Loads for 58 cal. Kodiak Double rifle

[bear55]

I am having problems trying to get anykind of a group with my 58.  RB's are all over.  REAL conicals so far are not bad at 40 yds. then stray.  Lyman conicals fall into the barrel so ground the mold out at the tip so they are snug going down which is better but still stray.  Today made a new base plug which will widen the skirt by .020 as I believe the skirt was blowing out with 80 gr. 2F.  Slug weight is now 564gr.  Trying for 4 inch groups at 70 yds. for black bear this spring.  Any ideas from anyone especially if you have a double.  It has independent rear sights.

[Pat/Rick]

Though I don't shoot a DBL, have you tried a solid based maxi style? IIRC LEE used to make a mould for the R*E*A*L bullet in .58.  Hope ya get it dialed in.

[bear55]

Tried the R*E*A*L* bullets yesterday again but this time used 3F @ 80gr. groups at 60 yds. tightened up.  Left barrel good, right barrel not great but better.  I suspect the right barrel is rougher inside as feels that way when seating the bullet see how the day goes may go up to 90 or 110 grains 3F.  With my modified minie they don't like 3F and 4th. shot wanders bad so will have to stick with 2F with them.  More fresh snow again so good for checking for unburnt powder

[Bigeasy]

What is the twist rate of the bores?  I would slug and measure the bore diameter, then match a properly sized conical to it.  It should load with just a reasonable amount of resistance.  Then experiment with powder charges.  It may take different charges in each barrel for them to regulate properly.  If one of your bores is rough, fire lapping may be required to smooth it out, and prevent accuracy robbing leading.

Larry

[keith44]

My .54 x .54 Kodiak has a 1:32 twist and will not shoot roundballs with anything resembling a hunting load.  3 inch group with 50 gr of 3F goex.  With maxi-hunters I get decent groups for hunting with 95 grains of 2F goex.  With this load my barrels regulate (more or less) at 65 yards.  The left barrel is a bit tighter than the right.  One tip I will pass along, the bullets in question will not carry enough lube to travel the full length of the barrels.  Add a small ball of lube (something kinda stiff that will not corrupt the powder charge.  I blend my own with crisco, beeswax, and olive oil.   As a note of caution Pedersoli will not sanction the loads I am using.  They claim the max loading is 60 grains and a roundball.  My gun, my choice.  Do what you will with yours.

Keith

[bear55]

The fellow I hunt bears with figures we should try to kill one with a spear as a challenge,  that is starting to look like an option.  Blazzing saddles again today.  The *REAL* bullets measure .601, barrel measures .589 and rifling 5 lands and probably .005 deep. Barrels are 1:48 twist.  Made a plug for right barrel as it is the one giving trouble and used some fine lapping compound and worked it a bit.  Fire lapped it this morning half dozen rounds, with small loads.  Tried 70, 80, 90 gr. 3F neither barrel could hit the broad side of a barn at 70yds.  on a rest.  36 cal. flintlock I can take a squirrel at 20yds off hand, not ready to blame me yet.  Tried extra lub on (crisco,beeswax, olive oil, toilet bowl ring wax) flat base of REAL bullet, seemed to create more fouling.  Tomorrow is another day, switch back to 2F and try that.  Still got 250 lbs of lead and neighbor sells powder, little easier than building a spear at this point.

[keith44]

Ok, if it were me (and I have been there with other BP rifles) I'd go "old school".  Old school thinkin says rifle with med and slow twist load roundball and twice bore number grains of 2F.  (ie 2 x 58 = 116 round up to 120 grains of 2F with patched roundball)  This has worked well for .50 and .54 cal single barrel rifles I've owned.  With my .54 Kodiak I started at 85 grains of 3F, and 90 grains of 2F.  Fire one shot from the right barrel only.  Clean the barrel, adjust the sight (if I know I did my part) Dry the barrel, fire one shot from right barrel only, check if the shot landed close to first one.  Wipe barrel with dry patch and shoot again.  This assumes the fouling of the first shots are causing the group to go off.  If the cleaning between shots helps grouping, I'd say deal with it.  Hunting guns should hit best with the first shot from a clean barrel.  Now the tricky part, where does that left barrel hit.  Remember the sight is set for the right barrel.  With the Kodiak, you could set the second rear to the left barrel, or if yours "regulates" with in 3" set it for a further distance.

Just some more info to help muddy the waters 

[bear55]

Thanks Keith44 & Bigeasy for the help, tried the RB's again, all over the place suspected my patch material, then found some Butler Creek poly wads that I bought many years ago that were stored away.  They tightened things up to 3 inch group at 65 yds. 90 gr 2F.  So I know it will shoot, just need to find better patch material and the load it likes.  Cleaned barrels after every shot with a bore cleaner it feels a little slippery on the hands so suspect it has a bit of mild soap in it.  So far seems to prefer 2f and will try the minie's again.  Lapping the right barrel I believe helped it some, got to cast up some more minie's and try them again as want some horsepower as where we hunt have to watch out for grizz. and 6 1/2 to 7ft. bears are common. 

[keith44]

finiky ain't they 

Sounds like you're on the right track, good luck

[Forestclimber]

Dixie Gun Works sells a lot of different bullet molds.  They may be able to tell you what type of bullet shoots well out of your rifle.
This is from the ads in the Dixie Gun Works Catalog:

Authentically styled side by side double barreled rifle. Each barrel is rifled in .58 caliber with a twist rate of 1 turn in 48". The barrels are rifled with 7 lands and grooves with cut rifling with is .006" deep. European Walnut halfstock is finished with a satin type finish with checkering at the straight grip wrist and on the fore-end. Barrels are attached to the stock by a single barrel key. Engraved front action locks and hammers are left in the white. Triggerguards and breechplug tangs are color case hardened and sling swivels are present on the bottom of the buttstock and on the lower ramrod thimble. Double triggers. Barrel is mounted with a bead style front sight on a ramp and two folding adjustable rear sights. The weight is1

[darkgael]

There was an article in the Spring 2002 edition of The Double Gun Journal entitled "With Double Rifle and Powder Flask in Africa" by Ira Lewis. The DR was a Pedersoli Kodiak .58,  1 in 48 twist. He took a record book Eland with it, as well as a Kudu.
His first shots with the rifle were at 65 yards. He used 100 grains of FFg BP, a wonder wad, and a .58 Thompson Center Maxi bullet. "Three rights and three lefts could be covered by my open hand."
He found little difference in accuracy with bullets from 300 to 555 grains. He opted for the larger bullet.
Working up his Africa load, he chose Goex FFg. He started at 90 grains and the heavy 555 gr. Maxi bullet. He found that as velocity increased, so did accuracy. He stopped at 140 grains. His groups - "right/left, right/left, right/left were under four inches at 100 yards."  That was the load he took to Africa - 140 grains of FFg Goex and a 555 grain T/C Maxi ball.
So the gun has possibilities for ya.
Pete

BTW - "The fellow I hunt bears with figures we should try to kill one with a spear as a challenge..."

That would be illegal in many places. Check your game laws if you are serious.  And have a back up with a no nonsense firearm.
P

[bear55]

Time to take a break for couple of days, found with my modified minie I can get about a 3 1/2 inch group now with either barrel at 80 yds.  Left barrel 100 gr. 2f right barrel 90 gr. 2f. so quite happy with that for now.  Plan on taking up the powder charge a bit a see if accuracy inproves a little more.  Judging by the caps I have gone through my guess is each barrel has seen about 200 rds. in the last couple of weeks, so with some more shooting that may also improve.  Thanks for the info darkgael, my interpretation of 3 rights 3 lefts & covered by my open hand sounds like a group of about 3 1/2 inches at 65yds so I am there, have to check on 100 yds. and aim for 4.  I would say with open sights would not expect much better.  Not a spring chicken anymore.  I also have a set of 50 cal. barrels for the gun so will have to work on them this summer if I have time, seem to be busy with retirement.

[keith44]

One last thing about these Rifles you need to consider, just before you go on your hunt, polish that brass disk on the front blade and put a little wax on it.  This will help it to show up against the dark fur of the critter your aimin at