deer hunting off an AR15 platform?

[martineta]

300 blackout shooting 125 gr Nos Ballistic tips.  Cases load into a standard .223 or 5.56 magazine.  The 125's are loaded to 2250 fps.  Deadly accurate, more wump than a 30/30.  Range up to 200 yds although I rarely shoot a deer past 80 yds or so from tree stands in the woods in VA.  Neat thing about the blackout is you can load them down to subsonic velocities shooting big old 220-240 grain Sierra Matchkings or Outlaw State bullets.  The heavy for caliber, (.308 diameter) bullets tumble and make jello out of a deers chest.  I use my subsonic loads with a sound suppressor.  The noise it makes is extremely quiet, about like a 22 cb short. I have yet to recover a bullet from a deer.  They always pass though the deer and end up in the ground somewhere.  The subsonics do have a rainbow trajectory so I limit my shots with the subsonics to 50 yds are so which is where 95% of my shooting takes place while hunting from a tree stand.  Kinda like bow hunting.

[SHOOTALL]

300 blackout shooting 125 gr Nos Ballistic tips.  Cases load into a standard .223 or 5.56 magazine.  The 125's are loaded to 2250 fps.  Deadly accurate, more wump than a 30/30.  Range up to 200 yds although I rarely shoot a deer past 80 yds or so from tree stands in the woods in VA.  Neat thing about the blackout is you can load them down to subsonic velocities shooting big old 220-240 grain Sierra Matchkings or Outlaw State bullets.  The heavy for caliber, (.308 diameter) bullets tumble and make jello out of a deers chest.  I use my subsonic loads with a sound suppressor.  The noise it makes is extremely quiet, about like a 22 cb short. I have yet to recover a bullet from a deer.  They always pass though the deer and end up in the ground somewhere.  The subsonics do have a rainbow trajectory so I limit my shots with the subsonics to 50 yds are so which is where 95% of my shooting takes place while hunting from a tree stand.  Kinda like bow hunting.

I don't understand how a 125 gr bullet going 2250 can have more "WHUMP " than a 30-30 loaded with 150 gr going 2512 ? When you use LVR powder this is a good load . At sub sonic loads 1050 or below there will be little if any expansion and that makes for a poor choice on deer if jacketed bullets are used. IMHO as for recovery no doubt as the pass thru like a FMJ.
I don't mean to tic you off but  and do believe your choice will kill deer with good shot placement. And although I have not used the 300 BO I have used both a 30-30 and 30 carbine to kill deer  with good results in Va. my home state. I have used a 6.8 spc for two years now but have not seen a deer I wanted to take . I had a 20 inch bull bbl and have now switched to a 16 inch bbl to reduce weight . Some say the 6.8 is a short 270 I don't agree its in the power range of the 30-30 at best. depending on bullet choice. The 6.8 is a good round but I won't make claims that can't be backed up .

[Dezynco]

I agree with Shootall.   The 300 BO (Whisper, Fireball, what in the world) is a "30-30 Light" with a slightly better ballistic coefficient.  The limitation of the old 30-30 is the flat nosed bullets that you must use if you buy factory ammo.  In a single shot rilfe or pistol like the Contender that limitation goes away.
The 300 Whisper is one of my favorite cartriges, and I've taken several deer with it, but it's limited by case capacity.  It sneaks up on the 30-30 in performance.  It essentially turns your AR15 into a semiautomatic 30-30, loaded on the light side.

[45-70.gov]

what does the 300bo have over the  30ar???


i am torn between 30ar....6.8.......but would look into 25wssm before  i chose

[Bugflipper]

45-70, here are a few AR cartridges with similar weight bullets. These are 16". If a fellow wanted a long barrel he could add 100 fps and be in the ballpark with most. The blackout and whisper probably would only give about 50 since they are about petered out in a 16. But just a guess I only have a 16" in the 300. These figures just came off the internet. I don't own many of the ones listed. The short answer is in deer rifle terms the 300 is close to a 7.62x39. The 30 AR is in between that and a 308. The 25 wssm is just about a twin to the 25-06.

300 Whisper 125gr at apx 2250fps
300 Blackout 125gr at apx 2300fps
7.62x39 123gr at apx 2350fps
7.62x40 Wilson Combat just a fuzz longer than the 300 Blackout ,556 case 125gr at apx 2350fps)
6.8 Rem 120gr at apx 2450fps
6.5 Grendel 123gr at apx 2500fps
30HRT 30 rimless Herret uses 6.8 cases trimmed and a 30 Herrett die-125gr at apx 2500fps
30 BR 6BR necked up to 30 cal 125gr at apx 2600fps
30 Rem AR shortened 284 case Rem ammo 125gr at apx 2600fps
300 OSSM WSSM necked up to 30 cal 125 at apx 2700fps
25 WSSM 120gr apx 2900fps

[Lloyd Smale]

the whisper is about in power to a 762x39 and both fall short of factory 3030s which are actually downloaded alot and can be improved on even more to leave both those others in the dust.

[45-70.gov]

6.5 WSSM


who makes an upper?
who makes ammo?


i only heard of one company making uppers in WSSM


how reliable are they??


cost of uppers and ammo?

[Bugflipper]

Sorry the 6.5 wssm was a typo. I meant to put 25. I am converting my 6.5 grendel into 6.5 wssm so I guess it was on my mind when typing. It is a ballistic twin to the 260 rem. A wildcat, no factory ammo. I modified the previous post to say 25 wssm.


This fellow offers wildcats and standards off the 243 and 25 wssm.
http://www.dtechuppers.com/ar-15-wssm-upper-receivers.html

[SHOOTALL]

what does the 300bo have over the  30ar???


i am torn between 30ar....6.8.......but would look into 25wssm before  i chose

I have the 6.8 not the 30 AR . When I got mine it was considered the better at close range with the 6.5 having a edge at longer range. If I were getting it today I would go 30 AR maybe , It would depend on aval. of ammo and componets like brass. So far I like the 6.8 and would not trade it or consider switching it to a 30 AR for hunting. One consideration is if same bullet weight is compared then the 6.8 should be a longer bullet and go deeper in a critter thru.one etc  but it can't be but so much.
here we go again 3006 vs. 270 

[45-70.gov]

here we go again 3006 vs. 270     



say  its not true
because we all know the 3006 is more versitile

[45-70.gov]

i have a bad feeling this tread will cost me some money


http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/18647/30-rem-ar/

[SHOOTALL]

here we go again 3006 vs. 270     



say  its not true
because we all know the 3006 is more versitile

Look ! don't cloud the issue with facts ! 

[Lloyd Smale]

Ive got a 762x39 and the only advantage it has over the 6.8 is the ability to like i said shoot cheap wolf ammo and not have to pick up brass. It, the 30rem and the 300 whisper are all real close and what one will do so will the other with some handloading. In my opinion if you can find ammo and brass the best of the bunch for a hunting rifle is the 6.8.

[SHOOTALL]

Ive got a 762x39 and the only advantage it has over the 6.8 is the ability to like i said shoot cheap wolf ammo and not have to pick up brass. It, the 30rem and the 300 whisper are all real close and what one will do so will the other with some handloading. In my opinion if you can find ammo and brass the best of the bunch for a hunting rifle is the 6.8.

I would agree except there are soooo manny more bullet options for 30 cal.
Is the buzz about the bolt giving problems with the 7.62X39 true or just bull ?

[Lloyd Smale]

mines probably got 5k through it with no trouble. Mixed handloads and wolf black box. I asked bushmaster about it and they said they allready had addressed the problem when they had to bolts made. I dont know if they were telling the truth or not though. Mine has been trouble free though and is very accurate. You hit the nail on the head with the 762x39 though. bullet selection is probably even more limited then the 6.8 but theres allways the vmax and its worked well for me. Its a tack driver in my gun and has taken a couple deer and worked well on them.

[SHOOTALL]

Yea I wouldn't trade away my 6.8 but do wish there were more bullets aval. Mine likes the Hornady now that they will chamber  ( had a burr in the neck area of the chamber. It would chamber rem fact loads but not Hornady most of the time. Some 1200 grit on a wooden dowel fixed it).

[martineta]

300 blackout shooting 125 gr Nos Ballistic tips.  Cases load into a standard .223 or 5.56 magazine.  The 125's are loaded to 2250 fps.  Deadly accurate, more wump than a 30/30.  Range up to 200 yds although I rarely shoot a deer past 80 yds or so from tree stands in the woods in VA.  Neat thing about the blackout is you can load them down to subsonic velocities shooting big old 220-240 grain Sierra Matchkings or Outlaw State bullets.  The heavy for caliber, (.308 diameter) bullets tumble and make jello out of a deers chest.  I use my subsonic loads with a sound suppressor.  The noise it makes is extremely quiet, about like a 22 cb short. I have yet to recover a bullet from a deer.  They always pass though the deer and end up in the ground somewhere.  The subsonics do have a rainbow trajectory so I limit my shots with the subsonics to 50 yds are so which is where 95% of my shooting takes place while hunting from a tree stand.  Kinda like bow hunting.

I don't understand how a 125 gr bullet going 2250 can have more "WHUMP " than a 30-30 loaded with 150 gr going 2512 ? When you use LVR powder this is a good load . At sub sonic loads 1050 or below there will be little if any expansion and that makes for a poor choice on deer if jacketed bullets are used. IMHO as for recovery no doubt as the pass thru like a FMJ.
I don't mean to tic you off but  and do believe your choice will kill deer with good shot placement. And although I have not used the 300 BO I have used both a 30-30 and 30 carbine to kill deer  with good results in Va. my home state. I have used a 6.8 spc for two years now but have not seen a deer I wanted to take . I had a 20 inch bull bbl and have now switched to a 16 inch bbl to reduce weight . Some say the 6.8 is a short 270 I don't agree its in the power range of the 30-30 at best. depending on bullet choice. The 6.8 is a good round but I won't make claims that can't be backed up .

I thought we were talking about AR platforms.  By the way, checkout outlaw state bullets.  They are a small custom bullet maker in Missouri that makes pricey bullets that expand at subsonic speed.  Great for hunting but $1.25 each. Ouch!  They also make the same bullet weight that doesn't expand at slow speeds for $33 per 100 for sight in. They have turned every deer's chest I ever shot into jello. Remington is now offering an expanding subsonic 300 blackout load.  I have not tried it yet since I reload.  The 300 Blackout is just one of dozens of rifles I own. It has it's limitations but does a great job for how I use it.  I just flat love the cool factor of shooting deer with a suppressor in suburban neighborhoods and not a soul other that the landowner knows what I am doing.
Anybody have any luck suppressing a 6.8 yet?  I did have one of my .308 winchesters threaded and worked up some subsonic loads for it also. I wish I never had got bitten by the suppressor bug.  Its an expensive hobby.
 

[SHOOTALL]

not sure about the 6.8 but one thing is sure with more case capacity it can be driven faster when quiet is not the goal.
 

[45-70.gov]

no  more classic a deer round than a 30-30


30 rem ar  is the closest thing mentioned to a 30-30


i wonder   what a 170 grain would do in this round?

[patw]

I don't think the cartridge matters as much as the person behind the trigger.  If someone knows they can make a clean kill  with a certain round, and then does, what else matters?  How dead do you want a deer?

I hunted with a 300-221 loaded to around 1900 fps with a 125BT and it did the job on the Texas white tails and axis deer.  I have been playing with that same round with a 1/8 barrel for suppressed subsonic, but have not used it in the field yet. In any case I think Martinetta  went over that round better than I could.

I then used a 6.8, no problems there either.  This pig dropped in its tracks with one shot.

Here is the link to a video of  two pigs with one shot from the 6.8.  The back pig dropped, the front one ran about 10 yards and was dead under that bush when I got there.

A couple of years ago some friends and I went hunting in the Texas hill country and besides the 6.8 we were also using the 7.62x40 and a .25x40.  Those last two cartridges were developed by Kurt B. right here in SW Louisiana.  The 7.62x40 was later renamed Wilson Tactical by the Wilson team, but this thread will show that Kurt was posting about it back in 2008, and I want to point out that Kurt deserves the credit for the cartridge.  On that link, if you go to Kurt's post of 10/13/2010, there are some pictures of the results of shots from those calibers.  Both of those wildcats were impressive in their killing ability.

Finally, although I have never hunted with a .223, a friend of mine got a single shot 223 for his daughter, and so far she has killed everything she has drawn a bead on.  Here are a couple of videos he took.  She was shooting 70 grain bullets.  While I personally don't feel comfortable shooting deer with a 223, it is hard to argue with the results.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Skky-pIjYVo&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjgNxb-UuvI&feature=youtu.be

[WNY_Whitetailer]

the 223 is not legal in Va. to hunt deer. I tried the 6.8 SPC . I guess the M-4 style gun works ok if componets are picked to be light . If you grew up with lever or bolt guns the masg hanging down gets in the way . Guess it takes a few seasons to get it down pat.

Get a 5 or 10 round mag...Only hang about an inch below the magwell...Not obtrusive at all.

[WNY_Whitetailer]

no  more classic a deer round than a 30-30


30 rem ar  is the closest thing mentioned to a 30-30


i wonder   what a 170 grain would do in this round?

The 30 Rem AR seems to be a good round...Too bad it seems as if Remington is not really supporting it too much.  The factory available ammo is scarce.  Unless things change, it appears as if the 30 Rem AR is doomed...The 6.8 has a ton more factory ammo available making it a far better choice...YMMV.

[Lloyd Smale]

personaly if i was looking at buying an ar for a dedicated hunting gun and wasnt worried about ammo availability or stockpiling lots for self defense id look hard at picking up a 25wsm. It gives near 257 roberts plus p power in an ar. to me its hands down better then any of the other rounds for hunting deer sized game.

[SHOOTALL]

the 223 is not legal in Va. to hunt deer. I tried the 6.8 SPC . I guess the M-4 style gun works ok if componets are picked to be light . If you grew up with lever or bolt guns the masg hanging down gets in the way . Guess it takes a few seasons to get it down pat.

Get a 5 or 10 round mag...Only hang about an inch below the magwell...Not obtrusive at all.

Got the short mag.

[gun junky]

Hi Lloyd , What mags do you use in your 7.62x39 ar. I have contemplated this cal. for a while. Thanks gun junky

[Lloyd Smale]

what ive found to be best is c products mags with the springs replaced by wolf extra power ak47 springs. thats the main trick to getting a 762x39 ar to run at a 100 percent reliability

[gun junky]

Thanks for the info on the mags. I am waiting a bit to see what happens with all of these other calibers but im with you on the 7.62x39 being plentiful and cheap to shoot plus its a decent cal. to hunt with inside 150 yds. Thanks again . gun junky

[jasonprox700]

I've been using my DPMS AP4 in .308 for a couple of years now for deer hunting.  I swapped out the handguard for a carbon fiber and had Adco turn down the barrel.  With a scope, I'm looking at 8.75 pounds.  It hits with authority, carries it's energy farther than the other rounds mentioned, ammo can be found anywhere, and it's easy to carry in the woods with its 16" barrel. 

Otherwise, you could go with the 6.5 or 6.8.  My nod goes with the 6.5 due to the superior ballistics and wider variety of bullets.  You could also go with the .458 SOCOM if you plan on shooting under 200 yards.  Wilson Combat is now making reasonably priced uppers (if you choose to build it rather than buy complete). 

The WSSM's are great also.  I have .243 WSSM upper that is a real hot rod.  I'm planning on loading some of the 95gr Accubonds for a deer load (hopefully wolves too once we get a season! ).  The only downside with the WSSM's is that Oly Arms and Dtech are the only two companies making them, so you are somewhat limited.