Author Topic: Stopped off at a large gun show  (Read 1120 times)

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Offline mannyrock

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Stopped off at a large gun show
« on: January 30, 2012, 06:04:02 AM »
 
Dear Guys,
 
    I stopped off at a large gunshow this weekend.  About 200 tables.  Lots  and lots of brand new firearms, stacked on the tables in their boxes, especially the bolt action Remington, Howa and Savage rifles with synthetic stocks.
 
   I was there 3 hours on a Saturday, and didn't see one person buy anything!  (Correct that, I saw one person buy one sem-auto handgun.)
 
   What's the point?  Why are these dealers spending all of their time to drive long distances, set up, stay over night, pack and unpack, to sell next to nothing?
 
  One this I noticed as well.  The asking price of used Winchester 94s, and M-1 Carbines had tumbled back down to real world prices. The 03-A3 Springfields as well. I guess the speculative craze has collapsed?
 
  Saw several 03-A3s in nice shape, with asking price of $600.
 
   Several VG+ condition Model 94s in the $375 asking range.
 
   Saw an all matching Inland Carbine, in VG+ condition, asking price $725.
 
   As the WWII and Korean War Vet generation passes away, the demand for these used rifles is going to continue to fall.  The 20 and 30 something generations are just not interested in them.  (The black and white WWII movies and cowboy movies, that we all grew up with, were replaced by Transformers movies in color.)  None of the younger crowd will have "fond childhood memories" of their grandfathers using these rifles. 
 
  The vast majority of the rifles that guys at the show were picking up and shouldering were brand new black rifles, especially the less expensive models (Olymic Arms, S&W Sport, etc.), in .223.
 
  I didn't see anyone bother to handle any of the Savage 99s.
 
  Mannyrock
 
 
 
 

Offline mcbammer

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2012, 06:22:46 AM »
I  havent  been   to   a   show  in   several   years  but   Ive   purchased   a lot   of    firearms  at   the   time   ;   I   traded   with   other    privet   gun  owners   .  But   I  do   like   to    look   over     the   dealers   tables. Better   trades    with    other   indivduals   than    dealers    I   think.

Offline timothy

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2012, 09:13:16 AM »
Are you saying those poor old 94s, 99's, and 03's cant find a home because the younger generation doesnt want them? Those arent the prices in my area. Those older retired dealers are pretty much keeping those guns out of the younger generations hands. They just like traveling with the wife and and showing off their toys across america during their final years. The minute a gun show open its all leftovers from the most knowledgeable people in the industry who snatch up the good deals an hour before the doors open. I've seen dealers with hundreds of thousands of dollars of guns on their tables. Think they invested that much?

Offline Dales66Ford

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2012, 03:00:15 AM »
I went to an OK size one this weekend also but I found a lot of the same as before.  Lots of guns, no real deals.  Dealers asking 250 for a stevens single shot!  3 overpriced H&R single shot 12 gauge.  Asking 120 for home-camo H&R with surface rust!  One thing I did notice though, it seemed as if all the dealers have been buying up all the SxS's in the nation.  Every dealer had at least one, some had 3 dozen or more.  All wanting 500 or more except for the new clones, which looked bad, even though they were new.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. - H. L. Mencken

Offline bilmac

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2012, 04:18:50 AM »
The only deals are the local guys some not even dealers,  who just want to get rid of some things they don't want anymore. And, most of the time the public doesn't get to see those deals. A buddy and I got a table once. Before the doors opened the pros came around and snatched up anything they thought we had under priced.

Offline quatroclick

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2012, 05:32:00 PM »
I have found some nice deals at gun shows, but with rare exception, not great.  And at the dealers tables, forget it.  Rarely ever a good deal.  Most of the good deals are non-dealers.  I got several hundred 30 cal bullets for $25 not too long ago.  A few years back I got a really nice manlicher stocked 03-A3 sporter for $200 or $250.  Sometimes I walk out the door with nothing.

Offline mcwoodduck

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2012, 05:51:49 PM »
When I moved to Ca in 1995 and saw the ads for the Great Western in the LA fair grounds that took was in 5 or 6 different buildings.  Before the county super visors canceled all gun shows on county property it was great show, with everything you could think of from bb guns to armored cars and tanks.  If I could only have afforded the half track or the Bren carrier.
It was a great show to find parts and stuff to go with guns and to find collector rifles.
While looking at different used rifles they wanted what I was seeing in the stores for new.  and on Saturday no one was willing to deal.  After that I started dealing with a few local shops and most often found the rifles, shotguns and handguns I wanted for prices I was willing to pay.
When you look at the expense of the tables at the show the cost of ahow food and all I can see why they mark things up so much.  Now If I hit a show here in N Ca I usually am looking for a few things special like grips, stocks, mags, other parts or accessories, when I found some grips I liked that were more than if I ordered them from the website I passed. 
I did walk out with about $100 worth of stuff from silver coins to knives.  Always good to look.  I have the next one marked on the callendar and will walk in with a little more $.   
I did see quite a few AR uppers being sold, I did see a bunch of parts,knives, mags and a whole lot of ammo. 
There were a few people buying guns.  there was two or three tables doing the paper work and each had a line of three or four.
 

Offline Ex 49'er

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2012, 09:58:41 PM »
The real deals are on the evening when everyone sets up their tables. Savvy locals wander in when we are setting up on Friday afternoon/evening and the good stuff is stuffed back under the table until paperwork can be done on Saturday.
When you're walking on eggs; don't hop!!

Offline JPShelton

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Re: Stopped off at a large gun show
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2012, 03:43:09 AM »
The gun show I went to was a big one in Tulsa last November that is billed as the world's largest.  I found some incredible deals on blued steel and walnut stocked bolt action ceterfires.  And that was refreshing compared to the recent past, where it seemed like everything was "tacti-cool."  It was also timely becasue I was in the market for a new rifle, and still prefer old-school blued steel and walnut.  It didn't seem to me like much of it was moving, though.
 
I picked up an "N.I.B." condition Remington Model 721 in .270.  I almost passed because I'd rather have a .30-'06 but this isn't my first time at the .270 Rodeo, either, and you don't often get the chance to buy a brand spankin' new sixty year old anything, let alone a brand new condition sixty year old shooter. So I bought it.
 
The tagged price was $850.00.  High for a 721, I suppose, but this looked like a brand new rifle.  The seller said it belonged to a neighbor who had won it at some kind of company Christmas party way back when, stuffed it in a closet, and never used it.  A likely story from a gun show dealer guy, I know, but.......
 
I asked if it would be okay if I removed the bolt and had a look at the bore.  That was no problem, and the seller handed me a bore light without me having to whip mine out of my pocket.  I withdrew the bolt and was surprised that it came right out without having depressed the bolt release.  The bolt had traces of brownish, waxy stuff on it.  The rifling in the bore looked sharp, but....  Anyhow, I stuck the bolt back in and pulled it out again without having to hit the release button.  The bolt stop wasn't springing back in to place.  Hmmmmm....
 
I asked the seller if he could demonstrate how to release the bolt.  He asked me why I was asking, since I had already removed it twice.  I told him that I removed it without hitting the release.  He tried it, it did the same thing for him, and he put the bolt back in and set the rifle back down on the table, saying, "Well, I guess you aren't interested in a broken rifle, uh."
 
Well, no, not at $850.00, I wasn't.  I offered him $400.00 plus tax.  He countered with $425.00 plus tax.  I countered with $400.00 out the door.  This was fifteen minutes before the closing of the show, and I pointed out that he wasn't too likely to find a last minute buyer for it who would offer him that much.  So he took the $400.00 if I agreed to let him keep the box.  The box didn't mean anything to me, because I wasn't buying the rifle to keep in a box.  I was buying it with the full intent of using it, and it wouldn't be N.I.B. after I sent a couple of hundered rounds down the bore, anyhow.
 
When I got the rifle home, I took the barreled action out of the stock and cleaned the bore.  It had a bunch of brown, waxlike goop in it.  That same goop was all over the metal of the rifle.  It was preventing the spring from pushing the bolt stop up.  With the goop removed, the thing functions flawlessly.
 
It is one of the most accurate sporter-weight centerfire bolt actions I've ever shot.  I got it sighted in and carried it during the modern gun deer season.
 
I guess I got lucky with that deal.
 
But I saw a thing on an NRA website recenetly about the bolt action hunting rifle market being "soft" for new sales.  I got to thinking, too, about all of the people I used to hunt with.  Most of them were a lot older than I am -some by as much as 30 or 40 years.  Most hung up their hunting boots 20 years ago being too old and infirm to hunt.  But they kept their guns for their disinterested kids and widows to dispose of.  We had a big hunting camp going on -upwards of 30 guys sharing it.  Sounds like a crowd, but it bordered a National Forest on two sides with plenty of acrage for guys to spread out on.  I'm the last one of the group still alive except for my dad, who hasn't hunted for nearly 20 years now, and an uncle, who sold all of his guns recently.
 
The point is that just with the people that I knew, there are enough guns now in play in the used market to stock a pretty cool classic rifle shop.  These guys used their stuff but they used it with care and took care of it, for the most part.
 
I can't think that my situation is too different.  Maybe in modern day whitetail country, it seems alien, but I bet it doesn't in the mule deer and blacktail country of the western states.  If the story about my rifle is true, about the guy winning it as a door prize at a Christmas party, he's probably not the only fella who got a gun this way.  It didn't cost him anything, didn't take up a lot of space, so if he wanted to use it, he had it to use. 
 
I think a lot of this old-school stuff that I still like is going to hit the market like a flood for several reasons.  Supply and demand being what it is, my expectation is that stuff that seemed so outrageous 20 years ago is going to be dirt cheap when it hits the market in the coming years. 
 
There just isn't as much demand for that old school stuff as their used to be.  My local gun shop has a pre-64 Winchester for $650 that is in very good condition.  If it was an '06 and not a .300 Mag, it wouldn't still be in the shop but would be in my gun room instead.
 
The other thing at play, too, is that you can buy a new bolt action in a plastic stock so cheap nowadays that "some old gun with a wood stock" is viewed by many as just that when such wasn't the case during my formative years.
 
JP