Author Topic: 40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder  (Read 1148 times)

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Offline jeff b. HHI 7241

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« on: January 05, 2004, 12:00:35 PM »
Anyone have any? Just got a Competitor barrel in this as part of a package deal and the only info I can find is for blackpowder. It's a .410 bore so as to take .41 mag. bullets, Any help is appreciated.
Thanks, Jeff

Offline Blackhawk44

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2004, 12:53:52 PM »
A couple of years back, Ken Waters did a Pet Loads column in Handloader magazine with modern powders.   Even though he only used bullets of 265gr, the data would still be a valid basis to work from.  Go to riflemagazine.com, then click Handloader magazine, then work from there.

Offline FAsmus

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Re: 40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2004, 09:10:37 AM »
Jeff,

J: I just got a Competitor barrel in this..

F:  What is a "competitor" barrel?

I have fired thousands of smokeless 40/65 loads and have some good loads for the cartridge. the kind and type gun you're shooting is important to the discussion.

Good afternoon,
Forrest

Offline jeff b. HHI 7241

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2004, 09:44:23 AM »
Forrest, the Competitor is a canon breech handgun. It is chambered for over 400 different cartridges, so it can handle the little boomers as well as the big, big, BIG boomers. My barrel is 18" with brake. I look forward to seeing your data as I've gotten no-where to this point.
Thanks, Jeff

p.s., it is a single shot.

Offline FAsmus

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2004, 10:04:27 AM »
Jeff,

J: The Competitor is a canon breech handgun..

F:  OK. I saw it pictured on your page just after I hit "send" last time.

For an outfit like that I'd keep the bullet weight down to 300 to 330 grains I think. The really heavy 380 to 420 grain bullets probably wouldn't stabilize in it anyway. What is the twist in your gun?

I have a 320 grain NEI bullet that works first-rate with 33 grains Data 4197 (10% slower than IMR 4198) and 15 grains homey grits filler, compressed. This load is deadly in my Marlin 1895; knocks deer off their feet and they can't get up again. Groups well too.

I have fired the 300 grain Lyman 405 Winchester bullet (I forget the number here at work) a good deal too. It worked well with a variety of loads light and heavy. One of the best was 23 grains IMR 4227 and T/P filler. Not too fast but very accurate.

The current winner for long range shooting in the Marlin 1895 is the SAECO 65640. A 385 grain bullet over 18 grains SR4759, T/P filler and the up-side-down gas check.

More to follow if you're interested. The data books are home.

Good afternoon,
Forrest

Offline jeff b. HHI 7241

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2004, 10:08:22 AM »
Forrest, it's a 1-14 twist, and yes I'm interested in as much data as possible. Since my barrel has a .410 bore, I'd like to try some 41 mag. bullets. Your thoughts on this?
Jeff

Offline FAsmus

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2004, 11:23:22 AM »
Jeff,

J: It's a 1-14 twist, and yes I'm interested in as much data as possible. Since my barrel has a .410 bore, I'd like to try some 41 mag. bullets. Your thoughts on this?

F: The only 41 pistol bullet I ever tried in my rifles was the H&G 256.410.

This bullet never did shoot over any load I tried except very light loads intended for indoor practice.

Your 14 twist should stabilize anything you can stand to shoot in the short gun.

The Lyman-Ideal number for the 405 Winchester bullet is 412263. This is a 300 grain round nose. The load mentioned previously, 33 gr Data 4197 and 15 gr grits is one of the best loads I have worked up. Fairly fast, powerful and accurate. I works with both the 300 gr Lyman and the 320 gr NEI bullet I have.

The bullet is critical I think. I had NEI make my 320 gr item by dipping their 285 gr flat nose Bevel Base design a little further into the mold block, making it heavier. Then I carefully removed the BB by hand here at my place.

I have also fired up to 42 grains WW748 under the 300 gr bullets. With and without filler.

Velocity was never a really high priority for me for the most part. I wanted consistent speeds for long range shooting and used lots of reduced loads using IMR 4227 and vairous 350 - 380 grain bullets. Usually 20 to 23 grains worked best for me with some kind of filler. I have used T/P filler and inert cerials successfully in the 40/65.

Non-fillered loads with nearly full cases of medium-burning powders never filled the bill for me. They were usually too powderful for the long range game; providing excessive recoil, or too fast and thus drifting too much in the changing conditions of the Buffalo Gun long range shooting I am interested in.

What kind of shooting is your short gun used for?

Good afternoon,
Forrest

Offline jeff b. HHI 7241

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2004, 12:06:06 PM »
Forrest, the uses for me will be paper at 100 meters for sighting in and practicing, then for deer, hogs and perhaps woodchucks. I plan on no competition shooting, nor long range either. I shoot all single shot pistols of various makes, from .223 all the way up to 375-06 and 444 Marlin. Recoil is not a concern at all. I'd like to try using loads which require no filler, however, I don't know if the 40-65 case can handle the pressures. Any feedback on this?
Jeff

Offline FAsmus

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40-65 WCF loads in smokeless powder
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2004, 12:26:05 PM »
Jeff,

J: I don't know if the 40-65 case can handle the pressures. Any feedback on this?

F;  So far as I'm concerned 40/65 cases made from R-P 45/70 brass are as strong as anything I've ever played around with. The heads are solid brass, heavy as need be for anything I've ever thought of firing. Full smokeless pressures are attainable in suitable actions.

Good evening,
Forrest