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Offline Indygunworks

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Historically correct?
« on: March 18, 2013, 09:02:56 AM »
I have ran across this while searching for videos of what my 2 1/4 inch bore cannon might sound like when its done.  He calls it a verbruggen field cannon, but then says civil war.  the carriage would be correct for the civil war but not the cannon.  Am I missing something here?  Normally I would trust my initial judgment but his website says they specialize in historically accurate cannons.... BUT, he calls it a grasshopper, and its most DEFINATLY not a grasshopper that much I am sure about.
 
 
http://cannonmasters.com/Home_Page.php
 
on the youtube video he says this as a description
Well after 3 years of design, gathering of materials and construction, we finally finished it!  It is modeled after a full size Verbruggen "grasshopper" 3 pounder field cannon.  It shoots 2-3/4" balls, funny enough the same measurement as billiards balls! 
The barrel is 3 feet long and weighs around 200 pounds, making the entire field cannon weigh around 400 pounds.  Wood and wheels are all custom made along with all the metal work was done by a true blacksmith.

 
I thought a pool ball bore was 2 1/4 not 2 3/4?
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Offline Cannon Cocker

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2013, 10:14:06 AM »
Indy,  If he is mentioning Verbruggen (meaning Jan and Peter, father and son, Dutch cannon founders hired by England to produce guns in the 18th century) and Civil War (19th century) in the same sentence, you should be wary of any "facts" he has on any topic.  Not sure what the dia. of a pool ball is, but if there is a discrepancy there, it strengthens my suggestion to be careful. 
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Offline Indygunworks

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2013, 10:25:24 AM »
No need to be careful, it doesn't look like he is selling anything, other than he does have a contact feature on his page.  I also think the barrel he has is the same barrel I have which is a 2 1/4 bore.  So, he is calling a prarie carriage a grasshopper, and a verbruggen a civil war barrel. 
  yet claims this
 Cannon Masters Inc. is a design team specializing in the custom design of the highest quality historically accurate cannons.
 
I just don't understand how that statement can be responsibly made.... clearly from his website he knows a thing or two about black powder cannons.... I did 1 day of googling when I first looked into building my rev cannon and know better than this.
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Offline Cannon Cocker

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #3 on: March 18, 2013, 10:55:51 AM »


Generally people that don't know much, don't know that they don't know much. 
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Offline boomerralph

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2013, 12:22:43 PM »
A standard regulation billiard ball is 2.250"
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Ralph M. Reese
St. Augustine, FL

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2013, 04:30:26 PM »
     Looks like I'm a Johnny come lately here, but after reading the text on the linked site, I just could not believe all the assorted inaccuracies.  You guys have noted most of them, but you left a pretty juicy one for me.  If they decide to sell some of these most excellent, completely historically accurate artillery, the first customer that tries to stuff a golf ball down the 40mm bore will be a little PO'd, maybe more than a little!  Maybe they will include the claw hammer we all saw in the video, but there will be some difficulty even with help from this type of persuader.  40mm divided by 25.4mm = 1.575"    The lower end of the average size of a golf ball is 1.685" which is what the ground steel Fox balls measure.  So, 1.685" minus 1.575" = .110"   There is .110 inch of interference between their bore size and the diameter of the ammunition they recommend.  Nuff said! A hint, 25.4 is an absolute constant (an infinite number of zeros behind the 4) divisor that converts mm to inches.  25.4mm = 1.000"

T&M
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Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline KABAR2

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2013, 04:45:18 AM »
T&M I'm guessing this is one of those SQUEEZE bore mortars  :P :o ::)
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Mr president I do not cling to either my gun or my Bible.... my gun is holstered on my side so I may carry my Bible and quote from it!

Sed tamen sal petrae LURO VOPO CAN UTRIET sulphuris; et sic facies tonituum et coruscationem si scias artficium

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2013, 08:19:21 AM »
     KABAR2,   Talk about SQUEEZE bores, our friend the gunsmith told us years ago about the customer who came to his shop with a Jap Type 38 rifle.  He said, "This thing kicks like a mule, what can you do?"  The gunsmith looked at the rifle, muttering, "Type 38,  6.5 Jap". Then he opened the bolt and looked at the chamber, muttering, "What the......."  Turning to the customer he asked, "What cartridge is this rifle chambered for?"  30-06 was the reply.  Our friend quickly spun the rifle, swapping ends, and eyeballed the muzzle.  "Now there's your problem!", he said, pointing to the muzzle.  The customer looked and saw the tiny 6.5mm (.256") diameter hole.  "Who chambered this rifle, our friend bellowed?"  "Me and a friend", the customer said, "and we had a heck of a time with that 30-06 reamer pilot; we finally had to grind it off to chamber it all the way in."  Our friend the gunsmith gave the customer a friendly glance and recommended that he hang it on a wall and thank his lucky stars that he didn't blow himself up.  After the customer declined his offer to re-barrel the rifle, he even welded a short steel plug in the chamber for free, to make it safe for others in the future.

"Now THAT was a squeeze-bore!", he told us.

Tracy and Mike
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Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline KABAR2

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2013, 11:04:08 AM »
T&M there have been a few of those 6.5-o6 done and found over the years someone years ago had the money and the time to do a slow-mo film of one of these firing..... the barrel actually expanded and snapped back to original ID! ....... sooner or later the snap would be replace by "crack" and catastrophic fail..... I have to email you about another squeeze bore in the future.... this one you might find interesting....
 
Allen <><
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Mr president I do not cling to either my gun or my Bible.... my gun is holstered on my side so I may carry my Bible and quote from it!

Sed tamen sal petrae LURO VOPO CAN UTRIET sulphuris; et sic facies tonituum et coruscationem si scias artficium

Offline Cannon Cocker

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Re: Historically correct?
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2013, 06:10:55 PM »
Quote from: seacoastartillery on March 19, 2013, 08:19:21 AM
     KABAR2,   Talk about SQUEEZE bores, our friend the gunsmith told us years ago about the customer who came to his shop with a Jap Type 38 rifle.  He said, "This thing kicks like a mule, what can you do?"  The gunsmith looked at the rifle, muttering, "Type 38,  6.5 Jap". Then he opened the bolt and looked at the chamber, muttering, "What the......."  Turning to the customer he asked, "What cartridge is this rifle chambered for?"  30-06 was the reply.  Our friend quickly spun the rifle, swapping ends, and eyeballed the muzzle.  "Now there's your problem!", he said, pointing to the muzzle.  The customer looked and saw the tiny 6.5mm (.256") diameter hole.  "Who chambered this rifle, our friend bellowed?"  "Me and a friend", the customer said, "and we had a heck of a time with that 30-06 reamer pilot; we finally had to grind it off to chamber it all the way in."  Our friend the gunsmith gave the customer a friendly glance and recommended that he hang it on a wall and thank his lucky stars that he didn't blow himself up.  After the customer declined his offer to re-barrel the rifle, he even welded a short steel plug in the chamber for free, to make it safe for others in the future.

"Now THAT was a squeeze-bore!", he told us.

Tracy and Mike

Look at the bright side.  It engaged the rifling real good.
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