a mouse gun?

Sorry bud bud I couldn't resist!

[/quote]

Well SH, I kinda asked for that didn't I? It's that Model 60 357 mag. but, I suppose it would work on a mouse.