Author Topic: Loading the Max  (Read 583 times)

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Offline TNBilly

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Loading the Max
« on: October 26, 2011, 02:53:06 PM »
357 Max that is..... started loading this in my Handi today - got interesting results.  Comparison results would be most welcome.

Load is Rem. brass, cci450 primers, 180 XTP's and 25grs - 28 grs AA1680  Load OAL is 2.050 crimp moderate.

25 gr load was soot city, had soot all the way back to the breach.  The 28 gr load was still sooty as well though at least a little less so.  Obviously the pressure is very moderate.  Most of the loads I've seen stop at 28 grs but I'm thinking I still need to go up a little, perhaps a couple steps up to 29grs.  Accuracy is pretty good.  I was shooting just before dusk so it probably will be better in more light.  Anyhow anyone else have similar results with low pressure?  I'm wondering if that's why some stick with the "mag" powders like 4227 and 296.

Ron
America is great because she is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”        Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline mechanic

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2011, 03:47:34 PM »
I have yet to buy the AA, but have had good success with H110 behind that bullet.  3/4 moa.  Have only shot one deer with it, and I took it too high and forward, (running) and hit the shoulder.  It left a hole on the exit you could stick your hand it, and brought bone out with it.  When you find the sweet spot, please post.  I have been waiting to get to the candy store to buy some new powders.
 
Ben
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2011, 12:42:51 AM »
Morning,
 I would try a different primer. (Drop the charge a bit to start too) Are your cases clean to start with? How about sizing lube, (If your using any) has it been properly cleaned off? I personally haven't seen the need for a Mag primer with this caliber. I use the Remmy SR primer. I'm guessing your soot is stemming from the mag primer....
 
Way back I worked up watching pressure and accuracy in my orig maxi barrel and didn't reach the numbers your starting at. I mention it just to enforce that all barrels are different. I have a second barrel to work on and so far my orig loading seems very light in it. But I do not have any sooty cases.
 
Good luck,
 CW
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Offline oneoldsap

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2011, 03:02:51 AM »
 Why are you crimping these loads , it's not nessesary .

Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2011, 03:50:05 AM »
Why are you crimping these loads , it's not necessary .

Crimping cases when loading some powders is most helpful for complete ignition and stable velocities. It's also useful for severe duty cycling in some actions.

I crimp all my maxi loadings. Because of the powders I load them with.
I crimp ALL H110, 296, #9 and Lil gunloads. As well as my cast bullet loads.

It has been debated over and over. Some do while others dont. Absolutely it will go bang withOUT a crimp. Personally, i find cleaner, better more complete burn and overall more consistant accuracy crimping. Try it both ways, if it makes you happy not crimping, go for it.
In short, while you may find it in unnecessary, I do not agree.

CW
"Pay heed to the man who carries a single shot rifle, he likely knows how to use it."

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Offline TNBilly

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2011, 06:33:17 AM »
Further update: had time to load a little extra and shoot yesterday.  Ended up being a good learning session.  For those that had a couple questions or comments....... when I start a load using a ball powder I ALWAYS first work it up with a magnum primer.  I later may try the load with a standard primer for comparison purposes, but that's the order I do it in.  My favorite load for 62gr 223 using W748 worked a little better with a standard primer i.e.  I likely will try it without a crimp as well, for comparison later.  What I found out - 28grs is the good usable max in my Handi.  While it's not the last level that had no signs of pressure, it's the most accurate in my Handi and is within about a grain of where problems got real noticable.  Dropping back is the best in my experience, I don't like running anywhere near max.  It's probably close enough, sometimes you wish you had a pressure testing setup!  Once you get in the area of a grain more web expansion started and other signs of excessive pressure.  I also just for grins (usually you wouldn't think the need) measured the brass and chamber.  SAAMI calls for .3809 +3 for the chamber and .379 -6 for the brass.  Mine measures 382 and 375 which gives me a new brass clearance of 7 thou.  While it's all in spec I have a strong opinion this is the source of my sooting problem and tendency to aggrevate pressure problems a tighter chamber might not see.  My solution, which worked out real well was to do the straight-wall case equivalent of neck-sizing.  The fired cases are a consistent .379 after firing which gives me a .003 clearance, plenty for my purposes, no loading or extraction problems.  The sooting went entirely away and as a bonus the spread and deviation went into the low single digits and the accuracy dropped under an inch at 50.

  I did work up a quick couple sets using W296 - dissappointing at best.  Accuracy was around 4" at 50 and the pressure curve was way too fast for the SB1.  Primer intrusion into the firing pin area was way excessive to use.  More than likely if I was using an SB2 this would not have presented itself and is the reason I'll be sticking with AA1680.  The 1680 is notibly smoother pressure curve.  I'm going to try Rel-7 as well but as of now I'm pleased with the 1680 results.  Note of warning though - do NOT believe anyone that says you can't get an overload with 1680 in the Max, you certainly CAN.
America is great because she is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”        Alexis de Tocqueville

Offline TNBilly

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Re: Loading the Max
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2011, 01:20:09 PM »
A further update I hope will be of interest to those shooting the MAX in SB1's.  I have, since the last update here tried several primer and powder combinations with the 180gr XTP.  Rel7 worked "all right" but never produced the same velocity or accuracy for that matter as the 1680 did.  My final load, one that will work for me is the "standard" 28grs of 1680 and CCI #41 primers.  The XTP's are seated to 2.045 and the SSSP's are seated to 2.350.  I just tried the SSSP's today and they give the same velocity and poi as the XTP's.  The #41 primers BTW show little to no cratering in the larger primer hole and I noticed today I loaded Jamison brass and it seemed to be notibly cleaner than the Rem. brass I'd been using.  Don't know if perhaps the Jamison is a little softer or what but it seems to seal the chamber better, very, very little soot down the sides.
  Just for the books, the above listed load gave me today with the SSSP's ave. 2007 fps, ES = 17, SD = 9
America is great because she is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”        Alexis de Tocqueville