Author Topic: .300 Savage Brass from .308?  (Read 2912 times)

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Offline Idaho_Hick

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« on: September 30, 2005, 07:05:35 AM »
I just picked up a .300 savage and was wondering about brass manufacture.  I have scores of .308 brass and from looking at case dimensions, it looks like one could resize it down to .300 savage.  However, I have not been reloading long and the only other cartridges I reload for are very straitforward, I have never tried custom brass forming.  So my question is, can I simply run a lubed .308 case into a .300 savage die and trim to length, or is there more to it than that?  I thought I would ask before I broke/stuck something.  I appreciate any and all help.

Offline HL

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2005, 10:35:56 AM »
It depends. What firearm are you wanting to use it in.

I have done just what you are asking, but only for my contender.

I just ran the lubed brass through a 300 savage small base sizer and trimmed to length.

The 308 brass has lasted me for over 15 years now. I don't know how many times I have reloaded some, but all still have tight primer pockets, no splits or separations and have only had to trim them once since the initial forming.

I attribute this to the savage operating at lower pressures than the 308 brass is designed to withstand.

But then again, I may be wrong. But they have sure lasted longer than the 300 savage brass I started with.

BTW all my 308 brass was once fired and given to me by a shooting buddy. Around 500 rounds.

I don't know how this would work in a lever action or bolt action.

HL

Offline brasskeeper

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2005, 01:36:58 PM »
The 308 brass may work, but I would not do it. My reason is safety. If you reload for the 308 there is a chance no matter how small that you could get ammo mixed up the results of which I'm sure you know could be very dangerous. I reload for 308 and 7mm-08  and I make sure to use properly head stamped brass for this reason. Buy the way I hope you enjoy your 300. What model rifle is it?

Offline Zeke Menuar

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2005, 10:03:05 PM »
Quote from: Idaho_Hick
I just picked up a .300 savage and was wondering about brass manufacture.  I have scores of .308 brass and from looking at case dimensions, it looks like one could resize it down to .300 savage.  However, I have not been reloading long and the only other cartridges I reload for are very straitforward, I have never tried custom brass forming.  So my question is, can I simply run a lubed .308 case into a .300 savage die and trim to length, or is there more to it than that?  I thought I would ask before I broke/stuck something.  I appreciate any and all help.


Yes you can, but it is a PITA and not worth the time and effort involved.  I tried it once out of sheer boredom.  It worked, but I wouldn't do it again unless I couldn't get 300 Savage brass anywhere.

Far easier to order a bunch from Midway

http://www.midwayusa.com/ebrowse.exe/browse?TabID=1&Categoryid=9162&categorystring=9315***652***670***9013***

A couple of hundred cases would last awhile if you neck-size and don't load it too hot.

ZM
Official Guardian of the Arsenal of Paranoia

Offline Reed1911

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2005, 09:17:38 AM »
I would be happy to supply it for if you like. Cost would be a little less than Midway.

100 - 26.90
250 - 63.60
500 - 130.00
1000 - 251.15
Ron Reed
Reed's Ammunition & Research
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Offline Siskiyou

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2005, 07:43:05 AM »
I have been resizing once fired military 7.62 & .308 brass to .300 Savage for about 30 years without a problem.  I do prefer the mil brass because it does not have a .308 headstamp.  I have had a number of expert's tell me it is not worth it, but I disagree.  The proof is in the doing.  First time around I run the Military bass thru a Lee 30-06 die.  That takes out the primer, I then take out the crimp around the primer pocket.  The next step is to run the brass into a RCBS .300 Savage small base die.  I have received very good case life.  I normally do the conversion in lots of 100.  Saves time in the long run.

Many of the so-called experts also told me the .300 Savage is a tough case to reload because of the short neck.  I guess I have not had those problems because I am not an expert.  Just an old user.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

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Offline brasskeeper

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2005, 10:36:33 AM »
Quote from: Siskiyou
I have been resizing once fired military 7.62 & .308 brass to .300 Savage for about 30 years without a problem.  I do prefer the mil brass because it does not have a .308 headstamp.  I have had a number of expert's tell me it is not worth it, but I disagree.  The proof is in the doing.  First time around I run the Military bass thru a Lee 30-06 die.  That takes out the primer, I then take out the crimp around the primer pocket.  The next step is to run the brass into a RCBS .300 Savage small base die.  I have received very good case life.  I normally do the conversion in lots of 100.  Saves time in the long run.

Many of the so-called experts also told me the .300 Savage is a tough case to reload because of the short neck.  I guess I have not had those problems because I am not an expert.  Just an old user.


Just curios what rifle do you have chambered in 300 savage? I have a savage model 1899

Offline Siskiyou

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2005, 04:57:28 PM »
Currently just a Rem.722.  At one time it was also being fed to an old M99 that had been cut down to carbine.  I have no clue what series of M99 it was.  That rifle belonged to a brother who got into wildcating.

My current loads are at the top of the old Hornaday charts.  I use IMR 4064 and according to the Chrony push a 165 grain bullet around 2670 fps.  There are no pressure problems in the M722 and brass life is good.  I have been shooting up my old factory loads at the range.
There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline brasskeeper

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2005, 11:37:22 PM »
Quote from: Siskiyou
Currently just a Rem.722.  At one time it was also being fed to an old M99 that had been cut down to carbine.  I have no clue what series of M99 it was.  That rifle belonged to a brother who got into wildcating.

My current loads are at the top of the old Hornaday charts.  I use IMR 4064 and according to the Chrony push a 165 grain bullet around 2670 fps.  There are no pressure problems in the M722 and brass life is good.  I have been shooting up my old factory loads at the range.


Sounds like you have a winner. I dont see many rifles chambered for 300 savage anymore. 15 years ago I passed on a remington 760 and I've been kicking myself every sense. My 1899 was passed down from grandfather and according to the serial number was made in 1922.

Offline Idaho_Hick

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2005, 04:40:45 AM »
Thanks for all the help folks, for those of you who were wondering, it is a model 99 EG, made in the early fifties.  I realize it would be easier to buy new brass, but things are kinda tight with a new baby, and I want to shoot this one a lot!

Offline Tc300mag1

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.300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2005, 12:49:08 PM »
Yes it can be done but i just prefer to buy it  i understand if money is tight though i have 2 760 remingtons  great shooting caliber

Offline xzqzq

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2011, 04:05:59 PM »
I am interested in this thread.... I have a .300 Savage on a K-98 Mauser action, that I have started reloading for.... but find that brass, new or 1x fired to be expensive, and am looking for alternatives....with my two attempts thus far, I have not been able to get the bolt closed...

Offline Doug B.

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2011, 02:04:40 AM »
I have used countless .308's to squeeze down to .300 Savage. Only complaint I had was it does involve a lot of trimming. Approximately 3/16". Solved that problem too. Bought a Forster trimmer I use in my drill press.

I decap and squeeze them down in just one operation in just the .300 dies, being careful not to over lube the cases, or obvious dent damage WILL occur. Have checked the loaded ammo in my Savage .300 EG and have yet to find one that won't chamber due to over thick necks. Load accordingly to accommodate different pressure as you always should.

I don't have problems with  .308 head stamps as I don't own a .308. My buddy does the same as I and he just "ticks" the headstamps on the .308's with a Dremel tool to remove. His grand kids shoot his reloads.
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2011, 02:43:48 AM »
As stated it can and has been successfully done. I agree with others when they voice concern with different head stamps. It is a very real concern. What happens if your gone? You wife sells or gives all the stuff away to some nephew or grandson and he unknowingly gets hurt.

It simply NOT WORTH IT!!!

If you must do this use military brass even then be sure it's not  stamped with a caliber. Generally speaking it's better brass anyhow.

Another option is trade or sell some of your abundant brass to fund the savage brass.

Safety is each of our responsibilities.. IMHO, we need to Think about what could happen when things are beyond your control.

CW
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Offline Doug B.

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #14 on: March 28, 2011, 03:12:56 AM »
As stated it can and has been successfully done. I agree with others when they voice concern with different head stamps. It is a very real concern. What happens if your gone? You wife sells or gives all the stuff away to some nephew or grandson and he unknowingly gets hurt.

It simply NOT WORTH IT!!!

If you must do this use military brass even then be sure it's not  stamped with a caliber. Generally speaking it's better brass anyhow.

Another option is trade or sell some of your abundant brass to fund the savage brass.

Safety is each of our responsibilities.. IMHO, we need to Think about what could happen when things are beyond your control.

CW

Well stated!  Kudos.
"Be A Good Listener. Your Ears Will Never Get You In Trouble"

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Offline Siskiyou

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2011, 10:23:27 AM »

Military Headstamps:  Sometime in the 1960’s my Dad bought a few boxes of Winchester 300 Savage ammunition in brown boxes with a generic label.  The cases had a military head stamp.  They were loaded with a FMJ bullet.  Unfortunately # 2 brother tossed the boxes and the empty cases. 

I would not be surprised that this ammunition was loaded at the time the U.S. Military was developing the 7.62 round for the M14 rifle.  I have read many articles that claim the 300 Savage case was the father of the 7.62 NATO case. 

I agree with Doug B that the amount of case trimming is a pain.  For a long time I was using my original Forster case trimmer with a hand crank to trim the cases but that gets old real fast. In the long past when many of our members were in diapers that bulk brass was not available to the reloader.  There was a time that I was happy to buy new brass in boxes of 20 cases.  But Midway changed that and I was able to buy bulk brass in boxes of 100 cases. 

My Remington 722 has a 24-inch barrel and that extra two inches translates into higher velocities than many 308 loads out of a 22-inch barrel.  Using a lot of caution I have built my load up to 41.4 grains of IMR4064 and a 165 grain bullet.  That is the maximum charge recommend in three (3) of my Hornady reloading manuals.  I use a long drop tube when loading it. 

Yes, I have exceeded the recommend maximum charge with test rounds without a problem.  But I share cwlongshot concerns regarding the ammunition falling into another’s hands.  I am happy with the rifle as is, but I have thought about re-chambering it in the distant pass. 

One option I have looked at is the 30-284 Winchester.  Of course this requires re-chambering the rifle and reforming sometimes hard to find 284 Winchester cases.
http://www.loaddata.com/members/search_detail.cfm?MetallicID=1431&caliber=.30&caliberid=12&header=.30%20Caliber%20Reloading%20Data


Another option is re-chambering to the 308 Winchester case.  I considered this option back before the bulk 300 Savage cases were available.  This would have made a lot of properly head stamped cases available, and take out the labor required to reform and trim cases.  A review of the load data in three Hornady manuals indicates that such a change does not upgrade velocity and to reach the velocity obtained in my .300 Savage loads in a 308 chambered rifle requires two or three additional grains of powder.  Admittedly I am comparing my rifle with a 24-inch barrel with a test 308 with a 22-inch barrel. 

If I understand correctly IMR4320 was the powder in Remington-Peters loads.  I started out developing loads using IMR4320 and IMR4064.  I settled on IMR4064 and after getting a Chrony some years later I tested the loads using 4064 and was pleased with the results.  I found the velocity of factory ammunition did not match published data.

Brother #2 gave me a jug of AA2015BR.  This powder produced very accurate loads; maybe that is why BR stands for Bench Rest.  When the brother obtained a Remington Model 760 in 300 Savage I advised him of the results with AA2015.  He has been very happy with the results using AA2015.  The maximum published load appears to be very mild and the listed pressures fall below the maximum pressure of 46,000 cup. 

Both the Model 760 and the 722 which are of much later manufacture then the early Model 99 Savages and handle our loads without any issues.  I was interested at what point my brother’s 760 would suffer extraction problems, because he loads full throttle at times.  He has had no problems with functioning in the 760. 

I believe the Short, Fat .300 Savage case leans towards accuracy.  I have not fired recently loaded factory ammunition in many years, but it has been my experience that my handloads have improved the accuracy of my rifle.

I think the 165-grain bullets are the ideal weight for the 300 Savage when deer hunting.  I have some good 150-grain loads giving slight over a thousand pounds of energy at 400-yards.  The 165-grain bullets launched at a slow 2670 fps product over a 1000 pounds of energy at 600 yards.



Exit hole caused by a 165-grain Nosler PT from my 722 Remington in .300 Savage.  Bullet entered the front of the right shoulder, traveled up the neck and exited on the right side.



There is a learning process to effectively using a gps.  Do not throw your compass and map away!

Boycott: San Francisco, L.A., Oakland, and City of Sacramento, CA.

Offline 336SC

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2011, 11:41:42 AM »
I have four .300 Savage rifles.  A Savage 99, a Remington 722, a Remington 700, and a Remington 7600.  I tried
the .308 reforming to .300 Savage and it works but labor intensive.  If you can't afford new .300 Savage brass it
is an alternative to reform .308 Win brass.  I stocked up on .300 Savage when they all said it was being discontinued.  Even bought 300 in nickel plated version.  My wife will be selling most of it at the "Big Yard Sale" after I'm gone.  I would not rechamber that 722 to .308 Win.  The .300 Savage will do anything the .308 Win will
I'm not saying it cause I "read" it somewhere.  I've killed deer with the 30-06, .308 Win and .300 Savage, all with
150gr spitzer reloads and there isn't an ounce of difference between em that I can tell.  Line up the cross hairs, squeeze the trigger and bang flop.  If you do make your brass from .308 Win, make sure you check the outside
neck diameter with bullet seated and be sure it is within SAMMI specifications.  When you resize the .308 Win into
.300 Savage, the brass flows toward the mouth of case and might be too thick.  I inside neck ream mine when needed.  Like it was suggested above, dremel out the headstamp and safety won't be an issue if you have a .308
Win also.
336SC
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Offline wncchester

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2011, 01:03:12 PM »
Everyone to his own fears but I would do it without concern. 

I haven't made .300 S (yet) but I routinely reform .30-06 to .308, 7.65, .270, .243, .22-250 and 6mm International.    (And I make longish .44 Mag revolver shotshells from .303 Brit. but that's another story.)  Yeah, it's more 'work' than buying new cases...but reloading is more work than buying new factory ammo.  ??
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Offline HL

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2011, 04:18:50 PM »
Unless you also have a 308, the head stamp won't cause any problems with you using it for 300 savage. I have 500 308's i converted to 300 savage and use for my contender. The only person that might have safety issues with me leaving the 308 headstamp would be for the person that stole my spent brass. Hope it works out great for them.

Offline res45

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Re: .300 Savage Brass from .308?
« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2011, 06:13:39 PM »
I converted a bunch of free LC X51 brass to 300 Sav. for use with my cast bullet loads in my Sav. 99 they work like a champ,the thicker brass of the X51 case gets me about 50 fps. more MV with same load in standard 300 Sav. brass due to slightly smaller case capacity but the load is well below the max charge I can use with that powder bullet combination and the brass has also last a very long time with those low pressure loads.

I did all my trimming with a Lee case length gage and a cordless drill,doesn't take long to knock out about 50 cases at a time.  1. 7.62 x 51   2. Reformed case   3. finished 300 Sav. case.
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